Experiencing ghosting with OLED?

[jorimt]

Do you think returning the monitor and getting the asus will resolve my issues?

If your issue is the white trailing, then yes. If not, then no; it has the same panel and refresh rate, hence the same physical MPRT and stroboscopic levels of blur.

[welcomess]

Do you think returning the monitor and getting the asus will resolve my issues?

If your issue is the white trailing, then yes. If not, then no; it has the same panel and refresh rate, hence the same physical MPRT and stroboscopic levels of blur.

I’m not fully sure if it is white trailing ghosting I am experiencing, it just seems blurry and ghosting overall. I know the videos I posted aren’t the best quality, I did try my best to capture the blurriness but it seems it doesn’t translate to a video.

[jorimt]

I’m not fully sure if it is white trailing ghosting I am experiencing, it just seems blurry and ghosting overall. I know the videos I posted aren’t the best quality, I did try my best to capture the blurriness but it seems it doesn’t translate to a video.

We're going in circles now, so all I can say to this part of your original point:

The weird phenomenon not sure if anyone has also encountered this but it seems whenever a game I play has a game update IE new season or new patch my game runs silky smooth and I see no ghosting at all but as soon as I reboot the game its back to the unsmooth gameplay linked above.

No amount of monitor swaps will fix what you're describing.

[welcomess]

I’m not fully sure if it is white trailing ghosting I am experiencing, it just seems blurry and ghosting overall. I know the videos I posted aren’t the best quality, I did try my best to capture the blurriness but it seems it doesn’t translate to a video.

We're going in circles at this point, so all I can say to this part of your original point:

The weird phenomenon not sure if anyone has also encountered this but it seems whenever a game I play has a game update IE new season or new patch my game runs silky smooth and I see no ghosting at all but as soon as I reboot the game its back to the unsmooth gameplay linked above.

No amount of monitor model swaps or monitor settings adjustments will fix what you're describing.

I understand fully what you're saying, apologies. It is just nice to speak to someone who understands the technology and could alleviate the issues. Do you recommend gsync on or off for more clarity, specifically on the OLED panel. Seen threads online stating they turned gsync off as the old is "fast enough" etc. Any tips?

[jorimt]

Do you recommend gsync on or off for more clarity, specifically on the OLED panel. Seen threads online stating they turned gsync off as the old is "fast enough" etc. Any tips?

G-SYNC does not directly affect motion clarify, it prevents tearing for framerates within the refresh rate without introducing traditional V-SYNC latency or stutter.

The higher the refresh rate, the less noticeable tearing artifacts become, regardless of achievable framerate, so if you aren't noticing tearing artifacts with G-SYNC off + V-SYNC off at 240Hz, G-SYNC won't do much for you. If you are, see below for optimal settings:
https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101- ... ttings/14/

[Chief Blur Buster]

What happened is that OLED is overrated for gaming. What you need is a monitor that is well known for fps gaming.

ALERT ABOUT ESPORTS OF THE FUTURE, 2025-2030

OLED is not overrated for gaming, full stop. But there is a canary in coal mine involved.

The desktop OLED bullet train is doubling refresh rates 240->480Hz in barely above 1 year, unlike LCDs that took 7 years to double 120->240Hz (ACER VG236H / Samsung 2233RZ in 2009, leading up to AOC AG251FZ first 240Hz in 2016). A bunch of 480 Hz OLEDs are going to be shown off at CES 2024.

It is anticipated that 1000Hz OLEDs will be on the market well before year 2030.

With the OLED refresh rates on an upwards bullet train journey this decade after a long time -- OLED is coming to esports big-time later this decade, too. LCD took 2009-2016 to double in refresh rate (120->240), but OLED is taking only 1 year to double in refresh rate (240->480).

I remember when the first 240Hz LCD monitors were laggier than the best 144Hz LCDs, and in some ways, the same problem is happening with OLEDs. However, some of the better 240Hz OLEDs now outperform many 240Hz LCDs in latency too. And there are now upcoming OLEDs with much less lag than 240Hz LCDs too. Prototype 480Hz OLED displays (sitting at manufacturer labs) are already visiting TestUFO website as we speak. OLED displays will also become increasingly brighter too at the same time, solving some of those complaints.

Forum members, you've been taken notice, that I'm not going to let anyone "Captian" any threads on LCD vs OLED debate on Blur Busters Forums. OLEDs aren't yet as good as LCDs for some esports, but this won't be the trend for much longer, given the really-fast-departing desktop OLED bullet train journey that merely only started in 2023. Information on hand shows a very rapid OLED overtake (So fast, that even BenQ/Zowie is expected to jump on the OLED bandwagon too before the end of the decade).

Pay attention to the OLED bullet train before crossing the railroad tracks!

</Canary-In-Coal-Mine>

[Chief Blur Buster]

I was really thinking OLED would be the absolute cure to my issues I've been having over the past few years but it hasn't solved it. I've upgraded my computer since back in the day when I had this issue on my old monitor (Asus pg258q) thinking it could be hardware but I'm not sure it is. The weird phenomenon not sure if anyone has also encountered this but it seems whenever a game I play has a game update IE new season or new patch my game runs silky smooth and I see no ghosting at all but as soon as I reboot the game its back to the unsmooth gameplay linked above. Any settings at all or recommendations will be very much appreciated and if a fix or make it ANY BETTER can be found I will be eternally grateful for you and in debt to you

Let me attempt to have a crack at this topic.

I have an intimate familiarity with this topic, given that 75%+ of my income in 2023 was on OLED research, and I can be a more confident authority in understanding why people observe certain things with OLEDs. So It's totally understandable confusion and I'm pretty happy to help with this matter. I will improve the rising tide of Internet knowledge by writing more articles on this matter during 2024, but for now:

Firstly, let's cut to the chase: Retina refresh rate isn't till well beyond 1000fps 1000Hz

And yes, you need both frame rate and refresh rate to be in quadruple digit territory to brute-out a lot of motion artifacts you are seeing today. Retina refresh rate for desktop monitors is not until >1000Hz. So, you ARE going to see refresh rate limitations for a long time.


Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, you're not going to fix "differences between displays and real life" at contemporary three-digit refresh rates. People who are sensitive to stroboscopics/etc (calling it "ghosting") will need to enable GPU Motion Blur Effect (add blur to fix this) or wait for quadruple digit refresh rates...

Next, Ghosting Confusion is Common

There are many different accidental descriptions of what people say as "ghosting". Displays behave differently whether you're fixing eyes or moving eyes:
- Stationary eye, stationary object,
- Stationary eye, moving object,
- Moving eyes, stationary object,
- Moving eyes, moving object.

Usual Terminology of Ghosting: Ghosting = Asymmetric Motion Blur

Here's some observations that I need to give you a heads up with:
- At Blur Busters, the terminology "ghosting" is considered asymmetric motion blur, as follows.
Observe the yellow blurs more towards left than towards right. Basically a "longer trailing motion blur" effect, is considered ghosting because ghost is like a vision of the past, ala spooky ghosts (RIP, Halloween, 1800s), which is why we call it "ghosting", an afterimage of the past that lags BEHIND the motion. So ghosting is only used to define asymmetric motion blur, where the past image is still visible.

This is probably not what you are seeing, although early firmwares on certain OLEDs do exhibit similar ghosting artifacts (streaking in dark backgrounds) due to OLED quirks and OLED overdrive (yes, some OLED also use overdrive algorithms too, although much more lightly than LCDs do). It's just at an order of magnitude smaller than LCDs generally.

Disambiguation Time...

• 1. Stutter Amplification of Fast Pixel Response
  
  Some people confuse ghosting with stutter, so I mention this...
  OLEDs stop stuttering at 75fps+, while LCDs stop stuttering at 50fps+
  This is because LCD GtG was so slow, that the GtG blurring/ghosting "hid" stutters. OLED pixel response is so freakingly fast, that you will see smaller stutters at higher frame rates more easily. So you need more frame rate for your higher-quality faster-responding display. This phenomenon is described at:
  EXPLAINER: Why Do OLEDs Stutter More At Low Frame Rates?
  FIX: Increase your OLED Frame Rates To Compensate
  
  .
• 2. Stroboscopics Confusion Factor
  
  Some people confuse ghosting with stroboscopic / phantom arrays, so I mention this too...
  Jorim already told you about this, and this is just the "mouse arrow" factor, and already explained in lovely images at The Stroboscopic Effect of Finite Frame Rates
  FIX: Turn on GPU Motion Blur Effect in Your Games
  
  .
• 3. Persistence Motion Blur
  
  Some people confuse persistence motion blur (symmetric motion blur) with ghosting, so I mention this too.
  This is simply an artifact of pixel visibility time, which can only be fixed by good strobing or more frame rate. These are two valid approaches to reducing display motion blur; as illustrated by these two diagrams:
  
  
  
  
  
  FIX: Get as much frame rate as possible on an OLED. Or if your display has BFI/strobe, turn on strobing at shorter pulse widths. LCDs such as ViewSonic XG2431 via Blur Busters Strobe Utility can do an excellent job at strobing, but this will never fix stroboscopic effects -- that requires more framerate and/or GPU blur effect to be added.

Remember, ghosting confusion is pretty common, and sometimes you will see ghosting only with moving eyes, and other times, only with stationary eyes.

-> If you only see "what you think is ghosting" while your eyes are moving, it MIGHT be item 3.
-> If you only see "what you think is ghosting" while your eyes are stationbary, it MIGHT be item 2.

Hope this helps you remedy your vision sensitivity!

It's part of my 2024 speciality to educate/mythbust on these types of matters now, on these big rabbit holes.

[jetcat3]

Optimum with new results from the LG 27GR95QE at 0.4% average overshoot compared to 5.0% average overshoot he measured 10 months ago. https://youtu.be/iNIN9ud9PZU?si=PMh0RYeb3yAUDCwy