Blur Busters Forums

Who you gonna call? The Blur Busters! For Everything Better Than 60Hz™ Skip to content

[Thread Superseded] G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Talk about NVIDIA G-SYNC, a variable refresh rate (VRR) technology. G-SYNC eliminates stutters, tearing, and reduces input lag.

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby MT_ » 17 Feb 2017, 11:39

RealNC wrote:
MT_ wrote:Setting that at 57± fps and then while in-game testing, enabling RTSS in game reducing FPS to 55 to override that internal fps cap does not introduce any additional input lag.

You only get that with vsync. With gsync there shouldn't be any added latency.


Ah. But I read that RTSS might add an additional frame of input latency a few posts back with G-sync, with that youtube user.

Unless this already got debunked somehow?
MT_
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 17 Jan 2017, 15:39

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby jorimt » 17 Feb 2017, 13:12

Haven't had a chance to re-test it yet. As soon as I can, I will. I added a disclaimer in my OP in the meantime. It's very possible that RTSS is adding 1 frame of input latency with G-Sync in most instances.

It's also very possible I wasn't getting additional latency with G-Sync + RTSS because I had the quirky Multicore Rendering option disabled (Source engine is a native single core performer) in CS:GO. Unlike the Nvidia Inspector limiter, RTSS limits fps on the CPU side, so the input latency RTSS introduces could vary from game to game, depending on how the game uses the CPU. What I know for sure, is that RTSS does add up to 1 frame of input latency with standalone v-sync.
Blur Busters Contributor - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter!
User avatar
jorimt
 
Posts: 305
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby MT_ » 17 Feb 2017, 14:54

Alright, thanks for the clarification!

Edit: I retract my earlier statement in stating I do not feel a difference in my game (MWO)

After having played a while with RTSS, going back to internal cap has definitely improved my 'laser' tracking ability and the response time in the 'free look' in my cockpit is noticeable faster responding (almost equal to physically moving mouse)

After running a few test laps which require high precision on target for a duration I can say with full certainty RTSS adds non-subjective delay. I guess the best I can describe it as it feels like putting pre-rendered frames higher than 1, but isn't as disastrous as running ordinary V-sync only. That one frame delay IS disastrous for my aiming though (on a competitive level), never realised it had such an impact. I very much doubt this will be of any concern with more casual games.

Sadly if this is true for most games, it means that there is no possibility for absolute minimum input latency for games that have no internal frame limiter? I found a D3D9 injector (d3d antilag) but im unsure how that would behave with G-sync.
MT_
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 17 Jan 2017, 15:39

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby vorob » 19 Feb 2017, 17:40

Finally captured some real gameplay. Happens from time to time in Dishonored 2 while game is around 30 FPS:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51vBAL2eJEc
vorob
 
Posts: 8
Joined: 05 Feb 2017, 18:06

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby Bouttime » 20 Feb 2017, 15:17

Well I found what was causing World of Tanks to stutter (especially when V-Sync was disabled). I figured it was more to do with the laptop rather than the game after discovering the Nvidia pendulum test. The movement of the pendulum was not smooth regardless of what was set.

So I did a little more reading and read a few posts from people reporting that Sonic Studio was causing stuttering in their games on Asus ROG G752 laptops. I was going to uninstall Sonic Studio as they had but found that it is apparently packaged with the realtek driver (for compatible hardware). I've recently been having issues with crackling in my headset and the speakers popping which also appears to be a known issue with the G752, so I downloaded the latest driver from the G752VT Support page and installed. First it removed my existing driver, rebooted the laptop and then installed the driver again.

Low and behold the crackling is gone and so far so has the stuttering. I have also just disabled v-sync in World of Tanks and there was no more stuttering as there was before! The FPS also were also no longer hovering between 50-60fps. It's much smoother!

So somehow the audio driver was causing issues with the graphics as others have already reported. WTF??? How can this be? :?
Bouttime
 
Posts: 11
Joined: 15 Jan 2017, 11:54

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby MT_ » 21 Feb 2017, 11:42

Bouttime wrote:Well I found what was causing World of Tanks to stutter (especially when V-Sync was disabled). I figured it was more to do with the laptop rather than the game after discovering the Nvidia pendulum test. The movement of the pendulum was not smooth regardless of what was set.

So I did a little more reading and read a few posts from people reporting that Sonic Studio was causing stuttering in their games on Asus ROG G752 laptops. I was going to uninstall Sonic Studio as they had but found that it is apparently packaged with the realtek driver (for compatible hardware). I've recently been having issues with crackling in my headset and the speakers popping which also appears to be a known issue with the G752, so I downloaded the latest driver from the G752VT Support page and installed. First it removed my existing driver, rebooted the laptop and then installed the driver again.

Low and behold the crackling is gone and so far so has the stuttering. I have also just disabled v-sync in World of Tanks and there was no more stuttering as there was before! The FPS also were also no longer hovering between 50-60fps. It's much smoother!

So somehow the audio driver was causing issues with the graphics as others have already reported. WTF??? How can this be? :?


Possible hardware conflict / Driver / DPC issue.

Check out LatencyMon, its a free tool and will show you which drivers behave badly. Audio popping is often caused by high DPC spikes caused by crappy drivers.
MT_
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 17 Jan 2017, 15:39

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby Bouttime » 21 Feb 2017, 12:43

Thanks...... I'd never heard of Latencymon so I'll give it a go next week when I'm home. But to be honest it was probably the realtek driver as the issue seems to have gone since updating it.
Thanks again.
Bouttime
 
Posts: 11
Joined: 15 Jan 2017, 11:54

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby MT_ » 26 Feb 2017, 12:26

So I finally found two 'ideal' scenarios for my game MWO.

Both in exclusive full-screen scenarios

- RTSS is excluded in any case as it adds input lag.
- The in-game frame cap can either limit to 58~ or 55~ (Curiously its unable to do anything in between lol)
- 55~ is necessary with V-sync on otherwise I get input lag fluctuations due to hitting the upper fps limit.
- 58~ can work, but with V-sync off to prevent random input lag occurances. Only downside is possibly less stable frametimes and a small tear band on the bottom of screen.

Both scenarios will give me absolute minimal latency throughout the whole game.

Sadly, with both being a viable option and since there is going to be no best of both worlds, I'll either take lower FPS and more stable frametimes, or higher fps without frametime compensation :-(

Guess that's the main drawback of a 60hz G-sync monitor.
MT_
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 17 Jan 2017, 15:39

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 26 Feb 2017, 14:30

55-58 frame cap for a 60hz GSYNC monitor is ideal for lowering lag, yes.
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter!
User avatar
Chief Blur Buster
Site Admin
 
Posts: 3321
Joined: 05 Dec 2013, 15:44

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby jorimt » 27 Feb 2017, 10:37

MT_ wrote:Guess that's the main drawback of a 60hz G-sync monitor.

Addressing the G-Sync ceiling at a 60Hz maximum is definitely trickier than at higher maximum refresh rates, especially at native 1080p with a capable system; you're going to be hitting/going over the ceiling much more often in this scenario, which means a framerate limit is almost always going to be necessary if you want to avoid v-sync behavior and additional input latency.

The lack of in-game fps limiters, and the apparent 1 frame latency RTSS adds, even with G-Sync (still have to confirm this myself), sometimes leaves you with no good option.

That said, I think I should make it clear that G-Sync + v-sync on + RTSS fps limit is still a superior experience when directly compared to standalone double buffer v-sync + fps limit (RTSS or otherwise).

In my original input latency tests, I didn't manage to get 60Hz results in, but native 60Hz scenarios will be included in my next line of upcoming tests.
Blur Busters Contributor - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter!
User avatar
jorimt
 
Posts: 305
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44

PreviousNext

Return to G-SYNC

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests