G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Talk about NVIDIA G-SYNC, a variable refresh rate (VRR) technology. G-SYNC eliminates stutters, tearing, and reduces input lag.

Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby jorimt » 06 Apr 2017, 22:29

lexlazootin wrote:This is what i used to test mouse1 +right.

http://i.imgur.com/SaiZ36z.png

http://www.mediafire.com/file/s7qslggml ... _flood.zip

https://youtu.be/HasevyKpm18?t=7s

Tons of fps and easy to measure.

Thanks for this @lexlazootin, I'll probably use this map in my upcoming tests.

RealNC wrote:Windows Store games aren't allowed to use exclusive fullscreen. So to counter DWM's latency, they added this borderless windowed mode that behaves like exclusive fullscreen but isn't.

Yup, I'm aware about Window Store games DX12 borderless window implementation.

I'd also test for the G-SYNC input latency difference between borderless and exclusive fullscreen in said games, but of course, they only have windowed and borderless options, so I'd have no control group to compare.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby RealNC » 06 Apr 2017, 23:02

jorimt wrote:Yup, I'm aware about Window Store games DX12 borderless window implementation.

I'd also test for the G-SYNC input latency difference between borderless and exclusive fullscreen in said games, but of course, they only have windowed and borderless options, so I'd have no control group to compare.

This new mode in DX12 disables DWM. So even though it's borderless, it behaves like exclusive when it comes to latency, but like windowed when you try and alt+tab. In fact, that makes it better than exclusive mode.

It's not limited to Windows Store games, btw. The Steam version of Rise of the Tomb Raider for example uses this mode when you select "exclusive" in the game and have DX12 enabled. If you have a keyboard with volume buttons, then raising or lowering the volume will make the Windows volume bar appear. Since DWM compositing is needed for that, DWM is temporarily activated and the volume bar appears. Once it fades out again, DWM is deactivated again. In true exclusive mode, the volume bar never appears.

This mode is also used for OpenGL and Vulkan games. At least on NVidia. When you select "borderless" in a modern GL or Vulkan game, the NVidia driver switches to this new mode.

In the games I've tried, the difference between DX12 and GL/Vulkan is:

DX12: "Exclusive" gets you borderless i-flip mode, "borderless" gets you old-style borderless. There's no true exclusive mode.

GL/Vulkan: "Exclusive" gets you true exlusive, "borderless" gets you borderless i-flip mode. There's no old-style borderless.

It's a bit confusing, but maybe it's just an nvidia thing.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby jorimt » 07 Apr 2017, 11:31

If that's the case, I should be able to test Doom and Rise of the Tomb Raider for G-SYNC borderless vs exclusive fullscreen then; I own both.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby vorob » 10 Apr 2017, 04:47

vorob wrote:Maybe at least here i could get some answers:

Code: Select all
Acer Predator G9-593
Intel Core i7-6700HQ (2.6Ghz/3.5Ghz) (https://goo.gl/dehk14)
Nvidia GeForce GTX 1070 (8Gb GDDR5) (https://goo.gl/z2aEFL)
15.6inch 1920x1080 (G-Sync) (IPS)
16Gb DDR4-2400 / PC4-19200 (2x ACR24D4S7S8MB-8)
Windows 10 x64
Nvidia driver - 378.49


So, sometimes, extremely rare, while i'm playing i'm getting these blackouts. Screen will just go black and then will turn on again. Happens faster then a second. I was playing Resident Evil 7 today and it happened once. Earlier i was playing Ghost Recon Closed Beta and it happened when i was using my drone.

So its totally random and rare, but still i worry.

I think is has smth to do with fps drops. Cause on resident evil 7 it happened when i enabled stream and my fps dropped from stable 40 to 32 and all around. After this i started having blinks from time to time. So i conducted a test:

I've installed quake ii and binded 2 keys: one will lock fps on 5 and another one on 90. And started changing them fast, and this summoned blinks:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOJGOxuCfWk

And additional issue, dunno if it somehow connected:

I’m using msi afterburner to overclock my gpu and assigned 2 keys for switching overlock profiles, default and overclocked.

And when g-sync is enabled I’m getting quick blackout when I switch profile. Nothing like this when g-sync if off. Take a look: https://youtu.be/kg_0kXi4U88

Made some further testing. Launched quake II and tried same thing with g-sync ON, nothing happened. Then i've lowered fps to 5 and switched OC profile once again, and this time i got same blackout thing.


Okay, finally, after 4 month with this laptop i solved this issue.

Cleaned everything via DDU and installed latest 381.65. No more blinks, even on clock switch.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby jorimt » 10 Apr 2017, 09:36

Good to hear it could be solved with a driver update.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby swarna » 13 Apr 2017, 15:40

Since I saw people talking about the Windows 10 DWM in here earlier I thought I should mention that it seems that the new Creator's update allows windowed applications to fully tear now if v-sync options are turned off in-game. And not just for DX12/Vulkan titles as mentioned before, but Overwatch with vsync off + g-sync off now tears in windowed mode.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby RealNC » 13 Apr 2017, 16:10

I've seen that too. Can't test it myself, since I'm keeping the "Creators Update" as far from my PC as possible for the time being, but I've read that enabling "Game Mode" will disable the DWM.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby swarna » 13 Apr 2017, 18:41

I tested with 60hz to be able see tears more easily and it seems to tear even without enabling game mode for the game and completely disabling game DVR. Seems like it's a system-wide change, or at least for both Overwatch and CS:GO. Super curious to know if it now has the same behaviour as g-sync on + vsync on in fullscreen exclusive mode.
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby MT_ » 15 Apr 2017, 12:01

swarna wrote:Since I saw people talking about the Windows 10 DWM in here earlier I thought I should mention that it seems that the new Creator's update allows windowed applications to fully tear now if v-sync options are turned off in-game. And not just for DX12/Vulkan titles as mentioned before, but Overwatch with vsync off + g-sync off now tears in windowed mode.


This is interesting. So basically like full-screen exclusive?

Doubt this will take me anywhere near Windows 10 though, I think ill avoid an experimental OS for at least until support runs out for W7 in 2020 :o
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Re: G-Sync 101 w/Chart (WIP)

Postby RealNC » 15 Apr 2017, 15:23

MT_ wrote:Doubt this will take me anywhere near Windows 10 though, I think ill avoid an experimental OS for at least until support runs out for W7 in 2020 :o

I'm using it and have the "Defer Feature Updates" enabled in Windows Update. This puts you on the stable channel of updates, and blocks all experimental stuff from being installed (like this "Creators Update"), and only gets me security updates. The feature updates will then only be delivered months down the line (about 4 or 5 months later), once they're stable. You need at least W10 Pro though for that option to be available...

Never had an issue yet :-)
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