5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

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kokkatc
Posts: 108
Joined: 23 Mar 2017, 13:49

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by kokkatc » 26 Jun 2022, 18:40

Loubie wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 03:02
Hey,
So a friend of mine told me that he went from a 5800x to a 12700k (he plays cs go, while I play valorant) and he told me the difference is night and day, and told me that there was insanely less input lag on his intel cpu, he switched rather recently and had a 5800x.
It's not that I do not believe him, but is this really true? I kind of want to try it out or even "upgrade" to intel if that's the case, anyone has heard about this?

edit: forgot to mention, we both had the same RAM (Crucial Ballistix Elite 3600, he was using DOCP when he had his AMD cpu while I played a bit for lower timings)
This is anecdotal at best and is in no way scientific. I have a 12700k and have had nothing but issues w/ alder lake. Mouse lag, inconsistency, in game desync. You're playing the lottery with an alder lake ddr4 build because ddr4 compatibility is absolutely broken right now. If you decide to switch to alder lake, make 100% sure the memory you use for your board is on the mobo's manufacturers memory qvl list, otherwise you're in for a world of hurt.

Food for thought... I just switched over to 5800x from a 12700k and this build is performing significantly better in regards to mouse responsiveness and accuracy w/ no in game desync. DPC latency is higher on Ryzen however, but that doesn't translate to any discernible differences in total latency.

Eonds
Posts: 262
Joined: 29 Oct 2020, 10:34

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by Eonds » 27 Jun 2022, 00:50

Boop wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 04:40
https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/A ... 4085vs4119

Maybe you'd get 10-20% FPS improvement but any input lag would be negligible. I think it's more likely he had something wrong with his Windows OS or something in his config causing the input lag.
That's incorrect. It's not about FPS. FPS isn't latency.

Eonds
Posts: 262
Joined: 29 Oct 2020, 10:34

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by Eonds » 27 Jun 2022, 01:13

kokkatc wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 18:40
Loubie wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 03:02
Hey,
So a friend of mine told me that he went from a 5800x to a 12700k (he plays cs go, while I play valorant) and he told me the difference is night and day, and told me that there was insanely less input lag on his intel cpu, he switched rather recently and had a 5800x.
It's not that I do not believe him, but is this really true? I kind of want to try it out or even "upgrade" to intel if that's the case, anyone has heard about this?

edit: forgot to mention, we both had the same RAM (Crucial Ballistix Elite 3600, he was using DOCP when he had his AMD cpu while I played a bit for lower timings)
This is anecdotal at best and is in no way scientific. I have a 12700k and have had nothing but issues w/ alder lake. Mouse lag, inconsistency, in game desync. You're playing the lottery with an alder lake ddr4 build because ddr4 compatibility is absolutely broken right now. If you decide to switch to alder lake, make 100% sure the memory you use for your board is on the mobo's manufacturers memory qvl list, otherwise you're in for a world of hurt.

Food for thought... I just switched over to 5800x from a 12700k and this build is performing significantly better in regards to mouse responsiveness and accuracy w/ no in game desync. DPC latency is higher on Ryzen however, but that doesn't translate to any discernible differences in total latency.
Here's the problem you are speaking as if you can for a fact provide evidence to back up the last part saying "but that doesn't translate to any discernible differences in total latency". More importantly 10th gen will be the last good CPU gen for a very long time for competitive gaming. At the end of the day if you aren't pushing the performance on each gen then you aren't really maximizing their capabilities. Most people can't even grasp what latency is nor how we perceive it and how it affects our performance. Hardware is incredibly complex and it's silly to pretend that even experienced users can speak firmly and concretely about it.

Shade7
Posts: 222
Joined: 25 May 2022, 18:44

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by Shade7 » 27 Jun 2022, 01:53

IDK about CS:GO, but for Valorant specifically, you will get much better FPS with AMD CPUs.

5600x/5800x/5900x/5950x generally get the highest/most stable FPS for Valorant.

ptuga
Posts: 44
Joined: 20 May 2020, 02:06

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by ptuga » 27 Jun 2022, 06:19

kokkatc wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 18:40
Loubie wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 03:02
Hey,
So a friend of mine told me that he went from a 5800x to a 12700k (he plays cs go, while I play valorant) and he told me the difference is night and day, and told me that there was insanely less input lag on his intel cpu, he switched rather recently and had a 5800x.
It's not that I do not believe him, but is this really true? I kind of want to try it out or even "upgrade" to intel if that's the case, anyone has heard about this?

edit: forgot to mention, we both had the same RAM (Crucial Ballistix Elite 3600, he was using DOCP when he had his AMD cpu while I played a bit for lower timings)
This is anecdotal at best and is in no way scientific. I have a 12700k and have had nothing but issues w/ alder lake. Mouse lag, inconsistency, in game desync. You're playing the lottery with an alder lake ddr4 build because ddr4 compatibility is absolutely broken right now. If you decide to switch to alder lake, make 100% sure the memory you use for your board is on the mobo's manufacturers memory qvl list, otherwise you're in for a world of hurt.

Food for thought... I just switched over to 5800x from a 12700k and this build is performing significantly better in regards to mouse responsiveness and accuracy w/ no in game desync. DPC latency is higher on Ryzen however, but that doesn't translate to any discernible differences in total latency.
Alder lake is a new platform, there can be more issues ofc. Especially with early bios. But the only manufacturer with ddr4 compatibility issues is gigabyte. I have tuned ram on a few platforms by now, and alder lake can run the thightest sub timmings of any platform.
QVL only matters if you're running XMP, which you shouldn't anyway.
DDR5 on the other hand is much worse, much harder to get stable from what i've seen. But with the right mobo, memory kit and tune can be significantly better than ddr4.,

DPRTMELR
Posts: 165
Joined: 12 Apr 2022, 13:42

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by DPRTMELR » 27 Jun 2022, 08:11

So I have this bias of not being able to amd seriously for gaming (i got 1700x 3700x 5800x in various system just chilling because reasons, tbh I never ram on amd beyond xmp, then voltages) because every generation fanboys claim there's no discernable latency for gaming compared to intel, but they all have to buy the new generation that came out which managed to solve the non existing latency issue. this has been a pattern since ryzen release. (sorry if BS hate message like this is not allowed)

anyway I have issues that let's me feel it when the windows update have flipped my audio settings from 44.1 to 48 or whenever FSO box gets unchcked once a while, or if i forget to run timer resolutions etc. (I probably can't tell the two apart in a blind test but I can tell somethings off from yesterday)

and I would honestly disregard every advice given to you online until you get a chance to comapre them yourself. remember that 3kliksphilip video about whether 64tick or 128tick makes a difference or not? apparently most people can't even tell THAT apart. or if you do get a secondary intel system you should do it strictly for fun and not overspend the money you don't have. (about 64 vs 128: you get about two "moments" of more mouse adjustments before you lose control of your character after being prefire peeked on)

I think ultimate 4threaded gaming system right now would be something like binned 10900k and b die rams running like 4800mhz. 12th gen looks promising according to benchmarks but it doesn't seem all that desireable for me with all the platform issues.

Keep it mind people hate being the loser that are stuck with the wrong choices, people's opinions are gonna be biased based on their latest purchases and the difference may not make the time/money spent worth it at all.

like if s1mple can put people down after getting readjusted to sponsored mouse/keyboard/headsets and using amd systems ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Most adults need 7-8 hours of sleep each night. - US FDA

kokkatc
Posts: 108
Joined: 23 Mar 2017, 13:49

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by kokkatc » 27 Jun 2022, 10:57

ptuga wrote:
27 Jun 2022, 06:19
kokkatc wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 18:40
Loubie wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 03:02
Hey,
So a friend of mine told me that he went from a 5800x to a 12700k (he plays cs go, while I play valorant) and he told me the difference is night and day, and told me that there was insanely less input lag on his intel cpu, he switched rather recently and had a 5800x.
It's not that I do not believe him, but is this really true? I kind of want to try it out or even "upgrade" to intel if that's the case, anyone has heard about this?

edit: forgot to mention, we both had the same RAM (Crucial Ballistix Elite 3600, he was using DOCP when he had his AMD cpu while I played a bit for lower timings)
This is anecdotal at best and is in no way scientific. I have a 12700k and have had nothing but issues w/ alder lake. Mouse lag, inconsistency, in game desync. You're playing the lottery with an alder lake ddr4 build because ddr4 compatibility is absolutely broken right now. If you decide to switch to alder lake, make 100% sure the memory you use for your board is on the mobo's manufacturers memory qvl list, otherwise you're in for a world of hurt.

Food for thought... I just switched over to 5800x from a 12700k and this build is performing significantly better in regards to mouse responsiveness and accuracy w/ no in game desync. DPC latency is higher on Ryzen however, but that doesn't translate to any discernible differences in total latency.
Alder lake is a new platform, there can be more issues ofc. Especially with early bios. But the only manufacturer with ddr4 compatibility issues is gigabyte. I have tuned ram on a few platforms by now, and alder lake can run the thightest sub timmings of any platform.
QVL only matters if you're running XMP, which you shouldn't anyway.
DDR5 on the other hand is much worse, much harder to get stable from what i've seen. But with the right mobo, memory kit and tune can be significantly better than ddr4.,
This isn't entirely true. Asus has known DDR4 compatibility issues as well. I know this from personal experience. I have already been on 3 different motherboards for Alder Lake. Gigabyte, Asus and MSI. MSI should be the only motherboard brand you buy for Alder Lake if running DDR4. The rest, DDR4 compatibility is an issue.

Boop
Posts: 134
Joined: 08 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by Boop » 27 Jun 2022, 11:31

Eonds wrote:
27 Jun 2022, 00:50
Boop wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 04:40
https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/A ... 4085vs4119

Maybe you'd get 10-20% FPS improvement but any input lag would be negligible. I think it's more likely he had something wrong with his Windows OS or something in his config causing the input lag.
That's incorrect. It's not about FPS. FPS isn't latency.
1000fps = 1ms
500fps = 2ms

Higher FPS changes your overall system latency. If you're talking about comparing CPU A to CPU B with a framerate cap then I can see your point.

Slender
Posts: 573
Joined: 25 Jan 2020, 17:55

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by Slender » 27 Jun 2022, 12:09

Boop wrote:
27 Jun 2022, 11:31
Eonds wrote:
27 Jun 2022, 00:50
Boop wrote:
26 Jun 2022, 04:40
https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/A ... 4085vs4119

Maybe you'd get 10-20% FPS improvement but any input lag would be negligible. I think it's more likely he had something wrong with his Windows OS or something in his config causing the input lag.
That's incorrect. It's not about FPS. FPS isn't latency.
1000fps = 1ms
500fps = 2ms

Higher FPS changes your overall system latency. If you're talking about comparing CPU A to CPU B with a framerate cap then I can see your point.
5800x have best core to core latency >20ns
12700k <35ns
and amd have integrated usb controller, better then intel with usb chipset

Boop
Posts: 134
Joined: 08 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: 5800x vs 12700K competitive fps player

Post by Boop » 27 Jun 2022, 16:34

The OP mentioned CS:GO and Valorant as a real world example. Does anyone have a direct latency comparison between AMD and Intel with the same FPS cap in an eSports title?

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