Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

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Vocaleyes
Posts: 287
Joined: 09 Nov 2021, 18:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Vocaleyes » 28 Jan 2023, 21:40

nags92 wrote:
23 Jan 2023, 06:20
Vocaleyes wrote:
08 Jan 2023, 06:37
I’d like to chime in.

I run 8k in the usb 2.0 slot. 99% of games run it fine.

There is the issue of having discord running minimised which affects certain games like overwatch, but once FULLY terminated is resolved.

Am currently playing ffxiv, and it’s butter at 8k from the 2.0.
If you find a fix for the discord issue please let me know. It's been driving me mad, i was able to play Apex + CSGO at 8k with no stutter until the last week or so. :x
After working with their support and having the issue elevated, the conclusion was “not currently compatible”.
I guess it’s just one of those things they’ll get to when the new standard is 8k polling.

Until then, I don’t launch discord anymore with certain games. Nothing else has worked for me with my currents config and options.

nags92
Posts: 2
Joined: 23 Jan 2023, 06:19

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by nags92 » 01 Feb 2023, 10:15

Vocaleyes wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 21:40
nags92 wrote:
23 Jan 2023, 06:20
Vocaleyes wrote:
08 Jan 2023, 06:37
I’d like to chime in.

I run 8k in the usb 2.0 slot. 99% of games run it fine.

There is the issue of having discord running minimised which affects certain games like overwatch, but once FULLY terminated is resolved.

Am currently playing ffxiv, and it’s butter at 8k from the 2.0.
If you find a fix for the discord issue please let me know. It's been driving me mad, i was able to play Apex + CSGO at 8k with no stutter until the last week or so. :x
After working with their support and having the issue elevated, the conclusion was “not currently compatible”.
I guess it’s just one of those things they’ll get to when the new standard is 8k polling.

Until then, I don’t launch discord anymore with certain games. Nothing else has worked for me with my currents config and options.
What doesn't seem to make sense is that this was working perfectly fine about a month ago, it's only been in the last few weeks this issue has popped up for me, i've also raised a ticket and it's been escalated.

I've tried cleaning the install of discord and razer drivers with no dice.

The "not currently compatible" in my opinion is just being lazy, whatever discord is doing whilst minimized is the cause here, either making hooks to the game for capture or something along those lines when the user has not actively specified for it to start streaming on the client.

Vocaleyes
Posts: 287
Joined: 09 Nov 2021, 18:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Vocaleyes » 02 Feb 2023, 07:10

I would be inclined to believe this is an issue with gpu memory, I remember seeing something with nvidia gpus debugging mode being improperly activate/ utilised, it’s possible that issue wasn’t resolved.

Would be Curious to know whether this is an issue with amds too.

Vocaleyes
Posts: 287
Joined: 09 Nov 2021, 18:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Vocaleyes » 02 Feb 2023, 07:59

Something to report further.

Last night before I logged off I noticed a w11 release preview update, which is pretty frequent on the dev channel so nothing out of the blue. As usual I install and then update while shutting down.

This morning when I logged in, I had noticed something that doesn’t usually happen after one of these updates, which is the mouse speed in windows was reset.

Usually after an update windows retains the previously selected setting, for me it’s 3/11. But as I said, was now reset to the 6/11 position.

After putting it back on 3/11 however, I then noticed the cursor movement was responding differently.
Still not tracking without the slight drift when mouse is in motion (as seen in one of the several videos I’ve posted), but the tracking response has definitely changed post this update.

Furthermore I then had to adjust mouse app dpi to compensate, from 1800 to 1200, so quite drastic.

This update was for w11 insider preview, dev build preview version 25290.1000

If anyone else could update under the same w11 build conditions and can confirm firstly the mouse speed resetting in windows and subsequently mouse response in general.


Cheers lads.

Slender
Posts: 573
Joined: 25 Jan 2020, 17:55

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Slender » 03 Feb 2023, 15:05

FPSMaster wrote:
31 Dec 2022, 06:30
99% of all gaming mice are still version USB 2. People say, you need to run it on USB 3 because on many motherboards, USB 2 doesnt go directly to your CPU instead it goes trough the chipset first, which causes latency etc.
While on the other hand, most motherboards have 2-4 USB 3.0 Ports that go directly to your CPU for better USB speeds and faster responsiveness. So, thats completely normal. Manufactures think Its unecessary to have mice be USB 3 compatible, because they dont need to transfer data as fast as SSDs/HDDS need to. Did you test your Mouse on 8k in Mouse Tester? Does it give you stable results?
*usb 1.1

Shade7
Posts: 222
Joined: 25 May 2022, 18:44

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Shade7 » 04 Feb 2023, 03:53

Vocaleyes wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 07:59
Something to report further.

Last night before I logged off I noticed a w11 release preview update, which is pretty frequent on the dev channel so nothing out of the blue. As usual I install and then update while shutting down.

This morning when I logged in, I had noticed something that doesn’t usually happen after one of these updates, which is the mouse speed in windows was reset.

Usually after an update windows retains the previously selected setting, for me it’s 3/11. But as I said, was now reset to the 6/11 position.

After putting it back on 3/11 however, I then noticed the cursor movement was responding differently.
Still not tracking without the slight drift when mouse is in motion (as seen in one of the several videos I’ve posted), but the tracking response has definitely changed post this update.

Furthermore I then had to adjust mouse app dpi to compensate, from 1800 to 1200, so quite drastic.

This update was for w11 insider preview, dev build preview version 25290.1000

If anyone else could update under the same w11 build conditions and can confirm firstly the mouse speed resetting in windows and subsequently mouse response in general.


Cheers lads.
I haven't been on the insider channel for a while. On the regular Win 11 right now. Might consider trying to get beta updates again after seeing this post though.

The first thing I thought after reading your post- is that if they reverted your mouse configuration, who knows what other changes that you have made in the past have been undone/reverted back to defaults. That might be the source of your response changes. Check out if they messed with game mode, HAGS, background apps, power profile, fast startup.

Vocaleyes
Posts: 287
Joined: 09 Nov 2021, 18:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Vocaleyes » 04 Feb 2023, 07:15

That’s what I thought too, but as I was scaled to 150% before the update which was maintained, along with all other windows and nvidia settings, e.g. hags, power savings options in power management incl usb selective suspend, all as were.

As far as I’m able to immediately tell sans patch notes, this was the only thing that stood out.

Have shifted off ffxiv and am going to be running a few various fps’ers today to see if there’s anything worthwhile mentioning in regards to shooters.

Vocaleyes
Posts: 287
Joined: 09 Nov 2021, 18:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Vocaleyes » 04 Feb 2023, 10:12

Play by playing it, writing as I’m going along and posting at the end.

Firstly, I have since moved off the 150% scaling for the first time in a long time, back to 100%.

Tested in Valorant shooting range, still incompatible with 8k polling so lowered to 500. It’s quite interesting on 8k though, you can feel when the polling rate is spiking in conjunction with the frame drop.
Anyway, letterbox, low gpu settings, raw input buffer Off. bearing in mind I haven’t touched a shooter in a while, there’s definitely a different feeling to the aiming in a positive way.

Launched overwatch, closed discord, left mouse on 500 poll initially, enable high precision mouse input (in game, not windows obviously) Off.

Immediately noticing a difference. The 180 snaps are fast, not sluggish as before felt like hitting turn limit on a game console controller, and accurate. I feel no need to test at 8k, but am doing it out of curiousity.
8k is like butter to look at, but y axis feels slightly constrained compared to the x. Much as it used to when changing from 250/500 to 1000 back in the day. This is the first time I will be switching back to 500 poll, as the cursor feels better than the frames look at 8k polling, which is something that feels fairly familiar, but I don’t want to get ahead of myself as I, like we all, have been burned before..
Picked Cassidy for some hitscan judgement and some sens tweaking (1200dpi settled on), the left and right flicks, 180/360 turns feel substantially un-constrained.
I also tried with high precision mouse input turned on in overwatch, and while the left and right felt the same as off, shots felt like they flowed better? I can’t think of another way to say that off the cuff. Leaving it on.

Launched apex, going in to training ground.
Also feels different with regard to left right panning response, still the occasional frame drop, but that seems to be an issue with apex and dpc latency. I’m going in to an actual game, as this game in particular I notice that aim in training and aim in a match needs to be slightly adjusted to compensate for moving target so seeing the difference in both.
After a quick adjust and a few matches, there’s a substantial difference.

I’m going to go and spam some real games for the rest of the night and will post any further update.

I highly recommend giving it a go!

timecard
Posts: 66
Joined: 25 Jan 2020, 01:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by timecard » 04 Feb 2023, 11:11

Someone shared this recently in a discord i'm in, maybe related to this?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows11/comm ... _in_games/

In brief all windows versions up until now don't handle raw input efficiently when dealing with multiple raw input subscribers, if you have 10 programs all subscribing to raw input, it'll send all the data to each of them which makes computer performance worst when using higher HZ mice. The solution they were testing is to only send 125hz data to background apps and then give full 1000msg a sec to the foreground app.

According to the post this applies to all versions of windows and this change is consider a feature because the way it works was otherwise planned/expected in older versions of windows. I have asked the Reddit OP to see if there's plans to add this feature to Win10 but no reply yet.

As for identifying how many raw input subscribers there are for further discovery and investigation, I spoke with the Reddit OP and there's custom ETW trace providers in Win11 Insiders edition that can give you this information.

When using the "windows insider dev channel" you can get more relevant information by:

Code: Select all

Collect a UIF trace under Input & Language > Mouse and look at the diagnostic data, you can poke around at what's collected, but again the details may change from release to release

Vocaleyes
Posts: 287
Joined: 09 Nov 2021, 18:10

Re: Viper 8Khz Not Running at USB 3.0

Post by Vocaleyes » 04 Feb 2023, 20:14

Concluding a days worth of testing, it is a huge step in the right direction but not an entire fix. Also for the life of me am unable to launch nvcp now, despite uninstalling and reinstalling. Also when tried to reinstall gpu driver, pc hung and had to force restart. So that’s a bit wonky.

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