Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

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HeroofTime
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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by HeroofTime » 29 Jan 2019, 09:39

@jorimt Thank you very much for that. I fully understand what's going on now. Do you think it's okay that I have V-sync enabled through my games instead? If so, I'll just leave things be and be content.

To be honest, I barely feel any input lag this way. I never knew V-sync could be this good. The last time I remember really trying V-sync was in Unreal Tournament 2004, and let me tell you that it was an atrocious experience back then. It seems things have come a long way though!

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jorimt
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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by jorimt » 29 Jan 2019, 10:03

If you're running borderless mode in conjunction with the low lag V-SYNC method using a decimal-level RTSS limit, then yeah.

It wouldn't work as well with the DWM triple buffer solution anyway, so the in-game V-SYNC option overriding it with double buffer is optimal in this specific use case.
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HeroofTime
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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by HeroofTime » 29 Jan 2019, 10:35

@jorimt Awesome! Makes sense. Thanks again to you and everyone else here for all the help and information.

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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by HeroofTime » 04 May 2019, 14:13

Hello everyone,

I revisited this topic after feeling differences between every game's V-sync implementation (periodical stuttering, some games implementing it well, while others doing a mediocre job). So, to solve this issue completely, I forced V-sync on in NVIDIA CP and made all of my games fullscreen. I remembered to disable V-sync and triple buffering in each game specifically. I also went back and found that I had made a mistake assuming my monitor's refresh rate being exactly 120Hz (it isn't). Using vsynctester.com and displayhz.com, I found that my refresh rate is 119.88Hz. I went back into RTSS and set the FPS limiter to 119.86FPS. I went back into my games and found that they all felt terrible and began stuttering. Simply put, do not forget to set your monitor's refresh rate to "Application-controlled". Now, my games feel very fluid and I'm very happy with my setup.

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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 05 May 2019, 20:34

Thanks for your feedback.

Also, a source of microstuttering is some monitors have undiagnosed frameskipping at certain refreah rates, one can use www.testufo.com/frameskipping as an extra verification check. The problem afflicted some early-model 240Hz monitors.

Also, Blur Busters branded refresh rate, use www.testufo.com/refreshrate
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HeroofTime
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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by HeroofTime » 10 May 2019, 14:11

@Chief Blur Buster Hey, no worries. Thanks for all the help too.

It's only been about a week since I resorted to fullscreening everything alongside forcing V-sync at the driver level instead of in-game. I recently purchased Mordhau and realized that I've grown tired of adjusting graphics settings in games that don't need to be run at 120FPS (119.86FPS in my case). I'm aware of which graphics settings give the most "bang for the buck", but I've still grown tired of having to adjust and tweak many settings in order to push 120FPS for ULMB to be worth it.

The XL2730Z was one of the earliest adopters of FreeSync, and I've been aware of NVIDIA's adoption of FreeSync since their first graphics driver that supported it earlier this year. I remember attempting to use it and not getting the G-SYNC option to show up in NVIDIA CP. I decided to go down that rabbit hole again and I finally figured it out after doing some research. For whatever reason, the monitor will not show up as G-SYNC compatible in NVIDIA CP at 144Hz. Even if it does show up as G-SYNC compatible, the screen stays black after applying it in NVIDIA CP. So, I deleted anything that had to do with 144Hz in CRU, and then I created new 120Hz and 143Hz profiles for 1080p and 1440p in the existing extension block. I did some further research and after doing lots of trial and error testing, I extended the existing FreeSync range from 40-144Hz to 30-144Hz (well, in my case it'd be up to 143Hz). I kept V-sync enabled in NVIDIA CP. Lastly, I limited my FPS in RTSS to 140.00FPS.

I went ahead and gave it a go in CS:GO, PUBG, and Unreal Tournament. I definitely see things just a tiny bit more blurrier (because ULMB isn't on anymore of course), but it's been much easier on my eyes to be honest. The benefits outweigh the drawbacks. I no longer have to worry about graphics settings in any game I play anymore. This means no more perceived micro-stuttering when I dip to 118FPS or lower. I've gained 20 more frames that my eyes will be able to see (119.86FPS versus 140.00FPS). Streaming from Steam and Discord no longer lock my FPS to 60 in-game (for whatever reason this used to happen when friends wanted to watch me in a match of whatever game I'm playing with the low-lag V-sync method alongside ULMB). My inputs are technically faster by 1.2ms (7.14 versus 8.34ms, 140FPS versus 119.86FPS).

The only disadvantage going the FreeSync route is that things do look a tiny bit blurrier, but that effect has definitely given my eyes a break and has made longer gaming sessions more bearable. ULMB is obviously for those who play twitch shooters competitively, but it didn't affect me in those types of games so I'm even happier than before.

I have one last question though, and I guess I forgot to ask about it before. Should triple buffering be enabled in the NVIDIA CP when using G-SYNC or FreeSync? Of course, I had it enabled when using the low-lag V-sync method alongside ULMB, but I'm completely unsure when it comes to adaptive sync methods. Thanks for all the help again guys.

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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by RealNC » 10 May 2019, 14:21

VRR is double-buffered. Triple buffering is only useful for vsync and it does nothing for VRR, so I recommend disabling it.
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HeroofTime
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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by HeroofTime » 10 May 2019, 16:26

@RealNC Thanks for the info. I went ahead and disabled it. I found one of jorimt's posts which detailed exactly why you should disable it when using G-SYNC or FreeSync. Awesome!

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=4727#p36598

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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 11 May 2019, 10:25

The only exception to triple buffering for GSYNC/FreeSync is to reduce latency of framerates higher than refresh rates. VRR will automatically switch to the non-VRR sync mode when running framerates above refresh rates. Some gamers use GSYNC+VSYNC OFF but that means tearing appears at framerates above Hz. A workaround can be the triple buffering option. But that still can microstutter.

However, most of the time, GSYNC/FreeSync is enabled to help eliminate stutters, and you want latency consistency in your entire frame rate range, so the better approach is an in-game frame rate cap -- a few fps below Hz. That way, your motion mechanics & latency mechanics stay much more consistent by keeping your framerates within the VRR range.

The lagfeel of VSYNC OFF versus VSYNC ON versus Triple Buffer versus FreeSync/GSYNC can all be different. Keeping it consistently FreeSync/GSYNC is usually superior for most games, with the common "cap-framerate-below-max-Hz-of-your-VRR-refresh-rate-range" trick.

However, because of the way things work -- and individual preferences may vary -- the lagfeel transition between GSYNC/FreeSync versus triple buffering is more minor than the lagfeel transition between GSYNC/FreeSync versus double-buffered VSYNC ON.

Games that consistently always run at framerates above max refresh rate, you might switch to a different sync mode. (e.g. CS:GO). VRR helps more your other games that fluctuate a lot to the point where stutters interfere with your aiming,
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Re: Tearing & Micro-stuttering In Every Game

Post by RealNC » 11 May 2019, 10:31

Chief Blur Buster wrote:The only exception to triple buffering for GSYNC/FreeSync is to reduce latency of framerates higher than refresh rates.
This is not the kind of triple buffering we're talking about here. This is about the "triple buffer" nvidia control panel option, NOT the "fast sync" option (which is the kind of triple buffer you are talking about.)
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