WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySource]

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Simon95
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Re: WANTED: Software Developers: We need a Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySource]

Post by Simon95 » 28 May 2021, 14:42

Im looking forward for this tool. With my 3-5ms jitter i can feel that i miss sometimes just because of the jitter spikes.

Anonymous27

Re: WANTED: Software Developers: We need a Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySource]

Post by Anonymous27 » 11 Apr 2022, 07:35

So over a year and nobody has started working on this? Sadge. :( This looks like a very promising idea and it could be profitable aswell if someone went ahead and made it.

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Re: WANTED: Software Developers: We need a Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySource]

Post by MT_ » 22 Apr 2022, 17:21

Hi guys.

Very interesting thread indeed.

I currently own a dedicated server (endpoint) with a redundant two way connection (over two different isp's) with a respective latency of 5 and 10ms. (UDP tunnel over wireguard)

Basically in each direction, whichever packet arrives first wins, so both connection quality and uptime is greatly improved.

Im no developer but I'm definitely planning something like condition my network to minimize jitter at the cost of some latency.

Im not yet at the stage of practical implementation but a simple buffer or artificial delay (maybe with netem and qdisc) it could be realized.
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WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySource]

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 22 Jul 2023, 21:18

UPDATE (2023) due to users doing exploits.

Not Considered Cheating: Symmetric packetdelay
Some game companies (and I) don't mind if a user symmetrically delays their FTTH to match their DSL/Cable peers, since that makes prediction a lot less wonky if you intentionally handicap to get the same algorithmic behaviors as other people in your local region game servers. For some, it is a lot easier running packetdelay app on an opensource router (e.g. OpenWRT) than to switch to a VPN provider (to add intentional lag to equalize your latency with peers) -- same end result of latency self-equalization.

Considered Cheating: Asymmetric packetdelay
But, using very heavily asymmetric packetdelayers to trigger an exploit (e.g. a game that doesn't detect for unusually asymmetric ping) -- is currently considered cheating. It is possible for game engines to detect asymmetric latency, through various algorithms that measures ping in one direction (from both ends) and comparing, and using heuristics (over long term) to automatically redflag if there's heavy asymmetry. Some game engines MAY ban you if you do this, others haven't upgraded theirs to detect this yet. This is considered an exploit.

NOTE TO GAME COMPANIES: It (just about) is possible to detect asymmetric latency by various techniques, and whitelist things like Hughesnet (satellite download + dialup upload combo) while blocking very noticeably heavily asymmetric latency cheats. By doing this, timestamp-based asymmetric latency detection is possible. This is challenging with imprecise clock synchronization without GPS-accurate timestamps on both ends. But not impossible, since heavily asymmetric latency will often eventually fingerprint itself (and detectable by heuristics/AI/etc). Valve and VAC should add centralized master clocks that is relatively resistant to asymmetry-latency cheats. By having a latency-compensating VPN, it makes it less tempting for people to cheat via asymmetric-latency tricks -- fingerprinting shows up if browser-based lag behaviors are not in sync with steam-based lag behaviors and are not in sync with gameserver-lag behaviors (e.g. selective asymmetric latency shows up like a christmas tree in multiple-channel timestamp synchronization!). So games should use multiple timestamp sync APIs that run through separate apps (via Windows OS, via VAC, and via in-game), to resist filtering by router-based selectivity. Therefore, a symmetric-latency-jitter-compensating VPN is considered kosher by some game companies that I discussed to, but none currently exist yet. Much like how making Netflix available reduced the need to Bittorrent, we badly need a fair game-company-approved latency-compensating VPN.

New BountySource Rule: The client must absolutely be game-company-approved, and not capable of allowing asymmetric latency (unless someone pulls it from github, modifies it, recompiles it with an illegal asymmetric packetdelay). Source code pull requests for asymmetric latency will be rejected.


Discussion on how to do asymmetric packetdelay is a rules violation ("no cheats" forum rule).
SUCH POSTS WILL BE DELETED. DO NOT REPLY TO THREAD ABOUT ASYMMETRIC LATENCY CHEATS
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Re: WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySou

Post by DudeBeFishing » 03 Oct 2023, 18:00

Something that I would like to have in a VPN is to chose the path or location of an anycast address. Most big VPN providers let you choose your VPN's location, but it's not 100% guaranteed to connect to a different anycast address's location. Idk if this feature would fix the issue I'm currently having, but it would be nice have the option.

For example, 205.220.229.82. Most of the time I get about 75ms latency when running a trace route. Occasionally it will be less than 40ms. When it's 75ms, hit registration is bad to game servers hosted within the 205.220.229.0/24 address space. When it's below 40ms, hit registration is normal. Ping, trace route, etc all look stable regardless if it's the 75ms or 40ms location. Average latency displayed in the games is about 90ms regardless of what the trace route shows, so the server's physical location most likely hasn't changed.

The 205.220.229.0/24 address space is owned by Path Network Inc. They specialize in DDoS mitigation and utilize anycast on their networks. Going by this site those should be anycasted addresses. https://bgp.he.net/net/205.220.229.0/24#_irr

However, pinging addresses within this space from random locations seems to route to the same physical location, per IP address. This means these addresses are unicast, or anycast is configured wrong. I tested pings with Cloudflare WARP and this website: https://tools.keycdn.com/ping . I'd have to wait until I see it go to 40ms again to test if Cloudflare's latency also changes.

205.220.229.82 is most likely currently routing to a western part of the US, going by ping numbers. It's also registered to California. Google's 8.8.8.8 has similar pings regardless of location, obviously an anycast address.

I'm not well versed in networking so correct me if I'm misunderstanding how any of this works or if I'm using the wrong terminology. If this isn't the right thread to discuss this, I can create a different thread.

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Re: WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySou

Post by Boop » 04 Oct 2023, 01:40

WTFast has been working on ping equalization tech. Not sure of its current state but here's some links.

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/creating ... ticle_view

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Introducing Patented WTFast Equalization
Our patented process of optimizing connections with our GPN to create an optimized equalization point is critical. Without this process, the equalization point will be too high, and gamers will end up with a connection that they are unhappy with.

In this example, without our optimization process, the equalization point would end up being that of the worst connection, leading to unhappy gamers. With our optimization process, all gamers that are competing are optimized as much as possible via our GPN, outliers optimized as the tournament organizer sees fit. If the gamers are equalized to 60ms, all play at the exact same speed - 60ms. The gamers see in real-time the connection results they are experiencing, and also in a post-game summary.

This process ensures end-to-end optimization of connections, delivering fast and smooth connections for all gamers, and a true skills-based online competition. This increases player satisfaction and a sense of accomplishment, knowing that the match was based on skill, and nobody had an unfair advantage on the network.

Secondary benefits to this technology include:

1. Reduced need for programmatic lag compensation (since game developers already know that we are creating a level playing field on the network)

2. Easier to spot in-game cheaters (the cheater’s in-game response time in relation to the equalized network would be impossibly low.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/access-l ... ticle_view

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Connection Equalization

The next iteration of our technology being delivered in 2022 includes not only optimization of connections, but also equalization. We can leverage our technology to create an equalization lobby for competitive gaming. We optimize all connections as much as possible to create an optimized equalization point. Everyone competes at the same ping. This creates a level playing field on the network for the competitors. This means true skills based online competitions. We can provide the trusted end to end network so variable network conditions are no longer a factor for online competitions. With a trusted network, gamers know that they are winning because of their skill and strategy. With a trusted network, all the statistics for these online competitions will also be trusted.

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Re: WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySou

Post by KingAzar » 17 Oct 2023, 18:49

Are you suggesting that if I locate a VPS running Linux and configure a Wireguard VPN on it for me to connect to a server near my gaming location, I should notice an improvement in performance?

I'm seeking clarification on the distinction between symmetric and asymmetric packet delay. Is virtual lag essentially introducing extra delay to your connection, but instead of having, for instance, +2 ms in both the upstream and downstream directions, it would be +2 ms in just one direction? I might be misunderstanding this concept entirely.

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Re: WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySou

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 17 Oct 2023, 19:45

KingAzar wrote:
17 Oct 2023, 18:49
Are you suggesting that if I locate a VPS running Linux and configure a Wireguard VPN on it for me to connect to a server near my gaming location, I should notice an improvement in performance?

I'm seeking clarification on the distinction between symmetric and asymmetric packet delay. Is virtual lag essentially introducing extra delay to your connection, but instead of having, for instance, +2 ms in both the upstream and downstream directions, it would be +2 ms in just one direction? I might be misunderstanding this concept entirely.
1. Symmetric variable packet delay.
On these forums, we don't support the discussion of asymmetric latency since it's possibly considered a form of cheating. There are some possible special considerations behind this, and we don't want to cause users to be banned from servers for using cheats.

2. The wording of your question might indicate you might have you posted in possibly the wrong thread.
Basically this thread is about currently-nonexistent software that converts variable jitter to constant jitter, using the custom algorithm to add/remove variable latency to make both incoming/outgoing constant latency between two endpoints despite whatever jitter in between. It's not about adding a fixed latency to any latency; but converting variable +[1...10]ms latency (on base latency) into a fixed +[10]ms (on base latency) as an example. If a packet was +6ms laggier than the fastest-arriving packet, it would add +4ms, to guarantee a fixed +10ms endpoint latency adder). Fastest-arriving packets would get +10ms, slowest-arriving packets would get +0ms. Anywhere in between would get an intentional latency added to keep it same latency as the fastest/slowest packets. Basically this thread is about requesting new software to be created that is a latency de-jitterer. A form of special game-optimized network compensation/conditioning is sometimes built into games, but not all games, and an external generic 'clean & fair' method like this algorithm would be immensely helpful.
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Re: WANTED: Software Devs: Game Company Approved Gaming VPN client with BUILT IN NETWORK LATENCY DE-JITTERING [BountySou

Post by KingAzar » 20 Oct 2023, 01:07

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
17 Oct 2023, 19:45
KingAzar wrote:
17 Oct 2023, 18:49
Are you suggesting that if I locate a VPS running Linux and configure a Wireguard VPN on it for me to connect to a server near my gaming location, I should notice an improvement in performance?

I'm seeking clarification on the distinction between symmetric and asymmetric packet delay. Is virtual lag essentially introducing extra delay to your connection, but instead of having, for instance, +2 ms in both the upstream and downstream directions, it would be +2 ms in just one direction? I might be misunderstanding this concept entirely.
1. Symmetric variable packet delay.
On these forums, we don't support the discussion of asymmetric latency since it's possibly considered a form of cheating. There are some possible special considerations behind this, and we don't want to cause users to be banned from servers for using cheats.

2. The wording of your question might indicate you might have you posted in possibly the wrong thread.
Basically this thread is about currently-nonexistent software that converts variable jitter to constant jitter, using the custom algorithm to add/remove variable latency to make both incoming/outgoing constant latency between two endpoints despite whatever jitter in between. It's not about adding a fixed latency to any latency; but converting variable +[1...10]ms latency (on base latency) into a fixed +[10]ms (on base latency) as an example. If a packet was +6ms laggier than the fastest-arriving packet, it would add +4ms, to guarantee a fixed +10ms endpoint latency adder). Fastest-arriving packets would get +10ms, slowest-arriving packets would get +0ms. Anywhere in between would get an intentional latency added to keep it same latency as the fastest/slowest packets. Basically this thread is about requesting new software to be created that is a latency de-jitterer. A form of special game-optimized network compensation/conditioning is sometimes built into games, but not all games, and an external generic 'clean & fair' method like this algorithm would be immensely helpful.
I'd like to clarify that my primary goal and intentions were not related to cheating or engaging in any malicious activities. My initial question may have unintentionally conveyed a different message, but I want to emphasize that my objective is solely to gain a better understanding of specific networking concepts and terminology.

Now that I have a clearer grasp of the discussion's context, I'd like to share my situation. I currently have access to 1 VPS in Seattle and another in Chicago, and my physical location is in Southern Alberta. It occurred to me that I hadn't considered the potential benefits of setting up network tunnels using these servers. I'm curious whether utilizing them, possibly through a solution like WireGuard tunneling, could have a positive impact on my network performance.

My aim is to explore legitimate ways to optimize network performance and reduce latency, and there is absolutely no intention on my part to use any techniques for cheating or malicious purposes. I hope this clarifies my intentions, and I'm eager to engage in productive discussions about network improvement options within this community but also wishing you luck on finding what you looking for and of course hope that you will find a solution to this ping/jitter issue.

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