Mouse Sensor Lag (Discussion Thread)

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Eonds
Posts: 262
Joined: 29 Oct 2020, 10:34

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by Eonds » 14 Sep 2021, 07:47

lizardpeter wrote:
13 Sep 2021, 21:36
FPSMaster wrote:
13 Sep 2021, 06:55
When looking at those videos and tests, mice generally have 3-8ms total input lag. And in the videos we can see bigger variations in input lag from model to model and from brand to brand.
Absolutely. That is why for my monitors, mice, keyboards, etc. I always wait for independent third-party reviews from experienced reviewers who have the proper tools to test for latency differences. Optimum Tech's videos, in combination with others' videos and reviews, convinced me to order the Viper 8K and Acer Nitro 390 Hz monitor. The monitor hasn't arrived yet, but the Viper 8K is the fastest mouse out for both sensor and click latencies, and I personally noticed that it was more responsive instantly. I can't wait to try the monitor. As for keyboards, I have the Apex Pro TKL. It is very good, but I'm pretty sure the Corsair K65 RGB MINI is the fastest on the market. I purchased my Apex Pro before that one was out.

I have both the Razer 8k & Corsair k65. If you're like me and care about latency consider a better RAM kit & an AMD GPU & learning how to disable power saving features, setting fixed voltages + frequencies, optimizing your OS, reversing drivers, learning C & C++, Adjusting GPU memory timings, flashing unlocked bios, disabling Tile based rendering, etc. It makes a massive difference, there's so much bullshit going on behind the scenes that fuck with system latency.

lizardpeter
Posts: 208
Joined: 01 Dec 2020, 14:41

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by lizardpeter » 14 Sep 2021, 09:07

Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 07:47
I have both the Razer 8k & Corsair k65. If you're like me and care about latency consider a better RAM kit & an AMD GPU & learning how to disable power saving features, setting fixed voltages + frequencies, optimizing your OS, reversing drivers, learning C & C++, Adjusting GPU memory timings, flashing unlocked bios, disabling Tile based rendering, etc. It makes a massive difference, there's so much bullshit going on behind the scenes that fuck with system latency.
I do have a good B-die RAM kit, but I do need to spend more time tuning it. I already use fixed voltages and locked frequencies. My OS is pretty well optimized. Three things I am interested in are the AMD GPU, GPU memory timings, and tile-based rendering. I have heard of AMD GPUs having less input lag before, but in all of the objective tests I have seen there has never been a difference. Do you have any objective data that shows the difference? How do you change GPU memory timings? I’ve only ever changed the frequency. How do I disable tile-based rendering?
i9 9900k | RTX 2080 Ti | 32 GB 4x8GB B-Die 3600 MT/s CL16 | XV252QF 390 Hz 1080p | AW2518H 240 Hz 1080p | PG279Q 144 Hz 1440p

Razer Viper 8K | Artisan Zero Mid XL | Apex Pro TKL | 1 gbps FiOS (Fiber)

FPSMaster
Posts: 187
Joined: 04 Jun 2021, 20:39

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag (Discussion Thread)

Post by FPSMaster » 14 Sep 2021, 11:04

I also optimized my OS. Bought a new GPU (upgraded from a gtx 970 to a gtx 980Ti. Its the same as a gtx 1070). I upgraded my ram. Im using dual channell and dual rank now. Bought a new 144hz Monitor with very low latency. I optimized my Bios, debloated windows with scripts and did other soft core latency optimizations, which cannot break windows.

Thats why Im looking to squeeze every little extra out of my system, to get lowest lag. And when you check many of those Mouse tests, its actually crazy that you can eleminate some more ms by one simple step!

As I know, AMD and Nvidia gpus have almost the same input lag, with sub millisecond variatons.
Of course only if you compare euqal models like the RX 5700XT vs RTX 2080Ti. This applies to processors as well. I saw many tests, and all showed results with very very little differences in ms. So little, it wont be worth changing from NVIDIA to AMD :)
Personally, I like the quality of NVIDIA and the performance. AMD has bigger performance fluctuation from game to game as I know.

Edit: here is a nice video about Nvidia vs AMD latency for CPUS and GPUS!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UhaZ8VT4fU
Last edited by FPSMaster on 14 Sep 2021, 11:09, edited 1 time in total.

FPSMaster
Posts: 187
Joined: 04 Jun 2021, 20:39

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag (Discussion Thread)

Post by FPSMaster » 14 Sep 2021, 11:06

I think many people come here, to get some last "secret" informations about new methods to reduce lag. And they read this...
I love to help them :)

Unixko
Posts: 212
Joined: 04 Jul 2020, 08:28

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag (Discussion Thread)

Post by Unixko » 14 Sep 2021, 15:11

FPSMaster wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 11:06
I think many people come here, to get some last "secret" informations about new methods to reduce lag. And they read this...
I love to help them :)
people come here to found a fix for they non existed problem which they call input lag
but in the reality this problem is power related(interference)
if people dont have this kinda issue belive me nobody cares about 5 ms difference in real system latency or input lag or what ever
(if even 5ms ) more likely 1ms

Eonds
Posts: 262
Joined: 29 Oct 2020, 10:34

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by Eonds » 14 Sep 2021, 20:38

lizardpeter wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 09:07
Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 07:47
I have both the Razer 8k & Corsair k65. If you're like me and care about latency consider a better RAM kit & an AMD GPU & learning how to disable power saving features, setting fixed voltages + frequencies, optimizing your OS, reversing drivers, learning C & C++, Adjusting GPU memory timings, flashing unlocked bios, disabling Tile based rendering, etc. It makes a massive difference, there's so much bullshit going on behind the scenes that fuck with system latency.
I do have a good B-die RAM kit, but I do need to spend more time tuning it. I already use fixed voltages and locked frequencies. My OS is pretty well optimized. Three things I am interested in are the AMD GPU, GPU memory timings, and tile-based rendering. I have heard of AMD GPUs having less input lag before, but in all of the objective tests I have seen there has never been a difference. Do you have any objective data that shows the difference? How do you change GPU memory timings? I’ve only ever changed the frequency. How do I disable tile-based rendering?

The testing which has been done by youtubers is not accurate enough to measure the difference between the two. AMD has way more OC potential + way more tuning. You can flash a custom vbios for your GPU to change vram timings, you can check my twitter for an alternate method for both amd/nvidia, Disabling tile based rendering is not something that's "easy" per say. For most people/games you should keep it enabled. I'd have to make a separate post about tile based rendering and how to disable it. If you know C/C++ you can patch the driver call. CR1 > CR2 (latency wise), tight timings > loose timings for GPU + DRAM (for lower latency). Yes there is a big difference when it comes amd vs nvidia. The average tech youtuber doesn't have the equipment and or knowledge to test stuff like this. It's best left to the professionals / companies themselves. I've spoken to driver support and they claim there's no way to disable TBR on nvidia/amd gpu's (obviously that's not true), so you'd have to find a workaround like i said. Some cards have immediate mode rendering by default like the radeon vega frontier edition, older NVIDIA/AMD cards as well. Tiling is really a cringe scam that nvidia/amd starting using a while ago. AMD just has less TBR than nvidia by default, but there's many other reasons i haven't mentioned as to why AMD cards have better latency.

lizardpeter
Posts: 208
Joined: 01 Dec 2020, 14:41

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by lizardpeter » 14 Sep 2021, 21:13

Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 20:38
you can check my twitter
What’s your Twitter? I’d be interested in how to do it on my 2080 Ti.
i9 9900k | RTX 2080 Ti | 32 GB 4x8GB B-Die 3600 MT/s CL16 | XV252QF 390 Hz 1080p | AW2518H 240 Hz 1080p | PG279Q 144 Hz 1440p

Razer Viper 8K | Artisan Zero Mid XL | Apex Pro TKL | 1 gbps FiOS (Fiber)

Eonds
Posts: 262
Joined: 29 Oct 2020, 10:34

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by Eonds » 14 Sep 2021, 21:14

lizardpeter wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 21:13
Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 20:38
you can check my twitter
What’s your Twitter? I’d be interested in how to do it on my 2080 Ti.
You can click on my blurbusters name or https://twitter.com/jerry05259307

( i joke around a lot on my twitter) Don't take everything i say 100% seriously.

lizardpeter
Posts: 208
Joined: 01 Dec 2020, 14:41

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by lizardpeter » 14 Sep 2021, 22:04

Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 21:14
lizardpeter wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 21:13
Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 20:38
you can check my twitter
What’s your Twitter? I’d be interested in how to do it on my 2080 Ti.
You can click on my blurbusters name or https://twitter.com/jerry05259307

( i joke around a lot on my twitter) Don't take everything i say 100% seriously.
So for Viper 8K, you recommend assigning it to one core? Does is usually just default to core 0?
i9 9900k | RTX 2080 Ti | 32 GB 4x8GB B-Die 3600 MT/s CL16 | XV252QF 390 Hz 1080p | AW2518H 240 Hz 1080p | PG279Q 144 Hz 1440p

Razer Viper 8K | Artisan Zero Mid XL | Apex Pro TKL | 1 gbps FiOS (Fiber)

lizardpeter
Posts: 208
Joined: 01 Dec 2020, 14:41

Re: Mouse Sensor Lag!

Post by lizardpeter » 14 Sep 2021, 22:07

Eonds wrote:
14 Sep 2021, 20:38
The testing which has been done by youtubers is not accurate enough to measure the difference between the two.
If this is the case, where do you get your information from? Do you test it yourself? If so, you should create some kind of database with your info or upload your results. That would be awesome.
i9 9900k | RTX 2080 Ti | 32 GB 4x8GB B-Die 3600 MT/s CL16 | XV252QF 390 Hz 1080p | AW2518H 240 Hz 1080p | PG279Q 144 Hz 1440p

Razer Viper 8K | Artisan Zero Mid XL | Apex Pro TKL | 1 gbps FiOS (Fiber)

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