Samsung QD OLED

High Hz on OLED produce excellent strobeless motion blur reduction with fast GtG pixel response. It is easier to tell apart 60Hz vs 120Hz vs 240Hz on OLED than LCD, and more visible to mainstream. Includes WOLED and QD-OLED displays.
DrR1pper
Posts: 61
Joined: 03 Aug 2015, 17:55

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by DrR1pper » 23 Jan 2022, 16:36

jorimt wrote:
23 Jan 2022, 15:18
That said, even if the QD-OLED in question could sustain 200 nits full field, that would still be reduced to 100 nits or under with decent BFI active.
Aren't the "sustained luminance" values not actual physical limitation of what the display can output in a sustained manner but what the manufactures arbitrarily cap the displays at so as to meet their desired longevity under normal use (due to unavoidable OLED degradation over time)? So the stated peaks of 1000 nits could be sustained full-field but doing so would just lower the life-span on the display way below what is acceptable? Because if so, and assuming near linear degradation vs. sustainable luminance output, they could just set the display to output full-field 1000 nits but with BFI at 20% on-time and achieve the same average luminance output effect as 200 nits full-field sustained.

Though I've yet to confirm so only an assumption, seems to be what Philips are doing with their OLED+936 to achieve BFI without much brightness reduction vs. BFI off. I was tempted to go for it until this Alienware was announced making me willing to hold off from going OLED BFI a bit longer until the display sizes are more monitor friendly.

phpBB [video]
Last edited by DrR1pper on 23 Jan 2022, 21:05, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
jorimt
Posts: 2481
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44
Location: USA

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by jorimt » 23 Jan 2022, 18:52

DrR1pper wrote:
23 Jan 2022, 16:36
Aren't the "sustained luminance" values not actual physical limitation of what the display can output in a sustained manner but what the manufactures arbitrary cap the displays at so as to meet their desired longevity under normal use (due to unavoidable OLED degradation over time)? So the stated peaks of 1000 nits could be sustained full-field but doing so would just lower the life-span on the display way below what is acceptable?
Partially, but there's two other factors to consider; energy consumption and form factor.

Consumer televisions have to pass certain Energy Star requirements, and sustaining such luminance at the existing consumer OLED form factors without a much larger heatsink and active fan cooling while passing ES requirements would likely be impractical, and that's not including any accelerated aging caused by pushing all the pixels to a higher luminance simultaniously.

See this video on the (discountined) ~$40,000 Sony BVM-X300 true RGB OLED professional broadcast monitor, for instance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESzWY0hW85Y

An examples of its form factor (source: https://pro.sony/ue_US/products/broadca ... vm-x300-v2)...

Side view:
Image

Rear view:
Image

And the BVM-X300 only just reaches 1000 nits peak brightness (aka highlights). I doubt it's even near that full field.

I'm not saying what you're suggesting isn't ultimately possible with OLED in time, I'm saying, to my knowledge, it isn't viable with current consumer-level OLED tech, including the upcoming QD-OLEDs, and if it is, there's been no precedence to suggest it (feel free to share a source that shows OLED reaching anything above 200 nits full field), but we'll certainly see...
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: ASUS PG27AQN, LG 48CX VR: Beyond, Quest 3, Reverb G2, Index OS: Windows 11 Pro Case: Fractal Design Torrent PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-1000 MB: ASUS Z790 Hero CPU: Intel i9-13900k w/Noctua NH-U12A GPU: GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC RAM: 32GB G.SKILL Trident Z5 DDR5 6400MHz CL32 SSDs: 2TB WD_BLACK SN850 (OS), 4TB WD_BLACK SN850X (Games) Keyboards: Wooting 60HE, Logitech G915 TKL Mice: Razer Viper Mini SE, Razer Viper 8kHz Sound: Creative Sound Blaster Katana V2 (speakers/amp/DAC), AFUL Performer 8 (IEMs)

DrR1pper
Posts: 61
Joined: 03 Aug 2015, 17:55

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by DrR1pper » 23 Jan 2022, 21:18

Makes sense and thank you for conversing and answering my questions. :)

User avatar
jorimt
Posts: 2481
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44
Location: USA

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by jorimt » 23 Jan 2022, 22:20

DrR1pper wrote:
23 Jan 2022, 21:18
Makes sense and thank you for conversing and answering my questions. :)
Sure, no worries.
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: ASUS PG27AQN, LG 48CX VR: Beyond, Quest 3, Reverb G2, Index OS: Windows 11 Pro Case: Fractal Design Torrent PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-1000 MB: ASUS Z790 Hero CPU: Intel i9-13900k w/Noctua NH-U12A GPU: GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC RAM: 32GB G.SKILL Trident Z5 DDR5 6400MHz CL32 SSDs: 2TB WD_BLACK SN850 (OS), 4TB WD_BLACK SN850X (Games) Keyboards: Wooting 60HE, Logitech G915 TKL Mice: Razer Viper Mini SE, Razer Viper 8kHz Sound: Creative Sound Blaster Katana V2 (speakers/amp/DAC), AFUL Performer 8 (IEMs)

life_at_1ms
Posts: 38
Joined: 31 Oct 2019, 03:20

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by life_at_1ms » 24 Jan 2022, 19:16

Will these Samsung QD OLEDs be better than all of the Eizo OLEDs out of the gate? I don't see why not - but then again, I figure there must be some basis for Eizo's high prices.

User avatar
jorimt
Posts: 2481
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44
Location: USA

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by jorimt » 24 Jan 2022, 21:39

life_at_1ms wrote:
24 Jan 2022, 19:16
Will these Samsung QD OLEDs be better than all of the Eizo OLEDs out of the gate? I don't see why not - but then again, I figure there must be some basis for Eizo's high prices.
Depends on what panel the Eizo uses.

As for price, I expect all OLED gaming monitors will, at the very least, be moderately more expensive than their equivalently specced LCD counterparts for the first couple of generations.

It's already known QD-OLED TVs will be more expensive than current-gen WOLED TVs, for instance. By how much is the question. There have been no official announcements on pricing for any of these QD-OLEDs as of yet.
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: ASUS PG27AQN, LG 48CX VR: Beyond, Quest 3, Reverb G2, Index OS: Windows 11 Pro Case: Fractal Design Torrent PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-1000 MB: ASUS Z790 Hero CPU: Intel i9-13900k w/Noctua NH-U12A GPU: GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC RAM: 32GB G.SKILL Trident Z5 DDR5 6400MHz CL32 SSDs: 2TB WD_BLACK SN850 (OS), 4TB WD_BLACK SN850X (Games) Keyboards: Wooting 60HE, Logitech G915 TKL Mice: Razer Viper Mini SE, Razer Viper 8kHz Sound: Creative Sound Blaster Katana V2 (speakers/amp/DAC), AFUL Performer 8 (IEMs)

DrR1pper
Posts: 61
Joined: 03 Aug 2015, 17:55

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by DrR1pper » 25 Jan 2022, 20:43

jorimt wrote:
23 Jan 2022, 18:52
I'm not saying what you're suggesting isn't ultimately possible with OLED in time, I'm saying, to my knowledge, it isn't viable with current consumer-level OLED tech, including the upcoming QD-OLEDs, and if it is, there's been no precedence to suggest it (feel free to share a source that shows OLED reaching anything above 200 nits full field), but we'll certainly see...
I just realised this monitor might have qualified....

Re-watching the HDTVTest video of the Alienware monitor, Vincent mentions that "HDR peak brightness has been spec'd at 250 nits full-field..."

phpBB [video]


I've never used a HDR monitor before, so I don't know what this means for non-HDR mode. Would this likely/logically also be the case for SDR mode?

From the above video, the still image of interest: the numbers in the yellow rectangle are supposedly for the Alienware monitor and don't even mention whether for HDR only or not.

Image

And the display Linus Tech Tip were invited to see and measure was for the TV version (which aligns with the quoted numbers above the yellow rectangle in the above image).

Image

What do you think?
Last edited by DrR1pper on 26 Jan 2022, 03:21, edited 1 time in total.

DrR1pper
Posts: 61
Joined: 03 Aug 2015, 17:55

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by DrR1pper » 26 Jan 2022, 02:16

I'm thinking the luminance chart might look something like the blue line given data points.

Image

Image

User avatar
jorimt
Posts: 2481
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44
Location: USA

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by jorimt » 26 Jan 2022, 08:54

DrR1pper wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 20:43
What do you think?
He said "HDR" peak brightness, so SDR, at least out-of-box, will probably be lower, but I think it still doesn't matter where high achievable strobing brightness is concerned; we already have LCD gaming monitor that reach 350-400+ nits full field SDR that support strobing, like the Blur Buster Approved Viewsonic models, and even those still aren't bright enough for the average gamer when the more extreme (and highly tuned) strobing modes are engaged.

Thus, even if a QD-OLED could reach a full field brightness of 250 nits in SDR mode, once any level of strobing that is worth using (where MPRT is concerned) is engaged, full field will still be brought down to 100 nits or lower.

To reach the ridiculous SDR nit levels gamers are used to (the original SDR standard was intended for 100 nits full field max) when a low MPRT strobing mode is engaged, we're looking at the display needing to sustain at least 1000-2000 nits full field, and again, OLED ain't reaching that now (or perhaps ever).
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: ASUS PG27AQN, LG 48CX VR: Beyond, Quest 3, Reverb G2, Index OS: Windows 11 Pro Case: Fractal Design Torrent PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-1000 MB: ASUS Z790 Hero CPU: Intel i9-13900k w/Noctua NH-U12A GPU: GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC RAM: 32GB G.SKILL Trident Z5 DDR5 6400MHz CL32 SSDs: 2TB WD_BLACK SN850 (OS), 4TB WD_BLACK SN850X (Games) Keyboards: Wooting 60HE, Logitech G915 TKL Mice: Razer Viper Mini SE, Razer Viper 8kHz Sound: Creative Sound Blaster Katana V2 (speakers/amp/DAC), AFUL Performer 8 (IEMs)

jasswolf
Posts: 68
Joined: 23 Jan 2020, 05:09

Re: Samsung QD OLED

Post by jasswolf » 26 Jan 2022, 22:58

I mean given the reduction in light diffusion through the improved design, wouldn't 200-220 nits SDR deliver a great basic BFI result for most use cases?

SDR is mastered for 100 nits.

Post Reply