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Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 05 Oct 2017, 09:26
by VinnyM
Chief Blur Buster wrote:Did you have very good, smooth looking 144Hz before? Most of the "I had smooth 144Hz before but now I have stuttery 144Hz" problems tends to get fixed via a refresh software redo of the system.

Did you try:
-- Uninstall and reinstall graphics drivers? (don't just reinstall -- do a full uninstall first)
-- Reinstall the OS?

Also, accidental changes to detail levels can add to stuttering. If this is a possible cause, you may want to turn off all AA and use factory default graphics-detail settings, to get closer to what you used to have before at the same refresh rate. Many settings, including shader settings, shadow settings, AA settings, view-distance settings, can all add to increased stutters. You might have some kind of a framepacing issue. The same frame rate can be much more stuttery if it has very bad frame pacing.

Long-term, you might also want to consider a VRR monitor (G-SYNC or FreeSync) -- since variable refresh rate is much more forgiving of certain kinds of frame pacing issues (as long as gametime and frame visiblity time stays in sync, the pacing can be even random as long as it's synchronous between the game and refresh cycles -- and stutter is still hidden by the variable refresh rate nature)
-Yes I've uninstalled my graphic drivers using DDU.
-First thing that I've tried was reinstall the OS.
Well, there's no way to solve these frame pacing issues without using any kind of sync? The G2460PF is a freesync monitor, but I got NVidia GPU.
The thing is that I used to play 144hz smooth as silk, about the settings, I've tried almost all, (I used to have "Balanced" on nvidia control painel, tried that too, but didnt help)
You think that maybe my gpu is causing that? Since the framerates test / HZ test are OK (hz test show 143.9998 but I dont think that's the problem, right?)
I'm kind desperately trying to find a reason to this,
There's anything that I can do to help you understand my problem better?

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 05 Oct 2017, 13:32
by Chief Blur Buster
VinnyM wrote:Well, there's no way to solve these frame pacing issues without using any kind of sync? The G2460PF is a freesync monitor, but I got NVidia GPU. The thing is that I used to play 144hz smooth as silk, about the settings, I've tried almost all, (I used to have "Balanced" on nvidia control painel, tried that too, but didnt help)
(A) Can you test http://www.testufo.com/frameskipping again at all refresh rates (60Hz, 100Hz, 120Hz and 144Hz).
I'm trying to cover all bases, leave no stone unturned, just in case the game is switching refresh rates (different from desktop), and only one refresh rate is frameskipping. Ideally, I'd like you to post a photograph of each refresh rate, but 144Hz will do.

(B) Did you ever fiddle with a Custom Resolution Utility before? Try uninstalling all changes.
(e.g. If you tried ToastyX CRU.exe, try running the "reset-all.exe" utility to uninstall the settings you changed via CRU.)

(C) Failing the above;
-- Can you also turn on/off FreeSync via the monitor menus?
-- Can you reset monitor to factory defaults?
-- Try unplug-and-replug (that sometimes made a difference for a different kind of problem; it cleared a corrupted picture setting on certain monitors that was being kept in a sort of RAM).
There might be some bug-triggering behaviour, e.g. switching GPUs from a FreeSync to a non-FreeSync GPU, and the monitor is still remembering the old FreeSync GPU. This probably isn't it, I'm currently just guessing at longshot-fixes.

Let me know what you find out.

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 06 Oct 2017, 15:19
by VinnyM
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
VinnyM wrote:Well, there's no way to solve these frame pacing issues without using any kind of sync? The G2460PF is a freesync monitor, but I got NVidia GPU. The thing is that I used to play 144hz smooth as silk, about the settings, I've tried almost all, (I used to have "Balanced" on nvidia control painel, tried that too, but didnt help)
(A) Can you test http://www.testufo.com/frameskipping again at all refresh rates (60Hz, 100Hz, 120Hz and 144Hz).
I'm trying to cover all bases, leave no stone unturned, just in case the game is switching refresh rates (different from desktop), and only one refresh rate is frameskipping. Ideally, I'd like you to post a photograph of each refresh rate, but 144Hz will do.

(B) Did you ever fiddle with a Custom Resolution Utility before? Try uninstalling all changes.
(e.g. If you tried ToastyX CRU.exe, try running the "reset-all.exe" utility to uninstall the settings you changed via CRU.)

(C) Failing the above;
-- Can you also turn on/off FreeSync via the monitor menus?
-- Can you reset monitor to factory defaults?
-- Try unplug-and-replug (that sometimes made a difference for a different kind of problem; it cleared a corrupted picture setting on certain monitors that was being kept in a sort of RAM).
There might be some bug-triggering behaviour, e.g. switching GPUs from a FreeSync to a non-FreeSync GPU, and the monitor is still remembering the old FreeSync GPU. This probably isn't it, I'm currently just guessing at longshot-fixes.

Let me know what you find out.

Really thx for the fast replys, I'll gather those information and post here, I just dont know if I can do it this weekend.

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 07 Nov 2017, 11:51
by VinnyM
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
VinnyM wrote:Well, there's no way to solve these frame pacing issues without using any kind of sync? The G2460PF is a freesync monitor, but I got NVidia GPU. The thing is that I used to play 144hz smooth as silk, about the settings, I've tried almost all, (I used to have "Balanced" on nvidia control painel, tried that too, but didnt help)
(A) Can you test http://www.testufo.com/frameskipping again at all refresh rates (60Hz, 100Hz, 120Hz and 144Hz).
I'm trying to cover all bases, leave no stone unturned, just in case the game is switching refresh rates (different from desktop), and only one refresh rate is frameskipping. Ideally, I'd like you to post a photograph of each refresh rate, but 144Hz will do.

(B) Did you ever fiddle with a Custom Resolution Utility before? Try uninstalling all changes.
(e.g. If you tried ToastyX CRU.exe, try running the "reset-all.exe" utility to uninstall the settings you changed via CRU.)

(C) Failing the above;
-- Can you also turn on/off FreeSync via the monitor menus?
-- Can you reset monitor to factory defaults?
-- Try unplug-and-replug (that sometimes made a difference for a different kind of problem; it cleared a corrupted picture setting on certain monitors that was being kept in a sort of RAM).
There might be some bug-triggering behaviour, e.g. switching GPUs from a FreeSync to a non-FreeSync GPU, and the monitor is still remembering the old FreeSync GPU. This probably isn't it, I'm currently just guessing at longshot-fixes.

Let me know what you find out.
Sorry for taking too much time, I worked alot those days..
Soo...
A) I've tested, and all photos look great (just like the perfect example)
B)No, I never used
C)Cant turn on/off in monitor
I've reset and didnt work
Yes I did those too, and payed for a total clean (bcs the guy did this while I was at work, soo, no time spent without my pc hehe)
BTW, I did some video to show, what is my problem
https://gfycat.com/gifs/detail/FlamboyantVioletCrayfish
Is those microstuttering... I dont care too much about the tearing, but the microstuttering hurts my eye.

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 09 Nov 2017, 13:00
by Chief Blur Buster
VinnyM wrote:Is those microstuttering... I dont care too much about the tearing, but the microstuttering hurts my eye.
Your prescription is variable refresh rate. Either FreeSync or G-SYNC.

FreeSync is cheaper and much more common, while G-SYNC often has a premium that also pays for other non-G-GSYNC things too (ULMB strobing, better overdrive, sometimes lower lag etc). Going either way will fix this type of micro stuttering.

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 09 Nov 2017, 17:02
by VinnyM
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
VinnyM wrote:Is those microstuttering... I dont care too much about the tearing, but the microstuttering hurts my eye.
Your prescription is variable refresh rate. Either FreeSync or G-SYNC.

FreeSync is cheaper and much more common, while G-SYNC often has a premium that also pays for other non-G-GSYNC things too (ULMB strobing, better overdrive, sometimes lower lag etc). Going either way will fix this type of micro stuttering.
Are you saying that this that I have, is caused by the monitor, and not by the GPU?
I was about to buy another GPU

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 10 Nov 2017, 20:56
by Sparky
VinnyM wrote:
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
VinnyM wrote:Is those microstuttering... I dont care too much about the tearing, but the microstuttering hurts my eye.
Your prescription is variable refresh rate. Either FreeSync or G-SYNC.

FreeSync is cheaper and much more common, while G-SYNC often has a premium that also pays for other non-G-GSYNC things too (ULMB strobing, better overdrive, sometimes lower lag etc). Going either way will fix this type of micro stuttering.

Are you saying that this that I have, is caused by the monitor, and not by the GPU?

I was about to buy another GPU
The phrasing there is a bit questionable, but yes. Feeding a fixed refresh rate monitor with a variable or unmatched framerate source will cause stutter/judder. V-sync can eliminate stutter by rate limiting the source, but it adds latency, and the workarounds to reduce that latency can reintroduce stutter due to inconsistent frame times. The solution is to let the game run how it wants, with a monitor that can refresh as new frames arrive, instead of on a fixed schedule(g-sync or freesync).

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 13 Nov 2017, 17:11
by VinnyM
Sparky wrote:
VinnyM wrote:
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
VinnyM wrote:Is those microstuttering... I dont care too much about the tearing, but the microstuttering hurts my eye.
Your prescription is variable refresh rate. Either FreeSync or G-SYNC.

FreeSync is cheaper and much more common, while G-SYNC often has a premium that also pays for other non-G-GSYNC things too (ULMB strobing, better overdrive, sometimes lower lag etc). Going either way will fix this type of micro stuttering.

Are you saying that this that I have, is caused by the monitor, and not by the GPU?

I was about to buy another GPU
The phrasing there is a bit questionable, but yes. Feeding a fixed refresh rate monitor with a variable or unmatched framerate source will cause stutter/judder. V-sync can eliminate stutter by rate limiting the source, but it adds latency, and the workarounds to reduce that latency can reintroduce stutter due to inconsistent frame times. The solution is to let the game run how it wants, with a monitor that can refresh as new frames arrive, instead of on a fixed schedule(g-sync or freesync).
Hm got it,
But I`ve noticed the same problem even with V-Sync on,
BTW, the video that I linked, is with vsync.

Re: What should the test look like?

Posted: 26 Nov 2017, 17:05
by Chief Blur Buster
VinnyM wrote:Are you saying that this that I have, is caused by the monitor, and not by the GPU?
I was about to buy another GPU
A faster GPU will improve microstuttering.
But a variable refresh monitor will make a bigger difference in your particular situation.

You can do both. Get both a better GPU and a variable refresh rate monitor (GSYNC or FreeSync)
VinnyM wrote:But I`ve noticed the same problem even with V-Sync on,
BTW, the video that I linked, is with vsync.
VSYNC ON doesn't fix microstuttering if your framerate is lower than refresh rate. Frame rates less than refresh rate will often have stutter, and even a single frame drop (143fps at 144Hz) will even still have a noticeable stutter.

Also:
1. Are you testing VSYNC ON in older games such as CS:GO that runs at full frame rates (no frame rate slowdowns), and it still has microstutter even with keyboard strafe left/right?
2. Is your mouse turn left/right as smooth as keyboard strafe left/right? If mouse stutters more than keyboard, then fix your mouse to eliminate mouse microstutter factors. See Blur Busters Mouse Guide.