HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 02 Apr 2023, 23:41

Angel Soler wrote:
02 Apr 2023, 16:39
Hello everyone!!

I am a lifelong console gamer, but in the end I have decided to buy a powerful PC.
I have the XG 2431, and I think it's the best way to get its full potential.

Measured with the Leo Bodnar Test, the XG 2431 has 16.8 ms at 60 hz, in the custom configuration more in favor of low input lag.

My question is, in case anyone knows: How many milliseconds can I download using the Quick Frame Transport?
Because I understand that with QFT, I would have less lag at 60hz, right?
Yes, the maximal lag savings at 60Hz is (1/60sec - 1/240sec) = (4/240sec - 1/240sec) = 3/240sec lag reduction for the laggiest pixels. About 12ms less lag.

Since the screen is a latency gradient of [0..1/60sec] at normal 60Hz but comes a [0..1/240sec] at QFT 60Hz (DisplayPort ~VT4500 via ToastyX CRU Vertical Total Calculator).

So halftime lag, aka screen center, would be (3/240sec) divided by 2 = Approximately 6ms lag reduction for screen center, assuming you keep the strobe phase tight against the beginning of VBI (for quickest visibility of pixels). A slight adjustment to reduce bottom-edge crosstalk may reduce lag savings somewhat, but will not zero it out.

Also you can't test QFT with Leo Bodnar, as Leo Bodnar doesn't support QFT lag testing;
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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Angel Soler » 03 Apr 2023, 05:03

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
02 Apr 2023, 23:41
Angel Soler wrote:
02 Apr 2023, 16:39
Hello everyone!!

I am a lifelong console gamer, but in the end I have decided to buy a powerful PC.
I have the XG 2431, and I think it's the best way to get its full potential.

Measured with the Leo Bodnar Test, the XG 2431 has 16.8 ms at 60 hz, in the custom configuration more in favor of low input lag.

My question is, in case anyone knows: How many milliseconds can I download using the Quick Frame Transport?
Because I understand that with QFT, I would have less lag at 60hz, right?
Yes, the maximal lag savings at 60Hz is (1/60sec - 1/240sec) = (4/240sec - 1/240sec) = 3/240sec lag reduction for the laggiest pixels. About 12ms less lag.

Since the screen is a latency gradient of [0..1/60sec] at normal 60Hz but comes a [0..1/240sec] at QFT 60Hz (DisplayPort ~VT4500 via ToastyX CRU Vertical Total Calculator).

So halftime lag, aka screen center, would be (3/240sec) divided by 2 = Approximately 6ms lag reduction for screen center, assuming you keep the strobe phase tight against the beginning of VBI (for quickest visibility of pixels). A slight adjustment to reduce bottom-edge crosstalk may reduce lag savings somewhat, but will not zero it out.

Also you can't test QFT with Leo Bodnar, as Leo Bodnar doesn't support QFT lag testing;
Wow, that's a huge reduction!!
Such good news!!!
That is, it would stay at about 11 ms (that's wonderful. Below 15 ms, the lag is negligible).

I'm looking forward to buying the PC!!! Thank you very much Chief.

When I have the PC, surely, I will ask you any questions about the QFT configuration.

I had figured that I couldn't use the Bodnar Test in this case, since the Bodnar test doesn't support QFT. But your word and your knowledge of the subject are enough for me hahaha. Knowing that I'm going to have about 6 ms less, I can already estimate about 11 ms of lag, as I said before.

Thank you very much, again, for your time and kindness. Always ready to help. This is the best forum I've ever seen ☺️☺️💪💪💪.

Until next time ✋ !!

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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by GammaLyrae » 03 Apr 2023, 15:31

Did a bunch of experimenting on the steam deck with this monitor

Can't seem to get custom resolutions to stick. The APU and usb-c output can handle high refresh rates / high pixel clocks in general, but dialing in custom resolutions that I knew worked on my main desktop pc don't. As soon as I restart the driver, the monitor either disappears from the OS or it doesn't actually change to the custom resolution and windows / the driver now report a 1hz refresh rate.

I didn't do any testing to see if Linux fared any better since there isn't a Linux version of the strobe utility and it didn't seem worth mucking about with custom resolutions if I couldn't tune the settings at all. Could be it's a windows driver issue (the APU is only being used by valve for the steam deck and valve is the sole source of the custom drivers), could be a display port over usb c issue.

Definitely rejuvenated my interest in a display that has a pre-baked or automatic qft mode.

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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Angel Soler » 02 May 2023, 12:28

Hello Chief!

I need your help please.

I have already bought the computer and I am very happy.

I'm trying to do the QFT on the XG2431.

I have followed the "HOW TO" that you did and I get nothing. Everything remains exactly the same.

Could you please explain it in more detail?

Thank you so much

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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 03 May 2023, 10:50

Angel Soler wrote:
02 May 2023, 12:28
and I get nothing. Everything remains exactly the same.
Do you mean you have an unchanged Vertical Total?

By the way, there are multiple QFT HOWTOs and some of them might be out of date, or needs to be updated.

Are you using the Vertical Total Calculator (feature name) of ToastyX Custom Resolution Utility? That's the newest and easiest, saves a lot of steps.
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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Tbake » 03 May 2023, 11:09

I have had great success with Apex legends at 1080p 120hz on the XG2431 using Large Vertical Totals.

Until recently, I ran into an issue getting RTSS to show me in game the correct large total, instead of the normal total. if i steer the line within 1 of the normal total the Present sometimes shoots to the Large Vertical Total max but never shows correctly on the total.

I believe it to be the difference in windows 10 and windows 11, or either my change from Intel to AMD. Graphics card is the same between chips. The Large Vertical Total I set up is working, as it shows the correct number within PureXP.

Has anyone ran into this issue with rtss? should i assume it is still working correctly and still put the tearline just below bottom. It does seem to act normal most of the time, but i do see it hit 119 and stay for longer than it use to before my above changes. i have also set up 110hz and 85hz, they all show the same incorrect information in game.

The past few years ive obsessed over getting Apex to run perfectly on my aging 1080 ti and like I said above I have had great success with the help of these Forums.

Chief, Thank you for facilitating a place and sharing the knowledge you have gained.

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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Shing0 » 03 May 2023, 12:25

Is there anyway to improve 240hz strobing ?

I've tried to do with the custom preset but the result is nowhere near close to 100hz or 120hz.

Using Extreme preset on 240hz still produces blur and causes me eyestrain while playing on 240fps.

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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 03 May 2023, 14:33

Shing0 wrote:
03 May 2023, 12:25
Is there anyway to improve 240hz strobing ?

I've tried to do with the custom preset but the result is nowhere near close to 100hz or 120hz.

Using Extreme preset on 240hz still produces blur and causes me eyestrain while playing on 240fps.
Laws of physics dictate that crosstalk is always worse at higher refresh rate than at lower refresh rate.

Alas, this affects all LCD panels. Even BenQ XL2546 and XL2566 looks clearer for framerate=Hz situations at 100fps 100Hz than at 240fps 240Hz.
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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 03 May 2023, 14:34

Tbake wrote:
03 May 2023, 11:09
Chief, Thank you for facilitating a place and sharing the knowledge you have gained.
Thank you for the compliment! Especially needed in times like these.
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Re: HOWTO: Settings For Full Panel Crosstalk-Free Low-Lag Strobing (ViewSonic XG2431)

Post by Shing0 » 04 May 2023, 07:11

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
03 May 2023, 14:33
Laws of physics dictate that crosstalk is always worse at higher refresh rate than at lower refresh rate.

Alas, this affects all LCD panels. Even BenQ XL2546 and XL2566 looks clearer for framerate=Hz situations at 100fps 100Hz than at 240fps 240Hz.
Should I bother with tinkering 120hz-180hz ? Or just use extreme preset @240hz. I don't have any equipment to measure latency and I am not sure the difference would be significant enough between those settings. For competitive titles, like apex legends.

Btw the other day I booted the pc like always and scanlines appeared they didn't go unless I power off/on the xg2431. Happened 2 times any idea why it happens ? Thanks Chief.

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