Breaking the Source engine

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Traveler
Posts: 75
Joined: 20 Jan 2023, 22:06

Breaking the Source engine

Post by Traveler » 28 Jan 2023, 13:17

Hello everyone!

I am curious to know how many frames per second is needed to "break" CS:GO?
Is there anyone here who tried this and pushed this game well above 1000 fps on their high-end PC?
CS 1.6 (GoldSrc engine) for example, can't utilize more than one CPU thread and at 1200 - 1500 fps (even 999 fps) is completely broken -- normal movement is impossible, let alone jumping or bhoping. It creates something that looks like high ping lag at that point, it teleports a player back to his starting position.
So, how far would CS:GO had to be pushed to experience the same thing?

forcedreg
Posts: 42
Joined: 02 Aug 2019, 04:52

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by forcedreg » 28 Jan 2023, 14:10

Around 1100 it starts to glitch your movement. It looks similar to old ping related rubberbanding where your client goes faster than the server so you get teleported backwards all the time when the server updates.

Traveler
Posts: 75
Joined: 20 Jan 2023, 22:06

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Traveler » 28 Jan 2023, 14:28

forcedreg wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 14:10
Around 1100 it starts to glitch your movement. It looks similar to old ping related rubberbanding where your client goes faster than the server so you get teleported backwards all the time when the server updates.
Does that happen on both 64 and 128 tick servers once it goes to about 1100 fps?

Boop
Posts: 134
Joined: 08 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Boop » 28 Jan 2023, 14:30

Traveler wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 13:17
CS 1.6 (GoldSrc engine) for example, can't utilize more than one CPU thread and at 1200 - 1500 fps (even 999 fps) is completely broken -- normal movement is impossible, let alone jumping or bhoping. It creates something that looks like high ping lag at that point, it teleports a player back to his starting position.
Not really answering your question here but just adding to the thread.

Seems like there's quite a few older games that have issues with really high framerates when playing online. Unreal Tournament 2004, CS 1.6/HLDM, Quake 3, etc. The rubberbanding/teleporting basically makes it unplayable. If you create a LAN server, you don't teleport around at high fps, so it's really related to the game server not keeping up with the client.

For CS 1.6, I have a keybind that caps my FPS at 100 with my knife out, and then at 500fps when I have a gun out. I don't experience any teleporting issues and movement works fine.

Traveler
Posts: 75
Joined: 20 Jan 2023, 22:06

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Traveler » 28 Jan 2023, 15:10

Boop wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 14:30
Not really answering your question here but just adding to the thread.

Seems like there's quite a few older games that have issues with really high framerates when playing online. Unreal Tournament 2004, CS 1.6/HLDM, Quake 3, etc. The rubberbanding/teleporting basically makes it unplayable. If you create a LAN server, you don't teleport around at high fps, so it's really related to the game server not keeping up with the client.

For CS 1.6, I have a keybind that caps my FPS at 100 with my knife out, and then at 500fps when I have a gun out. I don't experience any teleporting issues and movement works fine.
I guess CS:S would then have the same fps threshold like CS:GO (around 1100 fps) before it "breaks" on community servers.
So it's not game engine related, it's server related.

For a while now UT2004 or any UT for that matter can't be played online in multiplayer mode anyways (EPIC games doing heavy drugs again) 🤦🏻‍♂️

You're telling me you're useing a script to switch between fps numbers in CS 1.6 only to avoid glitches and rubberbanding?

Also, what is the reason developers choose to make a default cap at a certain number (CS 1.6 is only 100 fps) when that is not always the best for achieving competitive advantage in every game?

Boop
Posts: 134
Joined: 08 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Boop » 28 Jan 2023, 15:55

Traveler wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 15:10
For a while now UT2004 or any UT for that matter can't be played online in multiplayer mode anyways (EPIC games doing heavy drugs again) 🤦🏻‍♂️
The community created their own master servers so everyone can still play. You just need to modify the ini files for the game to point at the new master servers. I just use gametracker.com as a server browser though.
You're telling me you're useing a script to switch between fps numbers in CS 1.6 only to avoid glitches and rubberbanding?
This is in my CS 1.6 config file. If you hit 3 on your keyboard to pull out the knife, FPS will drop to 100 so you can bunnyhop and jump around like normal -- no slowdown when you land.

fps_max "500"
fps_override "1"
bind "1" "slot1;fps_override 1"
bind "2" "slot2;fps_override 1"
bind "3" "slot3;fps_override 0"
bind "4" "slot4;fps_override 1"
bind "5" "slot5;fps_override 1"
Also, what is the reason developers choose to make a default cap at a certain number (CS 1.6 is only 100 fps) when that is not always the best for achieving competitive advantage in every game?
Probably to hide bugs with physics/movement/netcode/audio/graphics.

Traveler
Posts: 75
Joined: 20 Jan 2023, 22:06

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Traveler » 28 Jan 2023, 16:19

Boop wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 15:55
The community created their own master servers so everyone can still play. You just need to modify the ini files for the game to point at the new master servers. I just use gametracker.com as a server browser though.
Thanks for that info.
Is it for UT2004 only?
This is in my CS 1.6 config file. If you hit 3 on your keyboard to pull out the knife, FPS will drop to 100 so you can bunnyhop and jump around like normal -- no slowdown when you land.

fps_max "500"
fps_override "1"
bind "1" "slot1;fps_override 1"
bind "2" "slot2;fps_override 1"
bind "3" "slot3;fps_override 0"
bind "4" "slot4;fps_override 1"
bind "5" "slot5;fps_override 1"
Cool.. but, why is your max fps 500?
Probably to hide bugs with physics/movement/netcode/audio/graphics.
Makes sense.

Boop
Posts: 134
Joined: 08 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Boop » 29 Jan 2023, 02:51

Traveler wrote:
28 Jan 2023, 16:19
Thanks for that info.
Is it for UT2004 only?
There are guides to get multiplayer working for all of them.

Link here with the guides
https://www.reddit.com/r/unrealtourname ... _shutdown/
Cool.. but, why is your max fps 500?
Stable and no teleporting.

Traveler
Posts: 75
Joined: 20 Jan 2023, 22:06

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Traveler » 29 Jan 2023, 08:15

Boop wrote:
29 Jan 2023, 02:51
There are guides to get multiplayer working for all of them.

Link here with the guides
https://www.reddit.com/r/unrealtourname ... _shutdown/
👌🏻
Stable and no teleporting.
Does it bring some extra competitive advantage in comparison to running 100 fps all the time.. like, lower latency/delay ect.?
Did you test it yourself and found out 500 fps is highest you can go without introducing trouble?

Boop
Posts: 134
Joined: 08 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: Breaking the Source engine

Post by Boop » 30 Jan 2023, 04:14

Traveler wrote:
29 Jan 2023, 08:15
Does it bring some extra competitive advantage in comparison to running 100 fps all the time.. like, lower latency/delay ect.?
Did you test it yourself and found out 500 fps is highest you can go without introducing trouble?
Yes, there is a competitive advantage. The system latency reduction is very noticeable. I can go higher than 500fps in CS1.6 but in some servers I will teleport.
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I did some testing in CS 1.6 with Nvidia Reflex Analyzer on a 360Hz display and was getting around 4ms system latency (mouse click latency included) at very high FPS (1500+fps).

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