Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 23 Feb 2014, 02:06

Haste wrote:Given the info I gathered thanks to this site. I would have imagined that in terms of motion performances the order would rather go like this:
Depends on what variables you measure.
Clarity? Colors? Brightness?

When I play Bioshock Infinite -- guess which monitor I use?
I move my other monitor to the other table, and push the my ASUS GSYNC monitor to the side, and put the Eizo FG2421 in its place. Although it uses a medium-persistence strobe with a very minor (annoying) double-strobe, the deliciously saturated 5000:1 color out-saturates LightBoosts' 500:1 contrast ratio by an order of magnitude more colorfulness, darker blacks, with a brighter image of >200cd/m2 during strobe-mode. I find solo games, 120fps@120Hz massively more enjoyable. Yes, the FG2421 would be EVEN better if the dumb double-strobe wasn't there, and I could adjust the persistence of the main strobe. But at the end of the day, the combination of brightness+colorfulness+contrast+strobing wins out. I have to send the FG2421 back soon (it's a loaner), but I will likely be personally buying it, at least as a strobed VA example to compare against.

Now, if you want low persistence and low input lag, the FG2421 gets moved to the side, and I'm putting my ASUS GSYNC monitor or another monitor such as BENQ XL2720Z back into its place. If I adjust the XL2720Z to 1-millisecond persistence, it is literally 5 times dimmer than the FG2421, square inch per square inch. But if set to equal persistence (~2ms-ish), it's still dimmer than a FG2421 Turbo240 at maximum brightness.

And the strobe crosstalk (double-image effect issue) on the XL2720Z(fixed version) / ULMB / LightBoost is surprisingly actually not significantly worse from the strobe crosstalk of a warmed-up (45+ minutes) EIZO FG2421, since the VA pixels start responding much faster on a hot panel. (Hint to future 120Hz VA monitor manufacturers: add a 10 watt heater coil behind the panel -- yes I know monitor manufacturers read Blur Busters Forums nowadays. Some of them even registered, too (e.g. ASUSTECHMKT)....) The EIZO FG2421 has more lag, but surprisngly small difference in strobe crosstalk for top/bottom edge, something I can't say for LightBoost/ULMB/BENQ (even firmware-fixed) which actually sort of compensates for the minor double-strobe effect, which creates only a much fainter double-image effect that's only 1/2 the separation (due to 1/240sec offset of strobe). I wish that double strobe wasn't there, but at the end of the day, the Eizo FG2421 has become my favourite solo gaming monitor, as the motion clarity is the most CRT-like in overall appearance (colors+brightness+strobe), if you can tolerate other panel quirks (e.g. VA gamma uniformity issues during dark colors, slightly more lag than others). There's no perfect panel, so you have to choose what you are the most sensitive to (e.g. colors vs clarity, etc).
Haste wrote:(subtle hint to Mark for a new article ;) )
Definitely. The BENQ controversy has distracted me quite a bit, and the sudden arrival of GSYNC in December did delay things. But I've got the long-overdue EIZO FG2421 review 75% complete now (finally!). It will be even better had I released the BENQ XL2720Z review too, but that's still on hold until the newer-firmware is in ambundance.
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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by MrBrown » 23 Feb 2014, 10:45

So have you received the fixed Firmware for XL2720Z and were able to test it Chief?

How does G-Sync work on the Z series? What happens if the framerate is higher than 144 fps at times? I suppose it shouldnt have a too big effect, right?

I dont care about benq motion blur thing, just care about G-sync. But I will still wait until the Rev. 2 comes out with overall fixed FW.
Falkentynes BenQ Service Menu thread: http://forums.blurbusters.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2467

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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 23 Feb 2014, 15:05

MrBrown wrote:So have you received the fixed Firmware for XL2720Z and were able to test it Chief?
Yes, I've tested it. It requires facility upgrade, or special hardware, so you have to send the monitor away to get the firmware updated. That's why I had made several recommendations in the past about waiting to purchase. See the main XL2720Z thread for my observations.
MrBrown wrote:How does G-Sync work on the Z series? What happens if the framerate is higher than 144 fps at times? I suppose it shouldnt have a too big effect, right?
The Z-series does not have GSYNC.
You are thinking of the G-series. The upcoming XL2420G, will have GSYNC, with the better ULMB strobing developed by NVIDIA.

Thanks!
Mark Rejhon
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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by ballen123 » 23 Feb 2014, 21:38

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
MrBrown wrote:So have you received the fixed Firmware for XL2720Z and were able to test it Chief?
Yes, I've tested it. It requires facility upgrade, or special hardware, so you have to send the monitor away to get the firmware updated. That's why I had made several recommendations in the past about waiting to purchase. See the main XL2720Z thread for my observations.
MrBrown wrote:How does G-Sync work on the Z series? What happens if the framerate is higher than 144 fps at times? I suppose it shouldnt have a too big effect, right?
The Z-series does not have GSYNC.
You are thinking of the G-series. The upcoming XL2420G, will have GSYNC, with the better ULMB strobing developed by NVIDIA.

Thanks!
Mark Rejhon

When do you think the XL2420G will come?

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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 23 Feb 2014, 21:45

ballen123 wrote:When do you think the XL2420G will come?
Honestly, I'm not sure, but several GSYNC monitors will take several months to arrive, as NVIDIA is quite busy working with many vendors at this moment.
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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by ballen123 » 23 Feb 2014, 22:08

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
ballen123 wrote:When do you think the XL2420G will come?
Honestly, I'm not sure, but several GSYNC monitors will take several months to arrive, as NVIDIA is quite busy working with many vendors at this moment.
Ok, so no quarter 1 then ;( I will probably buy a used xl2411 for around 150 bucks until something awesome drops.

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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by Serrin » 04 Mar 2014, 16:18

For me its Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z as well.

I have the following experience:

After my CRT I switched to a 60Hz Tft (22" 16:10 from LG) that I still use. This screen is totally average and not very good for fast paced games.

Now I tried the following screens (and I did not try Lightboost):

Benq XL2420 (one of the first models):
- Colors at 120Hz: Okayish
- Coating back then was too strong for me (I think the new models have soft coating)
- Got headaches from flickering (which it had back then), thats why I turned it back
- Gaming in 120Hz mode was a lot better compared to my screen

Asus VG248QE
- Colors where totally blank at 144Hz (not so bad at 60Hz...), thats why I turned it back
- Did not get headaches, maybe it had a higher PWM frequency
- Gaming in 144Hz was even better than with the Benq

Then I wanted to try out an IPS screen because of the nice color quality:

Benq BL2411T
- Colors were awsome
- Had about the same blur as my current screen (which was a little disappointing because my sceen is so old, but well 60Hz is 60Hz...)
- I didn't like the IPS Glow (it was not very strong but still not nice in dark games)
- Awesome screen if gaming is not the focus

Now at least I'm sure that I want a >= 120Hz screen, but I have never tried motion blur reduction with black frame insertion and I'm not sure if I will get headaches from it.

Which screen would you recommend if I wanted to play just in 120 / 144 Hz mode without black frame insertion (I would try that feature out of course, maybe I can stand the flicker but I fear that its not made for me)?
I would buy the Eizo but I don't know how good it will perform when not using turbo mode (I read that because of its panel type it is a little bit more blurry by nature) and at that price tag I want it to be a lot better than my 60Hz TN.

Just for reference, I only play online games, currently not very fast paced ones but that may change.
Or should I wait for a GSYNC screen? But that would mean that I would have to buy a NVIDIA card... ah desicions desicions ;)

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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 04 Mar 2014, 16:43

Serrin wrote:I would buy the Eizo but I don't know how good it will perform when not using turbo mode (I read that because of its panel type it is a little bit more blurry by nature) and at that price tag I want it to be a lot better than my 60Hz TN.
Even the non-Turbo 120Hz mode on the FG2421 is much better (on average) than a 60Hz TN, once the panel is warmed up. VA panels respond much faster when the panel isn't cold. There's a bit dark-grey ghosting than a TN, but everything else is much better than a 60Hz TN.

Now, if you get the XL2420Z, colors will be similiar to a VG248QE. The main reason you want the Xl2420Z is Blur Busters Strobe Utility, which makes the XL2420Z worth purchasing if you're a big-time LightBoost=10% lover and want something even clearer/better than that... If only there was a way to guarantee you won't get the earlier glitched units.

NOTE: Whether you like the Z-Series will depend on the monitor you are coming from / you are used to. If you are coming from IPS or a high end 60Hz TN, you may get dissapointed in color of 120Hz+. If you are coming from ASUS VG248QE LightBoost, you will find the fixed BENQ Z-Series monitors an upgrade relative to LightBoost. If color quality is numero uno, while having 120Hz, I'd heartily recommend the FG2421 despite its minor VA flaws and slightly higher input lag (since you don't seem to be a uber-competitive gamer) but still less average lag than a typical 60Hz monitor.
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Re: Eizo FG2421 vs BenQ XL2420Z

Post by Serrin » 05 Mar 2014, 13:46

Thank you very much for you help! I'll report back when I have a new screen, maybe it will help somebody in the evaluation process.

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