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Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

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Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby Scribblex » 18 Apr 2018, 17:00

Im in the market for a monitor stricky for competitive gaming. Im not looking for anything with gync since its bumping the price way too much. I have a couple of options starting with:

BenQ Zowie XL2540-most expensive one and most people seem to dislike it for whatever reason, also i saw it has input lag of 3,2ms which is lower then the rest. I like the blackness equlizer the most on this one and the low input lag

Alienware AW2518HF- I can get this for over 150$ cheaper in my country and even though i have a 1080Ti and cant use the freesync its still a strong contender just for the price, also saw in a site which reviews monitor that it has input lag of 6ms(only found one site which claims that)

ViewSonic XG2530-Almost got this one but stumbled on a site which measured input lag was over 10ms which i im not happy with even though the price was amazing. The panel and colors seem to be the best on this model.

AOC AGON AG251FZ- Doesnt seem to have blackequlizer but has its own version called "shadow control" input lag seems to be around 5,9 according to TFTCentral review it doesnt have anti motion blur tehnology

My system is 1080Ti, 6700k and i already have a dedicated monitor (PG279Q) just for browsing media and watching movies. This monitor is going to be used just for FPS shooters and other competitive games. Which one is the best in your opinion?
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby lexlazootin » 18 Apr 2018, 21:21

You have a 1080ti, 6700k and a PG279Q and G-Sync is too much?! :P

G-Sync will definitely help you out with pixel response when going with a 240hz as pixel response is the main issue with 240hz monitors at the moment.

Acer XB252Q, Alienware AW2518H tend to be the cheapest G-Sync 240hz, i know personally the Acer has a Black brightener thing and Alienware aswell. Most of the G-Sync 240hz are so similar it's not funny :P

Also comparing input latency from many websites is generally a really bad idea because they all test with different methods.
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby Scribblex » 18 Apr 2018, 23:35

I'm planing to use the monitor strictly for competitive gaming where every second counts. Doesn't turning on gsync involves some amount of input lag? Does gsync given me an advantage in competitive or no? Also what is pixel response is that such a major thing to have on a monitor where every second counts? Your suggestion is to squeeze more money and get a gsync version of whatever I'm buying? Sorry for so many questions I just really want the best I can get for my money. :)
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby lexlazootin » 19 Apr 2018, 00:00

I answered this a few hours ago in another thread but I'll copy and paste what i said here because i don't know how to link you to it :)
Pretty big misconception that annoys me because it's pretty much based in nothing.

G-Sync is a chip inside of the monitor that insures that you don't have any issues with frame skipping/input latency/pixel response. It's a way Nvidia can insure the monitor is performing pretty top notch with no issues. even if you don't use G-Sync the added bonus of the better response time is worth it for me. It's not like only G-Sync monitors can perform well but there are a lot of monitors currently that fail in one department or another.

Even if you think you won't like G-Sync i serious recommend you give it a go, Adaptive sync tech is pretty much all upsides with pretty much no downsides, it removes screen tearing and stuttering related to tearing with no added latency. The only reason people don't use it is because they are uninformed and believe it to be "bad" with no real reason behind it.

Just make sure if you enable G-Sync you cap your fps below your maximum refreshrate (like at 230fps) so that you don't just hit 240 and get V-Synced :P


As for the 'Pixel Response' part. Pixel response time is how quick the pixels on your monitor switch from one color to another, pretty much all manufactures try and speed up this process by pumping more voltage to the pixel to try and get it to switch faster but this can cause overshoot. It can be tricky to try and get this right and it's noticeably bad in 240hz monitors because of how quick they. The tuning needs to be near perfect for it to have ghosting or overshoot.

https://testufo.com/ghosting

You can test this effect on your monitor by going to this page.
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby Scribblex » 19 Apr 2018, 01:29

Well if that's the case why is there so much misinformation about it, also why don't the pros use it? I just want the absolute best in terms of competitive games. I don't care about bad colors or any of that stuff. I just want the most competitive advantage I can get :). Keeping that in mind what would you say is the absolute best monitor to get? I can also go the 144hz route if you feel that 240hz just aren't developed at this time i can wait a few more months until I get a 240hz display. In 144hz range I have the Viewsonic XG2402 and the Xl2411P as most easily bought in my country.
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 19 Apr 2018, 01:58

Scribblex wrote:BenQ Zowie XL2540-most expensive one and most people seem to dislike it for whatever reason, also i saw it has input lag of 3,2ms which is lower then the rest. I like the blackness equlizer the most on this one and the low input lag

ViewSonic XG2530-Almost got this one but stumbled on a site which measured input lag was over 10ms which i im not happy with even though the price was amazing. The panel and colors seem to be the best on this model.


In reality, the difference of these two monitors is less than approximately 3ms if the same methodology is used.
You can't compare lag numbers between 2 different websites due to different lag stopwatching methodology.
Only compare lag numbers within the same website.

Lag methodology will output different values for:
-- Lag from GPU-side to monitor pixels
-- Lag from monitor input to monitor pixels (excludes cable transmission overheads, e.g. +1ms)
-- Lag from mouse to monitor pixels
-- Lag from keyboard to monitor pixels

And screen location:
-- Lag from VBI to monitor top (ala VSYNC ON input lag)
-- Lag from VBI to monitor center (ala VSYNC ON input lag)
-- Lag from VBI to monitor bottom (ala VSYNC ON input lag)
-- Lag of pixel transmitted from GPU to corresponding pixel shown on monitor (more representative of VSYNC OFF input lag)

And how the lag tester starts the lag stopwatch:
-- Button press
-- Dongle on cable (VBI detector)
-- Black box (Leo Bodnar, etc)
-- API call (e.g. Direct3D Present() or OpenGL glutSwapBuffers)
-- etc.

And how the lag tester stops the stopwatch:
-- Photodiode on a specific location on screen (e.g. oscilloscope, Leo Bodnar, etc)
-- Differentials between two screens
-- First reaction anywhere on screen (e.g. high speed camera)

And how soon to stop the stopwatch
-- First GtG photons detectable
-- GtG 10% (recommended -- very human visible now by then)
-- GtG 50% (recommended)
-- GtG 90%
-- GtG 100% (artificially long, not recommended)
-- Undocumented (e.g. Leo Bodnar, ugh).

And other variables to keep in mind:
-- Lag of a specific Hz (varies from Hz to Hz)
-- Leo Bodnar Tester is lag of VSYNC ON 60Hz
-- SMTT 2.0 is lag-differential between two screens and runs 1000fps VSYNC OFF
-- Lag of VSYNC OFF is also very different from lag of VSYNC ON.

Also different behaviours:
-- VSYNC ON lag testers will have more lag at bottom edge than top edge for most screens
60Hz vs 240Hz have massive differences
-- VSYNC OFF lag testers (at high frame rates) will equalize lag throughout the screen, since VSYNC OFF is scanout-following
60Hz vs 240Hz have less differences, but due to frameslice lag gradients, MIN/AVG/MAX is tighter at 240Hz
-- VSYNC OFF adds a slight lag-randomization of (1/Hz)th of a second. Lag is lowest just right below a tearline. Lag is highest just right above a tearline. And because the lag jitter is a full refresh cycle due to the random tearline locations - this results in MIN/AVG/MAX becomes much tighter at higher Hz than lower Hz when using VSYNC OFF lag testers.
-- Etc.

Other than things like GtG and screen position -- one huge important difference is whether a site is using a VSYNC ON biased lag test method, or a VSYNC OFF biased lag test method.

Currently, sites that use Leo Bodnar or full-screen scanout (e.g. Leo Bodnar Tester, TomsHardware, DisplayLag) use VSYNC ON biased lag tester methods, and sites that use scanout-independent lag tests (SMTT 2.0 tester, TFTCentral, RTINGS.com) use VSYNC OFF biased lag tester methods.

Lag test methods with VSYNC ON bias: TomsHardware, DisplayLag.com
Lag test methods with VSYNC OFF bias: TFTCentral.co.uk, RTings.com
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter!
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby lexlazootin » 19 Apr 2018, 02:50

Scribblex wrote:Well if that's the case why is there so much misinformation about it, also why don't the pros use it? I just want the absolute best in terms of competitive games. I don't care about bad colors or any of that stuff. I just want the most competitive advantage I can get :). Keeping that in mind what would you say is the absolute best monitor to get? I can also go the 144hz route if you feel that 240hz just aren't developed at this time i can wait a few more months until I get a 240hz display. In 144hz range I have the Viewsonic XG2402 and the Xl2411P as most easily bought in my country.


Believe it or not, just because they are pros doesn't mean they know everything. They often believe in rubbish, you will still see some running 500hz on their mice and not use raw input because it adds "latency or filtering". Most of this has gone away at this point but Pros mostly focus on the game.

I told you what i think the best are, just get a G-Sync 240hz, they all have the same panel and they will all perform pretty much the same because they all use the same chip. The Acer/Alienware tend to be the cheapest.

I would totally not recommend the Xl2411P as the lower end Benq have brutally bad response times.
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby Scribblex » 19 Apr 2018, 03:10

Thank you for your time, il look into which one is the best to get price wise and if it has some type of 'gamer' features I could use. I already posted in another thread about the general best monitor to use but so far it's all the same advice it seems. Thank you once again for your input
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 19 Apr 2018, 11:55

lexlazootin wrote:I would totally not recommend the Xl2411P as the lower end Benq have brutally bad response times.

Right tool for the right job. Choose your tool wisely:

The XL2411P has quite great redeeming features:
- There is factory menu options to tweak the overdrive called "OD GAIN". The response looks much, much more decent when done. Annoying, but it helps.
- It does shine for console gaming - Really low 60Hz console lag. (All 240Hz monitors currently has more "60Hz lag" even if they are much lower lag at 240Hz)
- It is also one of the better "60Hz CRT simulation" (blur reduction for consoles) when using single-strobe mode, if you do not mind flicker. Zero blur for fast scrolling platformers. Not even ULMB or LightBoost can do this for consoles. It is currently creme de la creme if you loved CRT clarity, okay with somewhat dimmer picture, and are *fully* flicker-tolerant. Not perfect, but all other desktop 60Hz blur reduction options are worse than XL2411, XL2420 and XL2720 (unless you get a HDTV with a blur-reducing Game Mode)
- And is hugely calibrateable to better-than-ULMB crosstalk with Large Vertical Totals + Tweaking (Strobe Utility). At least at 120Hz and under. Not easy to get there, but I achieved less strobe crosstalk than ULMB with a careful strobe calibration + Large Vertical Totals that is fully end-user accessible.
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Re: Trying to choose which 240Hz monitor to buy

Postby lexlazootin » 19 Apr 2018, 18:10

woops, i didn't know they actually added anything to the XL2411P, i thought it was just the XL2411 with DP.
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