[Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Separate area for niche lag issues including unexpected causes and/or electromagnetic interference (ECC = retransmits = lag). Interference (EMI, EMF) of all kinds (wired, wireless, external, internal, environment, bad component) can cause error-correction latencies like a bad modem connection. Troubleshooting may require university degree. Your lag issue is likely not EMI. Please read this before entering sub-forum.
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IMPORTANT:
This subforum is for advanced users only. This separate area is for niche or unexpected lag issues such as electromagnetic interference (EMI, EMF, electrical, radiofrequency, etc). Interference of all kinds (wired, wireless, external, internal, environment, bad component) can cause error-correction (ECC) latencies like a bad modem connection, except internally in a circuit. ECC = retransmits = lag. Troubleshooting may require university degree. Your lag issue is likely not EMI.
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sunrisesineast
Posts: 24
Joined: 05 Oct 2021, 19:55

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by sunrisesineast » 01 Mar 2022, 14:49

Do cpu coolers emit EMI? I have a cheap no-brand cpu cooler on my intel cpu. I was wondering if replacing it with a higher quality cooler would have any effect on EMI.

Thatweirdinputlag
Posts: 305
Joined: 27 Aug 2021, 14:09

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by Thatweirdinputlag » 01 Mar 2022, 22:30

sunrisesineast wrote:
01 Mar 2022, 14:49
Do cpu coolers emit EMI? I have a cheap no-brand cpu cooler on my intel cpu. I was wondering if replacing it with a higher quality cooler would have any effect on EMI.
Technically anything that has voltage/current going through it will emit EMI. As the heatsink itself has no current going through it, but the fans connected to that heatsink do. Please do not go through this snake oil route though, I have changed my cooler before, changed all the fans on the case, changed the case itself and none of the above had any effect on reducing the input lag.
Rog Strix Z79i - Intel 13700K - 4090 OC ROG Strix - 7200 Trident G.Skill - 1TB SK Hynix Platinum P41 - 1000W ATX3.0 Asus Tuf - 34'' Odyssey OLED G8 - FinalMouse Tenz S/Pulsar Xlite V2 Mini - Wooting 60HE - Sennheiser HD 560s - Shure SM7b - GoXLR Mini

Scythe_
Posts: 3
Joined: 08 Feb 2022, 09:22

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by Scythe_ » 20 Mar 2022, 05:27

Hello,

I was describing my problem to some friends and one of them suggested it could be EMI. I've done some digging and found the thread but I'm currently in the process of elimination as I'm not quite sure it really is EMI.

My problem is that my game feels as though it has input lag however if I reset my BIOS to defaults, save and restart then re-apply my profile it's fixed. That doesn't sound like EMI to me but I'd like another opinion on the matter. It's not a Windows issue as I have reinstalled it several times already just to make sure. It's not a new thing either and I've noticed it for 2 years at minimum, as I started getting more into input lag, latency etc. (I ran 1440p / G-Sync on a GTX 1070 for 4 years so the input lag was quite high in hindsight, also a lower sensitivity with a heavier mouse (G502)).

I have a plan of attack for diagnosing my issue.
- Stock BIOS / No Overclocks
- Different wall outlet
- Trying a decent powerboard I have (lol)
- Trying another PSU (older one I have in a HTPC)
- Trying another CPU / Motherboard (HTPC one)

If all that fails then I can only assume it's an EMI issue, which really sucks. I guess a power conditioner or UPS would be worth looking into.

Thanks.

User avatar
dervu
Posts: 247
Joined: 17 Apr 2020, 18:09

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by dervu » 20 Mar 2022, 15:04

Scythe_ wrote:
20 Mar 2022, 05:27
Hello,

I was describing my problem to some friends and one of them suggested it could be EMI. I've done some digging and found the thread but I'm currently in the process of elimination as I'm not quite sure it really is EMI.

My problem is that my game feels as though it has input lag however if I reset my BIOS to defaults, save and restart then re-apply my profile it's fixed. That doesn't sound like EMI to me but I'd like another opinion on the matter. It's not a Windows issue as I have reinstalled it several times already just to make sure. It's not a new thing either and I've noticed it for 2 years at minimum, as I started getting more into input lag, latency etc. (I ran 1440p / G-Sync on a GTX 1070 for 4 years so the input lag was quite high in hindsight, also a lower sensitivity with a heavier mouse (G502)).

I have a plan of attack for diagnosing my issue.
- Stock BIOS / No Overclocks
- Different wall outlet
- Trying a decent powerboard I have (lol)
- Trying another PSU (older one I have in a HTPC)
- Trying another CPU / Motherboard (HTPC one)

If all that fails then I can only assume it's an EMI issue, which really sucks. I guess a power conditioner or UPS would be worth looking into.

Thanks.
Do not waste time and money buying whole bunch of useless hardware until you check your whole setup at another place that you know doesn't have any issues.
It will save you many headaches, because having hardware issues and EMI issues at the same time can drive you mad (hell, even EMI issues can do that easy).
If you can confirm it works perfect in another place, there is very high change it will be pointless to buy any of those things.
There are too many people who tried tons of different things without success.
Noone has definitive proof correlating some measurements with symptoms, so be careful with jumping to conclusions.

If it is EMI/RFI then whatever source is, it might be hard to filter it at your place, removing source of the issue is your best bet. Finding source is another story, but it would be best thing to get rid of it, since noone I know of had any kind of filter/device that would make it work. You can go step by step, checking your apartment, by disconnecting everything. Then it goes harder, if source is outside of your place.
Who knows, maybe something would work for you, but it is always risk. What you can read here and in many other places, it is always recurring issue. Someone buys something, it gets better, then worse again.

When you exclude hardware then:
If you have good relations with neighbours you can ask them if they use some weird devices, for example solar panel inverters, ethernet over power adapters and ask to disable them for short time to check. You can also try to correlate if someone is not present in their place with symptoms disappearing.
Generally it is good idea to look for correlations, patterns, what changed in your neighborhood, at your place in that time you started noticing symptoms.
Ryzen 7950X3D / MSI GeForce RTX 4090 Gaming X Trio / ASUS TUF GAMING X670E-PLUS / 2x16GB DDR5@6000 G.Skill Trident Z5 RGB / ASUS ROG SWIFT PG279QM / Logitech G PRO X SUPERLIGHT / SkyPAD Glass 3.0 / Wooting 60HE / DT 700 PRO X || EMI Input lag issue survivor

Scythe_
Posts: 3
Joined: 08 Feb 2022, 09:22

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by Scythe_ » 21 Mar 2022, 07:25

dervu wrote:
20 Mar 2022, 15:04
Scythe_ wrote:
20 Mar 2022, 05:27
Hello,

I was describing my problem to some friends and one of them suggested it could be EMI. I've done some digging and found the thread but I'm currently in the process of elimination as I'm not quite sure it really is EMI.

My problem is that my game feels as though it has input lag however if I reset my BIOS to defaults, save and restart then re-apply my profile it's fixed. That doesn't sound like EMI to me but I'd like another opinion on the matter. It's not a Windows issue as I have reinstalled it several times already just to make sure. It's not a new thing either and I've noticed it for 2 years at minimum, as I started getting more into input lag, latency etc. (I ran 1440p / G-Sync on a GTX 1070 for 4 years so the input lag was quite high in hindsight, also a lower sensitivity with a heavier mouse (G502)).

I have a plan of attack for diagnosing my issue.
- Stock BIOS / No Overclocks
- Different wall outlet
- Trying a decent powerboard I have (lol)
- Trying another PSU (older one I have in a HTPC)
- Trying another CPU / Motherboard (HTPC one)

If all that fails then I can only assume it's an EMI issue, which really sucks. I guess a power conditioner or UPS would be worth looking into.

Thanks.
Do not waste time and money buying whole bunch of useless hardware until you check your whole setup at another place that you know doesn't have any issues.
It will save you many headaches, because having hardware issues and EMI issues at the same time can drive you mad (hell, even EMI issues can do that easy).
If you can confirm it works perfect in another place, there is very high change it will be pointless to buy any of those things.
There are too many people who tried tons of different things without success.
Noone has definitive proof correlating some measurements with symptoms, so be careful with jumping to conclusions.

If it is EMI/RFI then whatever source is, it might be hard to filter it at your place, removing source of the issue is your best bet. Finding source is another story, but it would be best thing to get rid of it, since noone I know of had any kind of filter/device that would make it work. You can go step by step, checking your apartment, by disconnecting everything. Then it goes harder, if source is outside of your place.
Who knows, maybe something would work for you, but it is always risk. What you can read here and in many other places, it is always recurring issue. Someone buys something, it gets better, then worse again.

When you exclude hardware then:
If you have good relations with neighbours you can ask them if they use some weird devices, for example solar panel inverters, ethernet over power adapters and ask to disable them for short time to check. You can also try to correlate if someone is not present in their place with symptoms disappearing.
Generally it is good idea to look for correlations, patterns, what changed in your neighborhood, at your place in that time you started noticing symptoms.
Thanks for the response.

I have done more digging and investigating and found that Spread Spectrum can cause higher EMI when disabled. I will try leaving that on Auto and see how I go. Next would be to run stock, then a powerboard. Unfortunately I do not have family or friends nearby so testing it at another house will be tricky. As of right now it's feeling good and I'll keep a close eye on the times / dates it feels bad. I did try turning the PC off / unplugging it and the issue didn't re-occur which is promising.

For now it's a waiting game.

Headglitch123
Posts: 104
Joined: 08 Jan 2022, 09:01

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by Headglitch123 » 22 Mar 2022, 06:27

Scythe_ wrote:
21 Mar 2022, 07:25
dervu wrote:
20 Mar 2022, 15:04
Scythe_ wrote:
20 Mar 2022, 05:27
Hello,

I was describing my problem to some friends and one of them suggested it could be EMI. I've done some digging and found the thread but I'm currently in the process of elimination as I'm not quite sure it really is EMI.

My problem is that my game feels as though it has input lag however if I reset my BIOS to defaults, save and restart then re-apply my profile it's fixed. That doesn't sound like EMI to me but I'd like another opinion on the matter. It's not a Windows issue as I have reinstalled it several times already just to make sure. It's not a new thing either and I've noticed it for 2 years at minimum, as I started getting more into input lag, latency etc. (I ran 1440p / G-Sync on a GTX 1070 for 4 years so the input lag was quite high in hindsight, also a lower sensitivity with a heavier mouse (G502)).

I have a plan of attack for diagnosing my issue.
- Stock BIOS / No Overclocks
- Different wall outlet
- Trying a decent powerboard I have (lol)
- Trying another PSU (older one I have in a HTPC)
- Trying another CPU / Motherboard (HTPC one)

If all that fails then I can only assume it's an EMI issue, which really sucks. I guess a power conditioner or UPS would be worth looking into.

Thanks.
Do not waste time and money buying whole bunch of useless hardware until you check your whole setup at another place that you know doesn't have any issues.
It will save you many headaches, because having hardware issues and EMI issues at the same time can drive you mad (hell, even EMI issues can do that easy).
If you can confirm it works perfect in another place, there is very high change it will be pointless to buy any of those things.
There are too many people who tried tons of different things without success.
Noone has definitive proof correlating some measurements with symptoms, so be careful with jumping to conclusions.

If it is EMI/RFI then whatever source is, it might be hard to filter it at your place, removing source of the issue is your best bet. Finding source is another story, but it would be best thing to get rid of it, since noone I know of had any kind of filter/device that would make it work. You can go step by step, checking your apartment, by disconnecting everything. Then it goes harder, if source is outside of your place.
Who knows, maybe something would work for you, but it is always risk. What you can read here and in many other places, it is always recurring issue. Someone buys something, it gets better, then worse again.

When you exclude hardware then:
If you have good relations with neighbours you can ask them if they use some weird devices, for example solar panel inverters, ethernet over power adapters and ask to disable them for short time to check. You can also try to correlate if someone is not present in their place with symptoms disappearing.
Generally it is good idea to look for correlations, patterns, what changed in your neighborhood, at your place in that time you started noticing symptoms.
Thanks for the response.

I have done more digging and investigating and found that Spread Spectrum can cause higher EMI when disabled. I will try leaving that on Auto and see how I go. Next would be to run stock, then a powerboard. Unfortunately I do not have family or friends nearby so testing it at another house will be tricky. As of right now it's feeling good and I'll keep a close eye on the times / dates it feels bad. I did try turning the PC off / unplugging it and the issue didn't re-occur which is promising.

For now it's a waiting game.
Found out aswell that, clearing cmos, change nothing in bios except xmp, inputlag seems to be better then tweaking the shit out of your bios “”for lower latency”” 🤣

redveil19
Posts: 2
Joined: 27 Feb 2022, 14:39

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by redveil19 » 26 Mar 2022, 15:03

hi guys , just wanted to share my situation on the problem a little bit maybe it can help people. So i started having this issue in november 2020 some day for some reason , (To be clear and make sure we're on the same page my problem was an inconsistant input lag sometime mouse feeling would be perfect as it should be but sometime it felt like a bit delayed and slower too) a year ago this issue was more like 50% of input lag and 50% of perfect mouse feeling but since 3 months its basicly 95% input lag and 5% perfect mouses feeling. What i tried was : Different mouses , keyboards , monitors , cables , windows reinstalls , multiple windows/bios tweak ,bought a completely new pc and none of this fixed the issue. I started reading the problem could be electricity or emi so what i tried was trying my pc at others places. I tried 3 different locations and i had input lag there too so i made the conclusion the problem doesn't come from my home + i live in a recently built appartement in the middle of paris i never had any electricity issues and my legit only problem on my pc is the input lag , i have 0 other problem. Idk why but in my case when i plug in a new wireless mouse the input lag is still there but when i plug a new wired mouse the mouse feeling is perfect for 5 or 6 days and then its back to classic input lag slow mouse. Since i tried almost everything that could have fixed the issue + the input lag remains at 3 others location i'm starting to think something ''infected'' my pc. When i plugged my new pc 3 months ago the input lag issue came back after 3 days and then i tried everything i could to solve the issue but nothing works so i'm starting to think that something maybe in the electricity or maybe a peripheral or whatever infected my pc and after that the input lag will stay for ever on this pc. Its the only theory i can think of right now since trying my pc at others location doesn't work. To try if my theory is true ill rent a good pc for a month and try it at my brother's home he lives 5 minutes from mine , so plugging the pc in a different place for the first time and not plugging it in my home for the first time , if after 2 weeks the input lag doesn't comeback at my brother's home then ill try plugging it at my home and if the input lag comes back after a few days then ill be sure of my theory and look for a solution there

sunrisesineast
Posts: 24
Joined: 05 Oct 2021, 19:55

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by sunrisesineast » 01 Apr 2022, 09:13

I was playing around with my gpu voltage today and noticed that whenever I changed the voltage using msi afterburner, there was a short crackling/static noise in my headphones. What could be causing that?

Thatweirdinputlag
Posts: 305
Joined: 27 Aug 2021, 14:09

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by Thatweirdinputlag » 01 Apr 2022, 23:23

sunrisesineast wrote:
01 Apr 2022, 09:13
I was playing around with my gpu voltage today and noticed that whenever I changed the voltage using msi afterburner, there was a short crackling/static noise in my headphones. What could be causing that?
That's weird! What are your headphones connected to? Motherboard, Audio Interface or Monitor's Headphone Jack? Is your PC grounded?
Rog Strix Z79i - Intel 13700K - 4090 OC ROG Strix - 7200 Trident G.Skill - 1TB SK Hynix Platinum P41 - 1000W ATX3.0 Asus Tuf - 34'' Odyssey OLED G8 - FinalMouse Tenz S/Pulsar Xlite V2 Mini - Wooting 60HE - Sennheiser HD 560s - Shure SM7b - GoXLR Mini

sunrisesineast
Posts: 24
Joined: 05 Oct 2021, 19:55

Re: [Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag

Post by sunrisesineast » 02 Apr 2022, 05:02

Thatweirdinputlag wrote:
01 Apr 2022, 23:23
sunrisesineast wrote:
01 Apr 2022, 09:13
I was playing around with my gpu voltage today and noticed that whenever I changed the voltage using msi afterburner, there was a short crackling/static noise in my headphones. What could be causing that?
That's weird! What are your headphones connected to? Motherboard, Audio Interface or Monitor's Headphone Jack? Is your PC grounded?
Headphones connected to mobo via 3.5mm jack. Its onboard audio. Mobo is MSI H410m Pro-e. I believe my PC is grounded. The plug has a ground pin. PSU is attached to case with screws provided. They are painted black though so im not sure if they actually provide a connection. The underside of the scews look metallic. Is there a simple way to test whether my pc is properly grounded?


Also i believe there is some problem with the wiring in my apartment. Sometimes when my roommate turns off the lights/exhaust in the bathroom, i can hear a similar crackling noise in the same headphones connected to my laptop while plugged in (dont know if it occurs while unplugged). I googled and saw that this could be due to a ground loop.

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