VRR Flicker on AW3225QF

[RealNC]

But what if I don't use SK? Should I just enable it in NVCP in that case? I am looking for a global setting where I don't have to mess around all the time depending on the game.

You can do whatever you want, I'm just saying that global vsync override in the driver can cause weird issues. You can still do it if you don't notice anything weird, like VRR flicker on the desktop or stutter in normal apps when you alt+tab out of the game.

[Duskfall]

Just wondering why all the Gsync tutorials still recommend to force it in NVCP... but as far as issue goes I didn't notice anything strange.

[jorimt]

Just wondering why all the Gsync tutorials still recommend to force it in NVCP... but as far as issue goes I didn't notice anything strange.

My NVCP V-SYNC with G-SYNC recommendation applies primarily to use with exclusive fullscreen-style flip models.

[Duskfall]

I think I just settle for Gsync+Vsync+LLM Ultra (or Reflex if available) in control panel and Vsync off in game.

[Bayov]

It's hard to tell at 240Hz, that's true. Although it depends on the FPS. At 90FPS for example, you can tell. Once you get to around 110-120 or so, it becomes harder to tell. With very high FPS (170+), judder is so minor that I can't even notice unless I focus on it.

However, if you're prepared to pay an input lag penalty, you can run 144Hz instead of 240Hz and keep g-sync enabled. Cap to around 120FPS or so. This does not eliminate flicker, but reduces it (because during stutters, the display doesn't jump all the way up to 240Hz, but only up to 144Hz.)

If that's still not good enough and you keep g-sync off, and you normally use lower FPS caps like I do (usually 90FPS to 120FPS, never above that,) another option is to use SpecialK for the FPS cap and choose a fractional FPS cap with normal vsync. To do that, you need to select the "normal" limiter, and right-click on the FPS cap entry bar and select one of the fractional caps (1/2, 1/3, etc.) At 240Hz you can use 60/80/120FPS, at 180Hz you can use 60 or 90FPS. This is what I do for games that have too much flicker:


SK_fractional_cap.png


Note: this is a fractional cap, not fractional v-sync (which would add lag.) Fractional caps with normal vsync are very low latency. Unfortunately, SpecialK's "normal" limiter is the only one I found that is good enough to do this. RTSS and Nvidia limiters always produce judder/jitter if you try a fractional cap with them. Which means you can't do that in online games that use an anti-cheat system (they will either block SpecialK, or trigger a ban because it looks like a cheat to them.)

Can you help explain what this "judder" that is expected when running without VRR is?

I'm trying to understand what I'll be missing out on by disabling VRR on very demanding games (running at around 90 to 150 FPS on 5090) when using a 4k 240hz OLED monitor.

I'm also trying to battle VRR flicker and your responses have been very helpful to understand and mitigate the issue. I'm trying to decide whether I should try to solve the issue with VRR enabled (by ensuring more consistent frametimes and less severe spikes) or by solving it with VRR disabled (and using various sync algorithms such as the ones provided by SK to help tame tearing and latency).

One thing I don't want to do is lower graphical settings too much to maintain good frametimes because I don't want to comprise the picture quality.

Also, kind of a very niche situation... One of the games I play has DRS (Dynamic Resolution Scaling) DLSS mode that automatically scales DLSS internal resolution from 50% to 100% to try and maintain a specific frame rate (e.g. 120 FPS).

This doesn't really help frametimes apikes as it doesn't change fast enough to smooth out micro stutters, but it does help maintain a more consistent frame rate average because it adjusts to how heavy the scene is (based on some average in the last second or so).

Do you think it makes sense to limit FPS using SK below the target DRS fps? E.g. to 115 FPS or something? The game would still adjust DLSS to try and target 120 FPS but SK will smooth the frametimes to try and maintain 115 FPS.

Would adding SK frame cap on top of tha

[jorimt]

Can you help explain what this "judder" that is expected when running without VRR is?

See the below simulation:
https://www.testufo.com/gsync#framerate ... &compare=1

[Bayov]

Can you help explain what this "judder" that is expected when running without VRR is?

See the below simulation: ...

Thanks. This tool with some additional reading helped me understand better how GSync is helpful for a smoother experience.

I'm wondering if Blur Busters would be willing to write some guides on how to best set up modern single-player games with a focus on smooth experience rather than low latency (which is usually the focus of competitive games). Many times there seems to be trade-offs between the two.

Maybe take into account that modern games typically run between 60 FPS to 150 FPS, while 4k monitors that are best suited for single players go up to 240Hz.

It'd be cool to have some knowledge center for that

But of course reading enough threads here in the forums and some blog content posted on Blur Busters is enough to get a basic understanding and I greatly appreciate all you do. Thanks again!

[Duskfall]

But what if I don't use SK? Should I just enable it in NVCP in that case? I am looking for a global setting where I don't have to mess around all the time depending on the game.

You can do whatever you want, I'm just saying that global vsync override in the driver can cause weird issues. You can still do it if you don't notice anything weird, like VRR flicker on the desktop or stutter in normal apps when you alt+tab out of the game.

So I've been testing Special K in Cyberpunk as well. In dark scenes and without Special K I get lots of flicker. Using Special K, the built in FPS limiter automatically limits FPS to 222 FPS as a default value. Most of the flicker in Cyberpunk disappeared even if I am gaming at just around 80-115 FPS max.I don't even have to cap FPS lower, just using the default limiter seems to work. I tested the same area in the game with and without Special K with the same exact settings in NVCP: LLM Ultra and Vsync on (off in game) and no FPS cap. The same thing happens in Alan Wake 2, the flickering is drastically reduced just enabling the FPS limiter of Special K. What is the reason that just using the default FPS limiter seems to solve most of the flicker, even if I don't game at such high FPS?

[BeardMan94]

So the settings are outdated? So what should the Vsync setting be in in Nvidia control panel if I just want to use SK as my FPS limiter? So basically regardless of SK what should Vsync be set to in NVCP? Thanks for your help

Default. Which is "3d application setting." You then enable/disable vysnc in the game.

So… presuming any VRR technology is turned off, would setting VSYNC on in-game be the superior choice over turning it on in the Nvidia App?

I am facung issues with VRR flicker as well, and I’m looking for the most similar result with as little (preferably none at all) tearing as possible, as well as the least amount of latency.

If VSYNC is on - is it necessary so have a frame cap as well to get the smoothest gameplay, or can the frames be fluctuating as when using VRR?

[RealNC]

So… presuming any VRR technology is turned off, would setting VSYNC on in-game be the superior choice over turning it on in the Nvidia App?

It shouldn't matter for the game. But it might matter for other things if you force it in the global profile instead of the per-application profile.

I am facung issues with VRR flicker as well, and I’m looking for the most similar result with as little (preferably none at all) tearing as possible, as well as the least amount of latency.

Fractional caps with SK are best for this (it has direct support for them.) Like a 1/2 cap at 240Hz (120FPS) or 180Hz (90FPS) with vsync. It will be smooth and latency will be very low. No vsync lag at all.

If VSYNC is on - is it necessary so have a frame cap as well to get the smoothest gameplay, or can the frames be fluctuating as when using VRR?

VRR fixes stutter due to FPS/Hz mismatch. If you don't have VRR, guess how that looks like

It's only smooth when FPS matches Hz, or when FPS is a fraction of Hz (1/2, 1/3, etc.)