Blur Busters Forums

Hey...

...Those of you with 120Hz-240Hz OLEDs, wanting to play 60Hz retro games and computers (Nintendo, etc)

...Or simulate a retro 35mm projector double strobe (with 24Hz HDMI input at 480p/720p/1080p/24Hz, outputting 96Hz+double BFI).

External BFI Injector Solution

The amazing thing is that Retrotink 4K does brighter BFI on LG OLEDs than the LG OLED's built in BFI!
It's a box-in-middle that goes between your source (console/retro/xbox/playstation/computer/FireTV/etc) and the display, and even supports 240Hz via ModeLines on SD cards. Whether you want to do 96Hz doublestrobe (35mm projector simulator) or add 120/180/240Hz BFI to your Nintendo, you can do it now with the upcoming Retrotink 4K box. And yes, you can connect a PC/Mac of any OS through its HDMI input -- although at lower resolutions and lower refresh rates (720p-1080p), depending on output resolution you plan to use. It's retro marketed, but the ability to partially simulate a CRT temporally and spatially is something that an external box can do (add scanlines filter + add BFI!).

That's because it converts retro SDR video input (e.g. Super Nintendo) to a HDR colorspace, then applies HDR brightness-boosting. We found that in certain cases, we can brighten 50%-cadence 60Hz BFI to become brighter than 60Hz non-BFI.

As I've been pissed at 240Hz OLEDs lack of BFI, I'm putting matters into my hands and helping someone throw BFI straight into a box-in-middle which can be used with almost any high-Hz sample and hold display. Problem solved, and I outperform the TV's BFI in brightness to boot!

DigitalFoundry Retro Nut Confirms

twitter.com/dark1x/status/1686843392917954560
Includes:
- Variable persistence BFI (if output Hz supports)
- Multistrobe BFI (for fans who want to simulate a 35mm projector)
- LCD saver (prevents image retention)
- Custom Hz support (Linux style ModeLines in a text file on a SD card you insert into Retrotink)
- ModeLine supports fixed-Hz VRR to trick custom Hz on VRR displays that don't support custom fixed-Hz outside VRR
(Good for doing things like 96Hz+BFI on OLEDs)
(Mike is the founder of Retrotink)

Chief Blur Buster wrote:EDIT -- Retrotink 4K is Blur Busters Approved!

www.retrotink.com/post/retrotink-4k-blur-buster-approved?ref=gjzza7b5

This is really exciting news and looks like a solid solution to the dreaded low hz issue that plagues OLEDs. Well done to everyone involved putting a solution in place and not waiting around for manufactures to do something (despite the fact that they should be implementing it!).

Interesting... does it work yet at high refresh rates?

How far along is the development?

Wow, now this is what i'm talking about!
How much latency would this add to an LG C1 when gaming at 60fps, if latency is already 10-13ms?
I'd be using this solely for Switch & PS5.

The MotionPro High setting on the LG C1 causes severe shadow detail crushing, there's too much brightness loss for it to be even viable(Unless you pop in the service menu and switch HDR Module from normal to 'on' but even then, it still doesn't quite cut the mustard, at least for me personally), latency shoots up to 20ms total, flicker is noticeable on whites depending on the scene and I think it might have a negative impact on colours(They appear somewhat duller and darker). But in return, the persistence drops down to 6.2ms for 60fps games and 3.2ms for120fps games.

Just some questions....

Does retrotink BFI cause shadow detail crushing, noticeable flicker, how low can the persistence get down to with good brightness when running a game at 60fps & 120fps, how much brighter exactly is it than the LG C1's motionPro High setting and how much latency does it add to 10-13ms(60fps) & 5ms(120fps)?

This sounds really cool. I immediately Googled it to learn more, but then I saw this on the website:

"The exact price is to be determined since we are still exploring multiple options on how to best source the FPGA. Best guidance is to budget $1,000 and we hope you will be pleasantly surprised when the actual price is determined."

Youch.

It's going to really limit the number of potential buyers if it's anywhere close to $1000. Especially if it is limited to 4k60Hz output and HDMI 2.0 as the website says. Does this mean if you have a PC you use at 4k 120Hz 4:4:4 normally (desktop, modern games, etc.), you won't be able pass 4k 120hz 4:4:4 through this device, even without adding any BFI or other filters?

Just trying to understand the capabilities of it. It looks like an amazing device still.

Also, does it support HDCP?

I am picturing it being used on an HTPC+emulation machine, so not interfering with the multimedia capabilities of such a system seems ideal.

I wonder too if this can actually be used properly for low frame rate content, like 24-30fps, aka movies and TV?
As everybody knows you cannot use BFI for anything other than 60-120fps content on OLED. Which is a shame, because getting the persistence down to 6.2ms with movies/TV would make such a dramatic difference. I've read that TV manufactures would either have to use double or single strobing(whichever one it is, i forgot) for LFC but then you'd wind up with 2x the flicker.

It would be amazing too if this thing was capable of turning 60fps games into a fake 120-144fps, by using motion interpolation, with zero artifacts and very minimal input lag increase to boot. If only! If that were the case I'd pay 2x the price. lol

Sounds like a dream, in theory.

Very expensive but if it's the solution we're looking for and given the fact that the market is non-existent, then the price becomes relative.

And it could open the path and serve as an example for TV manufacturers, to put efforts on implementing better BFI algorithms and other post-treatment effects.

Sounds awesome.

Would be really funny if this ends up purchasable before the dough spectrum. They haven't even shipped that monitor yet and they have just announced a new model.

If only BFI worked properly for low frame rate content such as movies & TV. being able to drop from a 16ms persistence down to even 8ms with a Samsing S90C or S95C QD-OLED would be a blessing.

NeonPizza wrote: ↑

08 Aug 2023, 18:55

If only BFI worked properly for low frame rate content such as movies & TV. being able to drop from a 16ms persistence down to even 8ms with a Samsing S90C or S95C QD-OLED would be a blessing.

If you're OK with 720p60 input or 1080p24 input, you can do this with Retrotink 4K!

BFI at any custom Hz, using ModeLines on an SD card. e.g. 1080p24 -> 1440p96.

You will need to sacrifice 4K60 output to do 1080p240 output or 1440p120 output with a Retrotink. The BFI is adjustable in 25% (4ms), 50% (8ms), 75% (12ms) persistence when outputting 1080p240.

You have to stay within the bandwidth budget, but it's doable, if you give up a bit of resolution. HDCP stripper + BluRay player (or a FireTV stick or such) + 1080p24 signal input is just *about* within Retrotink 4K's capability. Some streaming devces, e.g. FireTV, can be forced into perpetual 1080p24 (avoiding 1080p60), but you will have to strip HDCP before you can go through Retrotink.