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Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Ask about motion blur reduction in gaming monitors. Includes ULMB (Ultra Low Motion Blur), NVIDIA LightBoost, ASUS ELMB, BenQ/Zowie DyAc, Turbo240, ToastyX Strobelight, etc.

Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby ericl » 17 Sep 2017, 20:57

I'm trying however every time I try to add a custom resolution / refresh for this screen, it says: "out of range".

I tried CRU & Nvdia's custom resolution utility.

Anything, even 140hz, 150hz, 155hz, 180hz, etc. All out of range except for the official resolutions.
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby lexlazootin » 17 Sep 2017, 22:47

Yea, try something like this:
Image

It's not easy to overclock G-Sync chips, you need to stay within parameters.
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 18 Sep 2017, 09:00

ULMB 180 Hz is not possible. For monitors that support 144Hz ULMB, there's only enough mathematical dotclock room to go up to 155 Hz without making the horizontal scan rate out-of-spec (number of scan lines per second). Maintaining exactly the same horizontal scanrate number is extremely critical to tricking the firmware in letting you strobe at a non-NVIDIA-allowed refresh rate.

I have found that these ULMB tricks only works on certain monitors, so this is a very "hit-or-miss" trick. It definitely does not work on my ASUS ROG P278Q.

The fact that you even attempted 180Hz at all, indicates you didn't maintain the mathematic formula ;) and you should doublecheck what you're doing for 155Hz and less. Correctly mathematically-calculated exact Porch & Sync & Total numbers are exceedingly critical here for this trick. Can you rerun the math formula and screenshot your odd ULMB refreshrates, and we can tell you what you did wrong, or we can tell you your PG258Q doesn't support these ULMB hacks.

This is why Blur Busters doesn't (yet) have a HOWTO for this.

This is unofficial, bleeding-edge, forum-only stuff.

You have been hereby warned about the potential time-consuming nature of this type of attempted tweaking ;)

Our research indicates only about 25% to 50% of ULMB monitor models may work with this trick and we don't have an official list of which monitors supports these undocumented ULMB monitors.

Keep tweaking, but the easiest way for us to tell you if you've tweaked correctly is a screenshot of your exact Porch counts, Total count, Sync count, Horizontal Refresh Rate (Scan Rate) -- not just your refresh rate. Then we can correctly tell you if you attempted the hack correctly. (I can pre-emptively tell you that you didn't do the hack correctly if you attempted 180 Hz ;) ...)

Also, sometimes lowering ULMB refresh rate produces smoother/clearer motion -- due to the need for the triple lock for beautifully completely stutterless ULMB (framerate == stroberate == refreshrate). This is something harder at higher Hz -- see this thread: Properly Using ULMB Beautifully or Competitively

No ULMB monitor has been capable of strobing at 180Hz. The 180 number comes from XL2540/XL2546 tweaking as a good compromise. Anything above ~180Hz veers closer towards the "bad" scale in the strobe crosstalk photos.

Currently, the easiest overclockable GSYNC monitors are the ones with official overclockability (e.g. all the "165Hz" monitors). Those currently have successfully worked with the odd-ULMB-Hz trick, as well as the simultaneous "ULMB+GSYNC" trick. But that pretty much excludes 240Hz monitors (At this time).
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby lexlazootin » 18 Sep 2017, 12:47

Our research indicates only about 25% to 50% of ULMB monitor models may work with this trick and we don't have an official list of which monitors supports these undocumented ULMB monitors.


This is interesting, i didn't know some monitors were failing this test. When you say ULMB tricks doesn't work on your ASUS ROG P278Q what does that mean? Could you not adjust the timings?

Also i wouldn't call 155hz+ impossible, maybe we just don't know how to do it yet :) I had that fully glitched out mode on my XL2420G that had it's pixelclock unlocked and i could get that to 190hz.
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby ericl » 18 Sep 2017, 17:16

Thanks, I will try those exact settings and report back.

It would be cool to add that to the test. I've done 120hz ULMB, 144hz ULMB, 240hz "regular".

I honestly think that 155hz ULMB might be a winner. (Hell, the highest ULMB possible would be amazing as long as it maintains clarity.)
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 19 Sep 2017, 11:14

lexlazootin wrote:This is interesting, i didn't know some monitors were failing this test. When you say ULMB tricks doesn't work on your ASUS ROG P278Q what does that mean? Could you not adjust the timings?

Firmware. Different monitors have different firmwares of various different sensitivities.

The firmware in the PG278Q makes it impossible even with timings that works for others such as RealNC -- it's the first ever 1440p monitor.

Same for a lot of ULMB/GSYNC monitors.

And several models of non-overclockable VA-panel G-Sync monitors. As well models that don't do custom resolutions. There are 240Hz monitors that has no ability to do custom refresh rates (e.g. 238Hz) etc.
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby ericl » 19 Sep 2017, 18:06

Soooo............. what you're saying is we need a hacked firmware.

:D
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby ericl » 19 Sep 2017, 18:10

@lexlazootin It worked!!!!

I added the exact timings that you posted using CRU and it worked! I can't believe it. I can do ULMB @ 155hz with that. Crazy!

Does it go higher? :)
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby lexlazootin » 20 Sep 2017, 09:22

This is it so far, unless someone can figure it out.
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Re: Asus PG258Q - Can it do 180Hz ULMB

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 20 Sep 2017, 14:15

Excellent!

One last thing: The right tool for the right job :) .... For your specific monitor, 155Hz ULMB should be the lowest-lag, most competitive-ready strobed mode for competitive gaming if that's your purpose.

But whenever lag isn't the numero uno priority, that you can give up a couple milliseconds to gain best image quality: 155Hz ULMB isn't always the zeroest motion blur, nor it's easiest to make stutterless / jitterless (ULMB amplifies microstutter, and sometimes one wants to fix this for relaxing solo gaming).

If you're relaxing with a solo game where lag is less important -- and don't mind a couple more milliseconds of lag -- and want smoother RTS/platformer scrolling (NIntendo butter smooth scrolling from CRT days), then you want to aim at the triple match (stroberate = refreshrate = framerate) -- the magic recipie for perfect stutterless ULMB with arcade-smooth stutterless CRT clarity motion you'd recognize in a Sega or Nintendo machine of yesteryear.

To achieve that smoothness, stutterfree, silky ULMB effect, matching stroberate, refreshrate, framerate, sometimes requires lowering the refresh rate to ensure frame rates are more guranteed to stay locked to refresh rate & strobe frequency.

You know, games achieving exact same smoothness as a perfectly-synchronized TestUFO animation, is only achieved via the triple lock (and the world's smoothest computer mice, or via keyboard movements). Many games can't run at 155fps locked, but many do successfully run at 100fps locked on modern GPUs (with moderate detail adjustment), which can produce a more beautifully stutterfree CRT motion clarity effect that looks far better than 144Hz or 155Hz ULMB. The triple lock (framerate, stroberate, refreshrate all exactly locked to each other) is where motion image quality is at (when ULMB motion quality is more important than minor extra lag).

For more information, see Using ULMB Beautifully or Competitively, in the section about why sometimes certain games look much better (And stutter far less) at lower strobed refresh rates.
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