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240hz with strobing?

Posted: 07 Sep 2019, 22:56
by foofles
Hi, I'm looking for a new monitor ....

Is there a "best" monitor out there now? I want 240hz and ulmb. I keep eyeing various benq monitors, but I keep thinking they'll surely release a new one soon.

I know some new monitors can do variable refresh rates + ulmb. That would be prefered ...

And lastly, having 2k resolution would be nice. That way I could turn down the resolution for a certain game if I needed 240+fps!

Halp? :( So many options out there.

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 09 Sep 2019, 14:37
by Chief Blur Buster

Combining 240Hz and strobing is often extremely hard and limits options; there are many contradictory goals depending on if you want quality or latency or other consideration.

-- If you don't use strobing, higher refresh rates often look best, especially with variable refresh. Especially games that are too stuttery to gain much ULMB benefit

-- If you use strobing, strobing can often looks better at lower Hz in some situations -- because perfect framerate=Hz is more important than Hz of strobing. It's harder to get perfect framerate=Hz with high strobing Hz. It depends on what game you play, the amount of microstutters you get, and such. Sometimes 240Hz is the best because higher-Hz strobing is lower-lag.

All 240Hz monitors are 1080p or 1440p at the moment. Mainly 1080p. So those would be your choices. You can use lower resolution to get higher frame rates in some games, indeed.

Indeed, technology progress is a rapidly moving target. Such as those 240Hz 1ms IPS VRR monitors! The new IPS monitors are getting esports-fast and will probably rapidly become popular in the 2020s, though TN will remain a powerful contender for many reasons.

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 11 Sep 2019, 14:08
by alapsu

For a number of reasons, we're currently forced to accept tradeoffs between high-refresh-rate 1080p and 1440p monitors. At $500+ a pop, it's hard to justify buying one of each.

Some thoughts:
  • As explained here, you can achieve fantastically smooth and blur-free experiences when framerate == refresh rate == strobe rate (the "triumvirate"). But with currently-available consumer hardware, this is a tall order. If you want to achieve the triumvirate at 1440p (this also applies to 1080p to a somewhat lesser extent) with any regularity, you'll need either today's absolute-top-of-the-line PC or patience (for future hardware). You can always expect 1080p to allow for greater FPS than 1440p.
    • Even with a 9900k and 2080 Ti, you'll have a difficult time achieving consistent high framerates in modern games at 1440p. If you aren't consistently hitting a framerate at which your monitor can strobe, you may find more utility in VRR because VRR mitigates stuttering while strobing amplifies the effects of stuttering.
    • On a 1440p monitor, lowering the resolution to 1080p will result in worse picture quality than running 1080p on a native-1080p monitor. If you want to play a game this way, you must choose between accepting this quality reduction, playing with letterboxing, using resolution scaling, or using DLSS/sharpening filters.
  • Even if you don't expect to play with 240fps in your desired games, you can benefit from strobing at a refresh rate well below the monitor's maximum. In fact, most 240Hz monitors don't support 240hz strobing at all (I believe ULMB is typically only usable at specific refresh rates, with the lowest commonly around 100 or 120.)
    • When strobing at the same Hz, a higher-refresh-rate monitor will show fewer motion artifacts than a lower-refresh-rate monitor (ex: a 240hz monitor strobing @120hz will look better than a 144hz monitor strobing @ 120hz).
    • With newer Zowie/BenQ monitors, you can use custom resolutions with higher vertical totals and lower refresh rates to reduce crosstalk/double-image effects associated with strobing (this site has great info on this).
  • At 1080p, the most graphically-advanced game with which I can achieve the triumvirate at max settings is The Witcher 3 (@ 102hz). Even with this four-year-old game, I couldn't avoid framerate dips to the 80s/90s at 1440p. Granted, my PC isn't the fastest out there (9600k, rtx 2080, ddr4 3800c15), but a 9900k + 2080 Ti would deliver only an incremental improvement.

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 11 Sep 2019, 18:27
by Chief Blur Buster
That's a fantastic reply, alapsu!

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 12 Sep 2019, 09:03
by alapsu
Chief Blur Buster wrote:That's a fantastic reply, alapsu!
Hey, thanks a bunch. Glad to know I'm not totally off-base :)

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 12 Sep 2019, 18:23
by foofles
I don't guess there's a list of monitors that DO support 240hz ulmb? Though with the new ones supporting variable refresh rate ulmb, I might should wait a while.

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 12 Sep 2019, 18:33
by Gregix
None so far. Best as far I know is Alienware AW251H with 144Hz Ulmb(which is enough imo), and then u have asus, acer or so few have 144Hz ULMB too. 240Hz with strobing is pointless IMO(unless you game only CS:GO or so, old/low req type FPS). One dip below 240Hz can ruin gaming experience very badly...

And as far I know, pros do not use 240Hz strobed(VRR or DyAC) mostly. Just plain 240Hz. At least this is what I've read.
Personally at the moment I use 144Hz strobed on my XL2546, but like sometimes switch to 240Hz nonstrobed. Managed to make them look similar, strobed 144Hz prefer just for gaming, 240Hz use just sometimes for comparison. It is not so bad, but prefer strobing 144Hz. With increased VT of course.

Re: 240hz with strobing?

Posted: 12 Sep 2019, 19:08
by foofles
Guess I'll wait for a company to release one, then. I can do 120hz strobed on this monitor, and it's not enough.