Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Ask about motion blur reduction in gaming monitors. Includes ULMB (Ultra Low Motion Blur), NVIDIA LightBoost, ASUS ELMB, BenQ/Zowie DyAc, Turbo240, ToastyX Strobelight, etc.
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Chief Blur Buster
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 09 Dec 2019, 16:14

ELK wrote:
09 Dec 2019, 15:33
I HIGHLY recommend 100hz. On the moving photo test you do not see the ugly corona atop the rooftop like you do in 144hz and 120hz but I think this is because of the non adjustable response time OD.
It's already optimally tuned. I personally tuned it. There are law-of-physics limits at higher Hz. The moment a ghost disappears, a corona appears. At some point, you can only tune so much, it's impossible to eliminate both because you're flashing two different GtG's simultaneously.

But the crosstalk is faint enough at 120 Hz. Remember that the crosstalk is highest at the top/bottom edge instead of center. If you drag www.testufo.com/photo lower on your screen, the Quebec City skyline buildings go crosstalk-free ... That's because of the GtG-time asymmetry between the sequential LCD scanout and the global backlight flash. Each pixel are at different stages of their GtG curve when the screen is globally flashed. If you see the high speed videos you will understand better.
ELK wrote:
09 Dec 2019, 15:20
Darn. This monitor has the same problem that I hate on every strobed monitor I've owned. I can't adjust the voltage (named response time OD on this mointor) while in strobed mode.
Most manufacturers are generally reluctant to let users adjust overdrive in strobe modes due to custom overdrive needed.
Fortunately, the OD is pretuned to the lowest possible crosstalk at a pre-calibrated LCD temperature of 20 degrees C.
It is preconfigured to a custom overdrive setting that is different from the OD presets.

A minor compensation adjustment is useful especially for temperature compensation because a different overdrive gain is required for a cold room (15C) versus a hot room (25C), as LCDs tend to react slower at lower temperatures, causing ghosting/corona differences. This may be the premise that wins. I'll suggest it to ViewSonic.
ELK wrote:
09 Dec 2019, 15:20
Is there a plan to make response time OD adjustable while in strobe mode, or maybe through firmware? Why does 144hz strobe have a ghost followed by a corona. Makes no sense and is freaking me out lol.
Alas, that's the rock and the hard place in strobe backlight engineering.

It affects all monitors -- Hertzroom is your friend -- Choose a lower Hz than max when you enable strobing and want CRT clarity. Some manufacturers (NVIDIA) lock you out of high-Hz strobing due to poor quality. But at least ViewSonic lets you choose a higher Hz if you wish.

<Technical>

I've publicly written about this since 2013 in various places on Blur Busters.

Cramming GtG into the VBI. Usually you have only a ghost and a corona, but you can get both when the rock and the hard place is getting closer (ever shorter and shorter VBI, with constant-time GtG colliding against shorter-and-shorter refresh cycles). At that point, you're strobing the end-top GtG curve of the previous GtG and the beginning-tip GtG curve of the next GtG transition. No possible OD setting can eliminate both coronas or ghosting simultaneously. All strobed monitors are exposed to an amplified crosstalk phenomenon as strobing reaches max Hz. The refreshtime:GtGtime very difficult law-of-physics situation that can only be solved by ever faster pixel transitions GtG that more easily squeezes between refresh cycles.

Also, if you don't mind a little crosstalk, and want to test even lower-latency strobing -- try testing 180 Hz and 230 Hz. Use a Custom Resolution Utility. Those look noticeably better than 240 Hz, there's a sudden improvement the moment you go down to 230Hz. There's a strong geometric behavior to strobe crosstalk reductions the lower you go from 240 Hz.

Hertzroom is your best friend for crosstalk-free strobing. This is true for all past, current and future strobed LCD monitors. One will probably a 360Hz-480Hz monitor (or something like a 1/360sec or 1/480sec scanout, with long enough VBI between scanouts) to get lower crosstalk at 240 Hz. Does not matter which vendor, strobing at higher Hz will have more crosstalk limitations until GtG gets faster and/or the scanouts gets faster (creating longer VBI -- longer pauses between refresh cycle scanouts).

Some stuff I've written since 2014:
- Pixel Response FAQ: GtG versus MPRT (educational)
- High Speed Videos of LCD Scanout (videos showing GtG in realtime)
- Electronics Hacking: Creating A Strobe Backlight (complex piece)

</Technical>
ELK wrote:
09 Dec 2019, 15:20
The motion clarity is INSANE in 120hz or 100hz. There is absolutely NO motion blur or smearing. CRT clarity. Brings me back to my dell p1130 triniton that would rock 1600x1200@100hz.
Thanks for the compliment!

It is truly the best strobing I've seen on any three-figure-priced monitor in color-quality combined with crosstalk-free (at low Hz).
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by ELK » 09 Dec 2019, 16:30

So I tested

first person shooter:
TF2
Overwatch
Blood: fresh supply (oldie)

Top down?:
Sacred 2: gold
Sacred (oldie)

I see absolutely no ghosting and motion clarity is perfect. I don't like is how dark it is especially in blood because the game is dark itself, but the firmware that is going to drop in 2020 will fix this. The clarity blows everything else out of the water including 4k. In fact it looks more detailed than my 4k tv because details aren't smeared out. I'm considering buying a second one of these. If I do I'll remember to use the link.

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 09 Dec 2019, 19:21

ELK wrote:
09 Dec 2019, 16:30
I see absolutely no ghosting and motion clarity is perfect. I don't like is how dark it is especially in blood because the game is dark itself, but the firmware that is going to drop in 2020 will fix this. The clarity blows everything else out of the water including 4k. In fact it looks more detailed than my 4k tv because details aren't smeared out. I'm considering buying a second one of these. If I do I'll remember to use the link.
In ten years, I hope to be seeing 1000 Hz monitors that gets zero-flicker CRT clarity without the need for any impulsing ( flicker/strobing/phosphor/flashing/blackframe technology).

Motion clarity is such an underappreciated frontier that is often forgotten by today's gamers that has never seen a CRT, and only seen first-generation LightBoost with poor colors. Once the compromises slowly diminish, and the refresh rate race continues towards retina refresh rates, we'll eventually absorb CRT motion clarity in the venn diagram of non-strobed displays (someday), with the help of GPU-based frame rate amplification technologies.

For now, 240 Hz 1ms IPS panels are a big leap forward in strobed quality that makes us miss CRT less and less by each passing year!
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter

       To support Blur Busters:
       • Official List of Best Gaming Monitors
       • List of G-SYNC Monitors
       • List of FreeSync Monitors
       • List of Ultrawide Monitors

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by zoq » 10 Dec 2019, 07:32

This screen has really caught my attention as I really miss the good old Sony CRT times, but I do have some questions I hope someone could answer. Can't find any decent reviews yet, closest I get is the Acer Nitro XV273X on tftcentral, which has the same panel I presume.

During G-Sync use, what overdrive settings are available or does it lock it to a specific one? How is the overshoot and G2G on 60, 100, 120, 144 and 240hz during G-Sync use with the different OD settings?

I want a screen where I can switch between strobed and nonstrobed and have good performance on both.
This screen could have been an instant buy if it also included a G-Sync module with variable overdrive as this is my biggest concern. When I do play single player games with graphics max'ed out I sometimes see FPS between 60-100. In competitive I will lock my settings and make sure I hit the right FPS targets.

Is the VRR between 48-240hz?

Also what is the contrast ratio on this screen? The Acer with the same panel lands around 1100.

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by witega » 10 Dec 2019, 14:10

Hey Chief, did ViewSonic get back to you yet on why we can't select sRGB as a color temperature in thr OSD when we have PureXP+ enabled?

ELK
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by ELK » 10 Dec 2019, 21:39

witega wrote:
10 Dec 2019, 14:10
Hey Chief, did ViewSonic get back to you yet on why we can't select sRGB as a color temperature in thr OSD when we have PureXP+ enabled?
He mentioned earlier that you can achieve it through full color control. idk why sRGB isn't avaiable but custom still is and can achieve 99% sRGB in strobed...

ELK
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by ELK » 10 Dec 2019, 21:49

zoq wrote:
10 Dec 2019, 07:32
This screen has really caught my attention as I really miss the good old Sony CRT times, but I do have some questions I hope someone could answer. Can't find any decent reviews yet, closest I get is the Acer Nitro XV273X on tftcentral, which has the same panel I presume.

During G-Sync use, what overdrive settings are available or does it lock it to a specific one? How is the overshoot and G2G on 60, 100, 120, 144 and 240hz during G-Sync use with the different OD settings?

I want a screen where I can switch between strobed and nonstrobed and have good performance on both.
This screen could have been an instant buy if it also included a G-Sync module with variable overdrive as this is my biggest concern. When I do play single player games with graphics max'ed out I sometimes see FPS between 60-100. In competitive I will lock my settings and make sure I hit the right FPS targets.

Is the VRR between 48-240hz?

Also what is the contrast ratio on this screen? The Acer with the same panel lands around 1100.
If you miss good old CRT times then this will do it for you, BUT... chief mentioned that this is the best strobed monitor in the 3 digit price range. As far as I'm aware this is the only 240hz ips monitor BUT I do not shop in high price ranges so I'm highly likely wrong. From what I know the best panels are not made by monitor manufacturers but by companies that make only panels.

This panel has "adaptive sync" I haven't even tested it. This might be the VESA standard though? Untested. I know free sync only works on hdmi on nvidia cards.

This thread is about the xg270 but there is another screen that is the xg270? the question mark being a certain letter which is gsync and lower refresh rate. I can test the overshoot by eye for you at non strobed or strobed 60 100 120 144 and 240 but the gsync version doesn't support 240hz (caps at 165 or 185 or something...?)

I don't have the tools to test static contrast ratio so I can't help you there. Dynamic contrast ratio is a joke.

I'm sure chief will be on to help you and I'll be here to throw in my opinion too.

Personally even the highest overdrive isn't enough in 240hz non strobed mode because you still get ghosts not coronas but it' still okish, but why the hell would you run this monitor in non strobed anyways lol

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by GammaLyrae » 10 Dec 2019, 22:03

Is there native 60hz strobing support for external sources where a black frame insertion / software solution isn't possible? For example, a console that outputs 60hz. I know this would come with effectively more than CRT flicker (i've done custom resolution "hacks" on my PG279q to use ULMB on games that force 60hz or don't behave appropriately at higher than 60hz), but it'd be super nice for consoles.

If no, maybe this would be a good option for a future firmware? :D

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by witega » 11 Dec 2019, 09:01

ELK wrote:
10 Dec 2019, 21:39
witega wrote:
10 Dec 2019, 14:10
Hey Chief, did ViewSonic get back to you yet on why we can't select sRGB as a color temperature in thr OSD when we have PureXP+ enabled?
He mentioned earlier that you can achieve it through full color control. idk why sRGB isn't avaiable but custom still is and can achieve 99% sRGB in strobed...
How do I get sRGB in custom? I must be overlooking something.

ELK
Posts: 93
Joined: 18 Dec 2015, 02:51

Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by ELK » 11 Dec 2019, 11:15

GammaLyrae wrote:
10 Dec 2019, 22:03
Is there native 60hz strobing support for external sources where a black frame insertion / software solution isn't possible? For example, a console that outputs 60hz. I know this would come with effectively more than CRT flicker (i've done custom resolution "hacks" on my PG279q to use ULMB on games that force 60hz or don't behave appropriately at higher than 60hz), but it'd be super nice for consoles.

If no, maybe this would be a good option for a future firmware? :D
It's greyed out in 60hz mode. No native 60hz strobing.

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