LG OLED CX 120Hz BFI

[Ozzuneoj]

I can't game on OLED unless the game is 120fps and that's solely because 120fps cuts motion blur down by half and doubles up on motion resolution. It also reduces latency down to 5ms which is getting close to CRT and of course gives you that realistic buttery smooth motion that you just can't get from 60. And you have two settings to further reduce motion blur & gain more motion resolution. With the LG C1, they're Motion Pro Low & Medium which are designed for 120hz bfi.....Wouldn't recommend medium though as it robs you of too much brigthness where as low only takes a small amount. Low, as is makes a noticeable improvement but there will a bit of shadow detail crushing and a little more latency in return.

Anyways, witha60fps for example, is like gaming through the eyes of Barny Gumble from The Simpsons. Can't get down with that drunkOvision nonsense. Kills the experience in every first and 3rd person based title i play. Heck, i refuse to play Resident Evil 8: Village until i get an Aurora RTX3080 PC so i can plunk it at 120fps. Seeing as how capcom hasn't even bothered to update it with a 120fps patch for Series X or PS5. They could get that game running at 120fps(Including RE2,3 & 7) @1080p if they wanted....

But back to BFI....Streaming/Discs, Max BFI on the CX has been said to offer under 100 nits brightness which is not ideal, but apparently it has <2ms persistence which is 1ms faster than the C1's MotionPro High setting. Plus, there's more shadow detail crushing with the CX from it's BFI. CX may have the fastest BFI in the land OLED TV's, but the below 100 nits is a deal breaker for me personally.

I'm assuming the BFI shadow detail crushing can be corrected with a professional calibration, but you'd still be left with an ugly dim picture. I'd wait for this years LG G2 since it has a heatsink+Evo panel which will guarantee you over 100 nits easily with it's BFI. Better yet, there's the Sony QD-OLED arriving this year, which will cost a pretty penny. but it will outdo the G2 in brightness, it's BFI however might perform worse. I've heard that Sony's 2021 OLED's have worse motion than the LG C1 & G2.

But ya, the motion blur reduction from my C1's BFI High setting is in the same ball park as my panasonic S60 plasma. that plasma has average motion by plasma standards, yet the C1 ever so slightly has less blur in BFI high mode. Not sure which of the two wins in motion resolution. S60 has been said to have 700-800p, i'm guessing the C1 lands around there as well or possibly better.

And i've got to say, after owning multiple CRT's over the years, going from something like a Sony Wega trinitron from the early to mid 2000's and 'then' to a panny S60 plasma was a total downgrade in regards to motion Blur and Brightness. That Sony, obviously had zero Blur nor did it have any motion dithering/artifacts or green phosphor trails. It was also brighter as well and produced a more sculpted picture with more pop.

And then going from the S60 plasma to my LG C1 OLED was another big downgrade as far as motion is concerned. Far more Motion Blur, only 300p motion resolution & 3x the judder. lol BFI/MotionPro HIGH for streaming & 120fps gaming are a CRT lovers only hope with OLED

Thanks for the feedback. I will admit, I haven't even seen an OLED display in person other than some smart phones. We don't have any electronics stores in my area so I'd have to travel to a store that might carry one.

Judder and blur are a bit concerning to me. I really don't like to spend lots of money on something that ends up being a downgrade from what I was using in some way. I don't expect my next TV to surpass my XL2720Z in motion clarity necessarily, but I don't think it needs to for use as a TV. Now, I would be sort of surprised if my current 60Hz LCD TV from 2013 was better than an LG C1 in any possible way, but... if it was I'd be a little annoyed. heh

Several years ago I had high hopes for laser projectors to fill the hole left by the death of the CRT... what ever happened to those? I don't mean standard LCD-based projectors with laser light sources, mean the ones that actually use laser beams to draw out the image (which creates a scanning effect like a CRT). I can't seem to find anything about them now.

EDIT: This is what I'm talking about.
https://blurbusters.com/laser-displays- ... rsistence/

[NeonPizza]

I can't game on OLED unless the game is 120fps and that's solely because 120fps cuts motion blur down by half and doubles up on motion resolution. It also reduces latency down to 5ms which is getting close to CRT and of course gives you that realistic buttery smooth motion that you just can't get from 60. And you have two settings to further reduce motion blur & gain more motion resolution. With the LG C1, they're Motion Pro Low & Medium which are designed for 120hz bfi.....Wouldn't recommend medium though as it robs you of too much brigthness where as low only takes a small amount. Low, as is makes a noticeable improvement but there will a bit of shadow detail crushing and a little more latency in return.

Anyways, witha60fps for example, is like gaming through the eyes of Barny Gumble from The Simpsons. Can't get down with that drunkOvision nonsense. Kills the experience in every first and 3rd person based title i play. Heck, i refuse to play Resident Evil 8: Village until i get an Aurora RTX3080 PC so i can plunk it at 120fps. Seeing as how capcom hasn't even bothered to update it with a 120fps patch for Series X or PS5. They could get that game running at 120fps(Including RE2,3 & 7) @1080p if they wanted....

But back to BFI....Streaming/Discs, Max BFI on the CX has been said to offer under 100 nits brightness which is not ideal, but apparently it has <2ms persistence which is 1ms faster than the C1's MotionPro High setting. Plus, there's more shadow detail crushing with the CX from it's BFI. CX may have the fastest BFI in the land OLED TV's, but the below 100 nits is a deal breaker for me personally.

I'm assuming the BFI shadow detail crushing can be corrected with a professional calibration, but you'd still be left with an ugly dim picture. I'd wait for this years LG G2 since it has a heatsink+Evo panel which will guarantee you over 100 nits easily with it's BFI. Better yet, there's the Sony QD-OLED arriving this year, which will cost a pretty penny. but it will outdo the G2 in brightness, it's BFI however might perform worse. I've heard that Sony's 2021 OLED's have worse motion than the LG C1 & G2.

But ya, the motion blur reduction from my C1's BFI High setting is in the same ball park as my panasonic S60 plasma. that plasma has average motion by plasma standards, yet the C1 ever so slightly has less blur in BFI high mode. Not sure which of the two wins in motion resolution. S60 has been said to have 700-800p, i'm guessing the C1 lands around there as well or possibly better.

And i've got to say, after owning multiple CRT's over the years, going from something like a Sony Wega trinitron from the early to mid 2000's and 'then' to a panny S60 plasma was a total downgrade in regards to motion Blur and Brightness. That Sony, obviously had zero Blur nor did it have any motion dithering/artifacts or green phosphor trails. It was also brighter as well and produced a more sculpted picture with more pop.

And then going from the S60 plasma to my LG C1 OLED was another big downgrade as far as motion is concerned. Far more Motion Blur, only 300p motion resolution & 3x the judder. lol BFI/MotionPro HIGH for streaming & 120fps gaming are a CRT lovers only hope with OLED

Thanks for the feedback. I will admit, I haven't even seen an OLED display in person other than some smart phones. We don't have any electronics stores in my area so I'd have to travel to a store that might carry one.

Judder and blur are a bit concerning to me. I really don't like to spend lots of money on something that ends up being a downgrade from what I was using in some way. I don't expect my next TV to surpass my XL2720Z in motion clarity necessarily, but I don't think it needs to for use as a TV. Now, I would be sort of surprised if my current 60Hz LCD TV from 2013 was better than an LG C1 in any possible way, but... if it was I'd be a little annoyed. heh

Several years ago I had high hopes for laser projectors to fill the hole left by the death of the CRT... what ever happened to those? I don't mean standard LCD-based projectors with laser light sources, mean the ones that actually use laser beams to draw out the image (which creates a scanning effect like a CRT). I can't seem to find anything about them now.

EDIT: This is what I'm talking about.
https://blurbusters.com/laser-displays- ... rsistence/

If i were you, I'd hold out just a little longer for this years LG G2, C2, the Sony A80K & A95K OLED's just to see how good their black frame insertions are and if any of them can hit <2ms. There isn't one single OLED on the market that has BFI capable of <1ms persistence that i know of and I doubt we'll see it with the 4 OLED's above. Sony's A95K QD-OLED will have even more brightness to spare than the G2(has a heatsink) so maybe sony could get it down to 1ms & over 100 nits. Just have to wait and see.

For now, you can get <3ms with the C1 & G1. Like i said earlier, the CX's <2ms is botched from the severe brightness drop so I wouldn't even consider it.

The out of box black crush & extra shadow detail crushing coming from the LG C1's Motionpro High settings, fortunately can be corrected from a Professional calibration. anybody who's coming from CRT & plasma, THAT is your best bet for OLED based on what's currently available.

For gaming, 120fps would be ideal, combined with the first 120hz BFI setting. I wouldn't use motionPro High simply because you lose to much brightness with it game mode and lag doubles. But at least you have options. :p

[NeonPizza]

Does anybody know how much motion resolution you get with the LG C1's MotionPro HIGH/BFI setting?

A Calibrator on YT told me that MotionPro High in 'SDR' ISF Bright/Dark Picture settings will give you 150-170 Nits at '50' OLED Light. You can't raise it past 50 and get a brighter picture btw, and like BB pointed out the CX has <4ms Persistence, but where does the C1's MP High/BFI rank?

This year for BFI, I'm Crossing my fingers for a <2ms or <3ms + 1080p motion resolution with an even brighter picture for the upcoming LG G2 & Sony A95K OLED

[Cellx]

Guys, the LG C2 seemingly no longer allows 120hz BFI, this really sucks. It's strange how they still keep 60hz BFI, only 120hz is gone.
I hope that's just reviewers getting an early firmware, but I'm already looking at Sony for an alternative.
I've been waiting for an OLED that's 42" for so long, with good BFI and low latency on PC mode. I'm LITERALLY at my wits ends here, 60fps gaming with lcd blur is hell
Is anyone in this forum familiar with how Sony's BFI and motion smoothing behave while connected to a PC? I could ask the same for LG but I know PC usage on LG's OLEDs are good enough and allow 4K120 BFI in PC mode but I still don't know if the inputlag is sub 20ms or not.
Controversial, but I'd also like to be able to use motion smoothing while in game mode, just in case (30fps games?). Again, no idea if LG or Sony allows this.

[Cellx]

Does anybody know how much motion resolution you get with the LG C1's MotionPro HIGH/BFI setting?

Looking at rtings graph and what I read also here, it's around 8ms persistence, a bit higher than the CX.

[petergiokaris]

Guys, the LG C2 seemingly no longer allows 120hz BFI, this really sucks. It's strange how they still keep 60hz BFI, only 120hz is gone.
I hope that's just reviewers getting an early firmware, but I'm already looking at Sony for an alternative.
I've been waiting for an OLED that's 42" for so long, with good BFI and low latency on PC mode. I'm LITERALLY at my wits ends here, 60fps gaming with lcd blur is hell
Is anyone in this forum familiar with how Sony's BFI and motion smoothing behave while connected to a PC? I could ask the same for LG but I know PC usage on LG's OLEDs are good enough and allow 4K120 BFI in PC mode but I still don't know if the inputlag is sub 20ms or not.
Controversial, but I'd also like to be able to use motion smoothing while in game mode, just in case (30fps games?). Again, no idea if LG or Sony allows this.

I'm actually devastated LG pulled the True Motion Pro setting from the C2 line (as far as we know). I completely rely on it for what I am doing, and to see it removed kills me. Perhaps it's been disabled and one can turn it on using a higher elevated access to the parameters (I know of a piece of software which will allow 2019 LG OLEDs to turn on True Motion).

Does anyone know or have definitive knowledge that LG has completely pulled this feature, or is there a possibility it may show up in later firmware updates? If we're lucky, it was just disabled.

UPDATE: I see that they have kept BFI for 60Hz, which gives me hope that it can still be done at 120Hz down the road. However, is the removal of BFI 120Hz something that they would have nixed in hardware? This would impact any display maker dependent on LG OLED panels, and would make the whole situation even more devastating.

[Chief Blur Buster]

If i were you, I'd hold out just a little longer for this years LG G2, C2, the Sony A80K & A95K OLED's just to see how good their black frame insertions are and if any of them can hit <2ms. There isn't one single OLED on the market that has BFI capable of <1ms persistence that i know of and I doubt we'll see it with the 4 OLED's above. Sony's A95K QD-OLED will have even more brightness to spare than the G2(has a heatsink) so maybe sony could get it down to 1ms & over 100 nits. Just have to wait and see.

There's an OLED that can be used for big-screen viewing at 2ms persistence: Oculus Rift. But its refresh rate is locked to 90Hz, which is not ideal for video content. However, you could run a Virtual Desktop at 90fps 90Hz, for low-persistence 2ms 90fps.

The original Rift CV and original Quest is OLED, while the Quest 2 is LCD. However, it does have superlatively low persistence with zero strobe crosstalk. The Oculus Quest 2 VR LCD is currently 0.3ms persistence with a perfect zero strobe crosstalk -- however, can do 60Hz, 72Hz, 80Hz, 90Hz and 120Hz, especially with the help of SideQuest, so you can run your own apps (even Android sideloaded TV apps, which shows up as giant 100 inch 16:9 screens floating in 3D space). Blacks are not as good, but the motion clarity is better than a CRT, and you can use multiple movie theater apps, remote desktops, or sideloaded Android .apk, to get your television / streaming / gaming content into a 2D screen floating in VR space. You can look up and down, and the screen stays stationary as if it was in real life, stare down to your virtual chair, and look up at the virtual screen.

If you need a 2ms-persistence 60Hz OLED, one choice is the Oculus Quest original, and running BigScreen or Virtual Desktop, with SideQuest force-60Hz technique. None of the LG OLEDs ever released, manages to have BFI as good as the OLED VR headsets.

(developer documentation where 60Hz BFI is a legal feature of an Oculus (er, Meta) media player, streaming or virtual desktop app. But for forcing 60Hz in other apps, or sideloaded Android apps like 1080p Netflix, one can use SideQuest)

For desktop CRT motion clarity, one needs exemplar strobe tuning such as a Blur Busters Approved desktop monitor (e.g. XG2431) that is capable of 60Hz and 120Hz single-strobe at zero strobe crosstalk. But, yeah, no OLED gamut and blacks.

Options for low-persistence OLED is still extremely limited at this time.

[Cellx]

I just want to say I received my C1 and 8ms persistence in 60hz BFI doesn't look nearly as bad as it sounds, outside of extremely fast motion there's still no perceptible blur and considering how bright it is I think LG did good on increasing the pulse length for the C1 over the CX
I'm extremely happy about this TV especially for the price (800€). I can finally play 60fps videogames without double strobing or dealing with blur!

And for some reason my C1 also support 100hz AND 50hz BFI. It hurt a bit at 50hz though, lol, but just in case, I have the option. Now I just need to know if I can run the TV at arbitrary refresh rates and see if the strobing rate changes with it. I have an hard time doing custom resolutions because of my old GTX card not actually supporting HDMI 2, lol

Size wise it's not that bad either. I'd say people on the fence about the C1 because of the size should really just bite the bullet and get the C1 ASAP while it's still in some stores, sometimes for dirt cheap. Because even with OLED tech there's still some motionblur at 120FPS without BFI.