Support/Advices on my new monitor

Ask about motion blur reduction in gaming monitors. Includes ULMB (Ultra Low Motion Blur), NVIDIA LightBoost, ASUS ELMB, BenQ/Zowie DyAc, Turbo240, ToastyX Strobelight, etc.
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fastbreak
Posts: 4
Joined: 09 Apr 2020, 13:32

Support/Advices on my new monitor

Post by fastbreak » 09 Apr 2020, 15:07

Hey everybody, i have just subscribed to this forum and i have to say i'm really thankful that there is actually a website that deals with monitor response times/input lags/sync in such a good way.

I would very much like to ask U guys some infos/advices regarding my last hardware upgrade . Last week i got a new monitor:
the Gygabyte Aorus FI27Q, my first IPS panel ever since i wanted to upgrade to 1440p IPS high refresh rate. I found this good deal on amazon warehouse (very good state) and i got it for 400 euros. I was excited as i noticed that my model came without any ips glow or any assembly defect. The only problem with it is the response times (motion handling). I play a lot of Fps games and i noticed while playing that when i was moving my point of view the environment around was blurring way too much with solid's edges leaving trace of ghosting while in motion (expecially white colors on dark ones or viceversa). I tried to get things better playing around with overdrive settings and the backlight strobing effect that aorus calls " aim stabilizer"... but the overdrive tuning is very poor, i can choose between 3 modes only and the first two are damn slow while the last one improves things but still has ghosting and also shows overshoot in some transitions. I'm satisfied over the picture quality and the refresh rate of the panel but really can't get over the motion blur that is way too much compared to the TN i was using before. The "backlight strobing" cant even do much about it , it only creates strob crosstalk and a double image artifact effect.

Now i'd like to ask you guys some questions , if possible..

Is there a way i can reduce the motion blur with CRU or an utility like the one i saw was available on this website for BenQ monitors?
And lastly, if i really can't do anything about it, would you guys recommend me to send back the monitor to amazon and getting another one? i red somewhere that response times are similar among IPS panels.. maybe the Lg 27gl850 (and LGgl83A) are the only ones that have a good ratio between response times and price. I also checked out the Vg27Aq from asus that has similar response of my current monitor but has that ELMB Sync that works better than any other backlight strobing effect implemented on other monitors ..Guys i really don't know what to do , i would be grateful to get some advices or informations about it... thanks in advice

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Chief Blur Buster
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Re: Support/Advices on my new monitor

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 09 Apr 2020, 15:16

fastbreak wrote:
09 Apr 2020, 15:07
Is there a way i can reduce the motion blur with CRU or an utility like the one i saw was available on this website for BenQ monitors?
Most such utilities are often software that commands the monitor (over DDC/CI or VESA Monitor Command Control Set 2.2) to unlock things (like ToastyX Strobelight that disable DRM that prevents LightBoost from being enabled in third party software) or adjust things (like Blur Busters Strobe Utility being a substitute for accessing the monitor's Factory Menu). They won't help slower 3ms IPS panels that don't have the commands to improve further.
fastbreak wrote:
09 Apr 2020, 15:07
maybe the Lg 27gl850 (and LGgl83A) are the only ones that have a good ratio between response times and price. I also checked out the Vg27Aq from asus that has similar response of my current monitor but has that ELMB Sync that works better than any other backlight strobing effect implemented on other monitors ..Guys i really don't know what to do , i would be grateful to get some advices or informations about it... thanks in advice
What you will want is a new monitor whose GtG response that is a tiny fraction of your preferred refresh cycle (e.g. 1ms for 240Hz, 2ms for 144Hz, or 3ms-4ms for 60Hz).

Most older IPS 144Hz monitors have about ~3ms GtG, and that's best case only. GtG's that reaches half a refresh cycle (1/144sec = 6.9ms) begins to interfere with motion clarity. Remember 1ms equals 1 pixel of motion blur at 1000 pixels/sec. Even GtG90% (VESA cutoff) at 1ms can sometimes be GtG100% at 10ms, and that can still create ghosting/coronas that is 10x longer trailbehind than what the GtG/MPRT rating numbers implies. See Pixel Response FAQ: GtG versus MPRT.

The people who say 1ms vs 2ms doesn't matter, is speaking garbage without thinking.

There are many variables, including the Vicious Cycle Effect that higher resolutions at higher refresh rates with ever-faster games -- will amplify tiny limitations better. For example 0.5ms GtG vs 1.0ms GtG was worthless at 480p 60Hz, but is massively more visible at 1440p 240Hz. Even 1ms vs 0.5ms is visible for a 240Hz 1080p panel nowadays, we have people returning 1ms monitors for 0.5ms monitors because they still thoguht ghosting on the 1ms panels were still unacceptable (TN or IPS). Consider that 0.5ms rating is only a GtG10->90% cutoff as seen in the FAQ, and is still far slower than that for GtG100%. That said, GtG100% of a 0.5ms-GtG90% panel will invariably be noticeably faster than the GtG100% of a 0.5ms-GtG90% panel.

There are already early observations that 0.25ms GtG vs 0.5ms GtG is still a human-visible problem when we start reaching 4K 240Hz non-strobed in the future, or 240Hz 1080p strobed. So 0.5ms is not even the final frontier here in this Refresh Rate Race to Retina Refresh Rates.

So, if you are hating ghosting,

1. If you're looking for best non-strobed quality, focus on the 1ms-GtG-or-faster displays. Although 1ms is not a guarantee, they will )(on average) typically have approximately 1/3rd the visible ghosting aftereffects (asymmetric coronas/ghosting beyond simple MPRT blurring) of older 3ms 144Hz displays, as seen in LCD Motion Artifacts 101

2. If you're looking for best strobed quality, consider a Blur Busters Approved display, and/or buying more refresh rate than you need and then using a lower Hz to reduce strobe crosstalk (e.g. 120Hz PureXP+ strobing on a ViewSonic XG270 looks good -- like a CRT).

ELMB-Sync has its pros and cons (including amplified cons). It works well if you want low-lag strobing near max Hz (the low-lag trick of capped VRR works with ELMB-Sync). Can be beautiful at near-max frame rates with slight fluctuation range. But sometimes have amplified strobe crosstalk effects at low frame rates, which many readers don't like.

There are other variables to consider, like resolution, refresh rate, preference for strobing, preference for non-strobing, preference for lower lag, preference for perfect CRT clarity, preference for colors, etc. Some people willingly give up say, 4ms of lag to get much better strobing, but not willing to give up 20ms of lag, so there are some tolerance thresholds at play here. Not everyone is picky about stutter, or picky about tearing, or picky about ghosting, or picky about strobe crosstalk double-images, or even effects such as stroboscopic effects etc.

There's no jack-of-all-trades monitors. But we can help advise based on priority.
_____

So to better help....
What are your gaming priorities?
- Variable refresh rate?
- Tearing?
- Stutters?
- Non-strobed quality?
- Strobed quality?
- Input latency?
- Color quality?
- Ghosting/coronas?

The finiteness of frame rates and refresh rates enforces a lot of motion-quality constraints. Only when refresh rates converge to retina refresh rates, that the human-visible temporal differences (latency, stutter, tearing) of VSYNC ON, VSYNC OFF, VRR, etc -- converges into identicalnes. Even at 240Hz, it's still possible to tell apart the sync technologies which has to exist because frame rates are finite. Plus also finite GtG that often are a significant percentage of a refresh cycle, which is unfortunate even in the era of 0.5ms vs 1.0ms.
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter

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fastbreak
Posts: 4
Joined: 09 Apr 2020, 13:32

Re: Support/Advices on my new monitor

Post by fastbreak » 10 Apr 2020, 07:51

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
09 Apr 2020, 15:16
GtG's that reaches half a refresh cycle (1/144sec = 6.9ms) begins to interfere with motion clarity
Oh, i thought that whatever GtG below the 6.94 ms (for 144hz) was good to prevent ghosting. So it looks like i need at least a REAL 3/4 ms GtG display (theres no such thing as 1ms GtG without overdrive's overshoot artifacts). The LG 27gl850 for example is considered as 1 of the fastest ips display ( 1440p ) on the market and still can't go under 4 ms GtG without showing significant coronas.
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
09 Apr 2020, 15:16
1. If you're looking for best non-strobed quality, focus on the 1ms-GtG-or-faster displays. Although 1ms is not a guarantee, they will )(on average) typically have approximately 1/3rd the visible ghosting aftereffects (asymmetric coronas/ghosting beyond simple MPRT blurring) of older 3ms 144Hz displays, as seen in LCD Motion Artifacts 101
.
I wish i knew when i could and when i couldn't trust manufactures for their 1ms GtG or MPRT claiming they put everywhere.
I'm very thankful you shared that "Pixel Response FAQ: GtG versus MPRT" topic , it helped to understand better.
Chief Blur Buster wrote:
09 Apr 2020, 15:16
So to better help....
What are your gaming priorities?
- Variable refresh rate?
- Tearing?
- Stutters?
- Non-strobed quality?
- Strobed quality?
- Input latency?
- Color quality?
- Ghosting/coronas?
What i'm looking for right now is a 1440p IPS display 144/165 hz ( or maybe a 240 hz 1080p but still IPS ) that performs well in motion handling. I'm too much distracted by ghosting artifacts that i'm noticing right now, so i wish i could find a display that has similar TN performances (without showing a lot of overshoot errors when pixel overdriven ) . I prefer a Non-strobed quality but wouldn't mind to use the strobing effect in some games if it doesn't affect a lot the brightness. I would be ok with a strobe-quality display if it just does its work.. i mean , i have only had displays that performed awfully when strobed showing that crosstalk and even double images. Regarding input latency i mind it , of course, since i play competitive FPS.

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