So is Motion Blur (ULMB, ELMB, etc) the way to go?

Ask about motion blur reduction in gaming monitors. Includes ULMB (Ultra Low Motion Blur), NVIDIA LightBoost, ASUS ELMB, BenQ/Zowie DyAc, Turbo240, ToastyX Strobelight, etc.
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ramb0
Posts: 10
Joined: 31 Oct 2014, 01:31

So is Motion Blur (ULMB, ELMB, etc) the way to go?

Post by ramb0 » 10 Jul 2020, 06:19

So i'm looking at getting new display and have already spent numerous hours today reading Blur Busters (exceptional site btw!)... it's been a while since i've bought a gaming monitor and i don't believe ULMB and the likes were around back then...

I'll be playing FPS games mostly, currently Apex Legends which i can potentially run up to ~180fps at 1080 using a 2070 card.

I've been looking at G-Sync 144 and 240hz displays, thinking a high hz G-Sync was the way to go... but after reading the Motion Blur FAQ, it seems like this might be the way to go?

From what i can see, the main downside to ULMB is if your GPU struggles to achieve 100 or 120fps constantly. But since i can overachieve that (in Apex anyway), then i don't really see any disadvantages to ULMB over G-Sync??

The thing that confuses me most, is when searching for people's experiences of G-Sync vs ULMB, there's very little real-world examples and comparisons. Some people say they prefer G-Sync, other say ULMB...

Assuming i can achieve a constant [email protected], ultimately what would be the best between;
• 144hz G-Sync (game FPS capped @ 141)
• 240hz G-Sync (game FPS uncapped [except with Apex, which i'd keep it capped at the developers default of 144fps])
• 120hz ULMB (game FPS capped @ 120)

deama
Posts: 223
Joined: 07 Aug 2019, 12:00

Re: So is Motion Blur (ULMB, ELMB, etc) the way to go?

Post by deama » 20 Jul 2020, 07:43

I had a friend who bought a gsync ultrawide monitor about 3 years ago and ever since he discovered how to properly tweak his monitor, he not only doesn't need gsync, but regretted getting it.
If you have a card that can comfortably keep the fps at 120 for the games you want to play, then gsync won't be useful to you, and will probably make it worse actually (gsync adds input lag).

It really depends on your playstyle, might be better off to just get a 240hz monitor without gsync/freesync/ULMB.
Have you got a video of how you play apex? If you play and move your camera a lot in wide motions, e.g. do a 180 degree spin to check your behind in a split second, then ULMB will help you quite a lot with this, but if you play without any fast camera movement, it might not help all that much, in which case you'd want the 240hz for a bit less input lag.

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jorimt
Posts: 1489
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44
Location: USA

Re: So is Motion Blur (ULMB, ELMB, etc) the way to go?

Post by jorimt » 20 Jul 2020, 09:28

ramb0 wrote:
10 Jul 2020, 06:19
deama wrote:
20 Jul 2020, 07:43
(gsync adds input lag).
G-SYNC does not add input lag.

Instead, G-SYNC doesn't reduce input lag as much as V-SYNC off can at much higher framerate than refresh rate ratios. And it takes a lot of excess frames (3x, optimally 5x) to create any meaningful input lag reduction with V-SYNC off over G-SYNC, especially at 240Hz:

https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101- ... ettings/9/
Image

However, this isn't directly due to G-SYNC, but due to the limitation of tearing prevention at the given max scanout, as your lowest possible tear-free frametime with VRR can only equal that of your max refresh rate (else you get tearing again).

G-SYNC can actually be considered the most "native" display method of them all if the intent is to have a single complete frame display per single complete scanout cycle.

Also, unlike G-SYNC, it should be noted that many (but not all) strobing methods do add some input lag (typically a half frame or so).

That said, strobing definitely has it's place, but its usefulness can depend on your playstyle, especially in FPS games; if you tend to stare at the crosshair, strobing isn't going to be of much use to you, but if you tend to eye track targets, with or without the crosshair, it can definitely be an advantage where motion clarity and its impact on target tracking is concerned.
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: Acer Predator XB271HU / LG 48CX OS: Windows 10 MB: ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero CPU: i7-8700k GPU: EVGA RTX 3080 FTW3 UG RAM: 32GB G.SKILL TridentZ @3200MHz

deama
Posts: 223
Joined: 07 Aug 2019, 12:00

Re: So is Motion Blur (ULMB, ELMB, etc) the way to go?

Post by deama » 20 Jul 2020, 10:14

jorimt wrote:
20 Jul 2020, 09:28
ramb0 wrote:
10 Jul 2020, 06:19
deama wrote:
20 Jul 2020, 07:43
(gsync adds input lag).
G-SYNC does not add input lag.

Instead, G-SYNC doesn't reduce input lag as much as V-SYNC off can at much higher framerate than refresh rate ratios. And it takes a lot of excess frames (3x, optimally 5x) to create any meaningful input lag reduction with V-SYNC off over G-SYNC, especially at 240Hz:

https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101- ... ettings/9/
Image

However, this isn't directly due to G-SYNC, but due to the limitation of tearing prevention at the given max scanout, as your lowest possible tear-free frametime with VRR can only equal that of your max refresh rate (else you get tearing again).

G-SYNC can actually be considered the most "native" display method of them all if the intent is to have a single complete frame display per single complete scanout cycle.

Also, unlike G-SYNC, it should be noted that many (but not all) strobing methods do add some input lag (typically a half frame or so).

That said, strobing definitely has it's place, but its usefulness can depend on your playstyle, especially in FPS games; if you tend to stare at the crosshair, strobing isn't going to be of much use to you, but if you tend to eye track targets, with or without the crosshair, it can definitely be an advantage where motion clarity and its impact on target tracking is concerned.
That's strange, when I measured the input lag difference on my friend's pc with gsync on/off there was about 20-24ms reduction; was more unstable too.

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jorimt
Posts: 1489
Joined: 04 Nov 2016, 10:44
Location: USA

Re: So is Motion Blur (ULMB, ELMB, etc) the way to go?

Post by jorimt » 20 Jul 2020, 11:28

deama wrote:
20 Jul 2020, 10:14
That's strange, when I measured the input lag difference on my friend's pc with gsync on/off there was about 20-24ms reduction; was more unstable too.
I'd need more details on your G-SYNC settings, test parameters, methodology, and equipment to say for certain, and whether he had a native G-SYNC or G-SYNC Compatible display, but G-SYNC does reverts to V-SYNC behavior with G-SYNC + V-SYNC if your framerate can exceed the refresh rate and you don't have a proper FPS limiter/limit in place, which would give you those increases.

G-SYNC only functions within the refresh rate, and an "at" refresh rate or -1 FPS limit isn't enough to keep it in range at all times. And if you have it uncapped completely, and your framerate is being sustained above the refresh rate, you're getting plain old double buffer V-SYNC behavior with G-SYNC on + V-SYNC on or plain old V-SYNC off behavior with G-SYNC on + V-SYNC off:
https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101- ... ettings/2/

Image
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: Acer Predator XB271HU / LG 48CX OS: Windows 10 MB: ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero CPU: i7-8700k GPU: EVGA RTX 3080 FTW3 UG RAM: 32GB G.SKILL TridentZ @3200MHz

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