Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Talk about NVIDIA G-SYNC, a variable refresh rate (VRR) technology. G-SYNC eliminates stutters, tearing, and reduces input lag. List of G-SYNC Monitors.
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Periphery_OW
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Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Post by Periphery_OW » 17 Jun 2021, 11:35

I've been playing with the following settings for quite some time now in Overwatch:

Specs:
RTX 3080 Ventus +83mhz
9900k @ 5.1
32gb G.Skill trident z @ 3733mhz cl14-15-15-36
Asus PG259QN 360hz
Corsair k65 mini rgb @ 8000hz polling rate
Razer 8khz @ 8000hz polling rate @ 1600 dpi
Aqua control 1000 x 500mm mouse mat

357 fps cap in game (consistent)
G sync on
reflex on + boost
v sync off in game
v sync off in nvcp (reflex forces a 327 fps cap if v sync is on in game or nvcp)

Since I forwent my wireless mice @1000hz for the razer 8khz, I have been loving the tear-free experience plus the 8000hz polling rate, a match made in heaven. It makes me wonder why Razer discourages adaptive sync when used with 8000hz? I would understand discouraging adaptive sync on any refresh rate below 360hz however I would also discourage the need for 8000hz at all below 360hz.

Seems like Razer believes that 8000hz alleviates any desync issues and makes adaptive sync redundant. Any substance to their argument of playing at 400 fps uncapped for overwatch in particular?

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Re: Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 17 Jun 2021, 16:33

Can you please link to the Razer reference? I want to correctly interpret context.

I assume you mean FreeSync/GSYNC and Variable Refresh Rate (VRR) technologies, when you refer to Adaptive Sync, and if so, 8000Hz mice does not make VRR redundant.

P.S. Don’t confuse VRR (VESA Adaptive Sync) with a driver setting, “Adaptive VSYNC” (software toggle in a driver, unrelated to VRR).
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Re: Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Post by Periphery_OW » 28 Jun 2021, 11:34

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
17 Jun 2021, 16:33
Can you please link to the Razer reference? I want to correctly interpret context.

I assume you mean FreeSync/GSYNC and Variable Refresh Rate (VRR) technologies, when you refer to Adaptive Sync, and if so, 8000Hz mice does not make VRR redundant.

P.S. Don’t confuse VRR (VESA Adaptive Sync) with a driver setting, “Adaptive VSYNC” (software toggle in a driver, unrelated to VRR).
To be up front, love your work. You're the man. Here's the direct quote as per PCworld's review when they spoke to Razer:

You'll need to disable adaptive sync—a feature that synchronizes the refresh rate of your monitor to your graphics card to enable smooth, tearing-free gameplay—to truly push the Viper 8K. Razer told Tom’s Hardware that to tap into the Viper 8K’s maximum responsiveness, your PC probably runs esports games faster than your monitor’s refresh rate, and adaptive sync caps frame rates to what your monitor can handle. With an uncapped frame rate, “the benefits of a high-speed mouse are a lot more apparent because the game is able to make use of the high-speed reporting of the mouse to a much greater degree, and the high-speed reporting of the mouse ‘smooths out’ any desync caused due to frame time variation,” Razer said.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3605273 ... eness.html

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Re: Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 28 Jun 2021, 12:39

Ok, now that I understand the context --

Razer is correct that 8KHz really benefits VSYNC OFF more than VRR. Framerates beyond refresh rates are important in esports as ever-increasing framerates beyond Hz still reduces input latency more and more, the even more excess beyond Hz. At these framerate stratospheres, a high-pollrate becomes even more important for these unsynchronized frame rates.

That said, they never used the word "redundant" -- it does NOT make VRR redundant or obsolete because VRR has other benefits when latency is not as critical. And 2-to-8KHz still helps VRR and fixed-Hz. I can, with my eyes, tell the difference between 1KHz and >1KHz (2-8KHz) poll rate -- in smoother mouse cursor moves, smoother window moves, etc. The stroboscopic effect is much smoother. VRR solves many other problems that Razer 8KHz cannot fix; it's a Right Tool for the Right Job. It's still beneficial to use a Viper 8KHz (at anything above 1KHz) along with fixed-Hz and VRR, when you have reasons to stick with fixed Hz and VRR.
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       • Official List of Best Gaming Monitors
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Re: Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Post by Periphery_OW » 28 Jun 2021, 12:47

Redundant definitely wasn't the right word on my part. Since the competitive scene for Overwatch has really taken a backseat, I suppose Razer believes their 8khz was made in mind for CSGO or valorant where there is no hard engine cap (runs as many frames as your system possibly can). Overwatch is engine capped at 400. I guess it really comes down to 357 fps capped G-sync vs 400 fps cap No-sync. As usual, I'll take the g-sync vs uncapped fps to alleviate all tearing which is extremely noticeable in Overwatch where there is so much room for tearing to be extremely distracting. Maybe if I ever pick up valorant that would warrant uncapping my fps.

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Re: Razer suggests no Adaptive sync with 8000hz?

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 28 Jun 2021, 13:58

Periphery_OW wrote:
28 Jun 2021, 12:47
Redundant definitely wasn't the right word on my part. Since the competitive scene for Overwatch has really taken a backseat, I suppose Razer believes their 8khz was made in mind for CSGO or valorant where there is no hard engine cap (runs as many frames as your system possibly can). Overwatch is engine capped at 400. I guess it really comes down to 357 fps capped G-sync vs 400 fps cap No-sync. As usual, I'll take the g-sync vs uncapped fps to alleviate all tearing which is extremely noticeable in Overwatch where there is so much room for tearing to be extremely distracting. Maybe if I ever pick up valorant that would warrant uncapping my fps.
The pros-cons will be extremely tight in your two scenarios so it boils down to personal preference. The fluidity of GSYNC 360Hz versus VSYNC OFF 400fps can actually competitively favour GSYNC in this specific situation.

Jitters/stutters/tearing can distract from competitive performance especially during "framerate-is-near-Hz" situations where the jittering is the worst.

The motion artifacts of unsynchronized non-VRR operation (Hz-vs-framerate) can be the worse poison when a game's cap (400fps) is very near Hz, affecting VSYNC OFF competitive to the point where GSYNC 360Hz becomes superior for Overwatch esports.

P.S. Now, since you're using an in-game cap, which varies in accuracy, the 3fps-below can be experimented, try 10fps and 5fps below (350fps and 355fps caps respectively), to see if it feels better latency-wise. The 3fps-below was from 144Hz days, but with Hz taking less time, sometimes requires a few more frames of cap at the higher refresh rates -- but may not be required for Overwatch.
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter

       To support Blur Busters:
       • Official List of Best Gaming Monitors
       • List of G-SYNC Monitors
       • List of FreeSync Monitors
       • List of Ultrawide Monitors

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