Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Talk about NVIDIA G-SYNC, a variable refresh rate (VRR) technology. G-SYNC eliminates stutters, tearing, and reduces input lag. List of G-SYNC Monitors.
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jorimt
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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by jorimt » 26 May 2022, 09:14

smorgar wrote:
26 May 2022, 06:06
Like one frame repeating and then jumps to next and then goes back to the previous frame and a split second later its smooth again.
To be clear, the "previous" frame is the currently rendered frame (that has already displayed at least once), whereas the "next" frame is the currently rendering frame, which, once complete and delivered, then becomes the new "previous" frame, repeat.
smorgar wrote:
26 May 2022, 06:06
I will try to go down to 300hz and even down to 240 just to see how that plays out.
With G-SYNC and no sync, the current max physical refresh rate is decoupled from frametime (when the framerate is within the refresh rate for the former, and all the time for the latter), so lowering your max physical refresh rate won't help frametime spikes in those scenarios (in fact it may hurt things as now the scanout time is slower, meaning the time between each frame's delivery is less frequent), only lowering your graphical settings and/or average framerate target might, assuming the spikes in question are system/engine-side and due to your system not being able to consistently delivery the average frametime of your current average framerate target.

Again though, if the frametime spikes you are experiencing are due to general I/O bottlenecks at the game engine-level (or other engine-specific quirks), lowering your graphical settings and/or average framerate target may only reduce the perceived length of each spike, and not so much the frequency, and only the developers can fully address that (and most don't, or don't ever fully over the course of their support of the game post-launch).
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: ASUS PG27AQN, LG 48CX VR: Beyond, Quest 3, Reverb G2, Index OS: Windows 11 Pro Case: Fractal Design Torrent PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-1000 MB: ASUS Z790 Hero CPU: Intel i9-13900k w/Noctua NH-U12A GPU: GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC RAM: 32GB G.SKILL Trident Z5 DDR5 6400MHz CL32 SSDs: 2TB WD_BLACK SN850 (OS), 4TB WD_BLACK SN850X (Games) Keyboards: Wooting 60HE, Logitech G915 TKL Mice: Razer Viper Mini SE, Razer Viper 8kHz Sound: Creative Sound Blaster Katana V2 (speakers/amp/DAC), AFUL Performer 8 (IEMs)

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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 27 May 2022, 17:04

smorgar wrote:
26 May 2022, 06:06
This is what im thinking is my problem. And if i look at the judder as i would like to call it that is what it looks like. Like one frame repeating and then jumps to next and then goes back to the previous frame and a split second later its smooth again.
If you are actually seeing things jump backwards then there's a bug happening (I've seen this before).

Old frames with an earlier gametime should never happen, but can from various obscure bugs (driver-based usually).

Nontheless, Jorim is right -- existing frames can be repeated (gametime doesn't change) -- and can create stutters because the game was busy doing something (e.g. loading assets). This can be more visible at >120-240Hz than it was at 60Hz, because asset loads often took less than a 60Hz refresh cycle. So game optimization has sometimes fallen behind the refresh rate race.
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Argus
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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by Argus » 09 Jul 2022, 13:39

jorimt wrote:
24 May 2022, 13:20
Argus wrote:
23 May 2022, 15:11
I get absurd vertical tearing and rippling effect.
You can't experience tearing with properly configured G-SYNC, which leads me to believe it's not fully engaged (or engaged at all) on the monitor model you didn't specify.

Please provide more specifics here, or there's simply not enough information to even start helping you troubleshoot. For instance, can you provide your general PC specs, and name the monitor model and current G-SYNC settings you're experiencing issues with?

Also, are you experiencing the same or similar issues on the problem setup with G-SYNC off + V-SYNC off + uncapped framerate? If so, that would point to a frametime performance issue separate of G-SYNC operation, which can vary in severity and frequency by system and/or game.

My current specs are:

Dell s2716dg Monitor.
3080ti FTW3 EVGA (upgraded from a 1080ti EVGA but it made no difference at all whatsoever)
10850K CPU
My OS is: Windows 10 Pro for Workstations, build 19043.1052, version 21H1


Hello, sorry for the late response.
I haven't been gaming much recently cuz of life and tech issues.

I just came back to my PC and now it's even worse. For some reason out of nowhere, I now get completely unavoidable screen tearing no matter what settings I use. V-sync does not seem to ever work whether its enable in-game or through the NV control panel.

Turning off G-sync fixes the obvious screen tearing but I still get noticeable tearing with just V-sync on.

To clarify, I get horrendous tearing with G-sync + V-sync + 140 fps cap.

Turning off G-sync and just having V-sync+144 fps cap makes gaming bearable but still eye straining with some screen tearing near the bottom of the screen.

I have tried almost every variation of available settings as well as the recommended settings in the blur busters G-sync guide.

Even before this problem became worse than what I originally posted, I always felt strained while playing on this setup.

My old weak g750 laptop which would wildly fluctuate between 30-60 fps felt so very smooth and pleasant on my eyes, even with crackling diagonal screen tearing. Even now, I always feel excited to game on that old laptop because I know I won't feel sick or in pain unlike my current setup. I almost never even turn on my main desktop anymore.

I plan on getting some https://www.testufo.com/animation-time-graph and https://www.testufo.com/frameskipping pics in a later post. I have noticed that sometimes I get 146 fps even though I am running a 143.9967hz and with an FPS cap of 140. Not sure what is going on.

I may try installing and reinstalling various different Windows 10 builds just to troubleshoot.

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jorimt
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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by jorimt » 09 Jul 2022, 17:36

Argus wrote:
09 Jul 2022, 13:39
I have tried almost every variation of available settings as well as the recommended settings in the blur busters G-sync guide.
If that model (which is a native G-SYNC monitor containing a module) doesn't work in G-SYNC mode and isn't tear-free with the below configuration, then something is faulty:

1. DisplayPort cable plugged in from GPU to monitor
2. Nvidia Control Panel > Display > Change resolution > 2560 x 1440 (native), 144Hz
3. Nvidia Control Panel > Display > "Enable G-SYNC, G-SYNC Compatible" checked, "Enable for windowed and full screen mode" selected
4. Nvidia Control Panel > 3D settings > Manage 3D settings > Vertical sync "On"
5. ~141 FPS limit set either with an in-game limiter, or with an external limiter such as Nvidia Control Panel or RTSS.
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Displays: ASUS PG27AQN, LG 48CX VR: Beyond, Quest 3, Reverb G2, Index OS: Windows 11 Pro Case: Fractal Design Torrent PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-1000 MB: ASUS Z790 Hero CPU: Intel i9-13900k w/Noctua NH-U12A GPU: GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC RAM: 32GB G.SKILL Trident Z5 DDR5 6400MHz CL32 SSDs: 2TB WD_BLACK SN850 (OS), 4TB WD_BLACK SN850X (Games) Keyboards: Wooting 60HE, Logitech G915 TKL Mice: Razer Viper Mini SE, Razer Viper 8kHz Sound: Creative Sound Blaster Katana V2 (speakers/amp/DAC), AFUL Performer 8 (IEMs)

Argus
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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by Argus » 09 Jul 2022, 18:11

jorimt wrote:
09 Jul 2022, 17:36
Argus wrote:
09 Jul 2022, 13:39
I have tried almost every variation of available settings as well as the recommended settings in the blur busters G-sync guide.
If that model (which is a native G-SYNC monitor containing a module) doesn't work in G-SYNC mode and isn't tear-free with the below configuration, then something is faulty:

1. DisplayPort cable plugged in from GPU to monitor
2. Nvidia Control Panel > Display > Change resolution > 2560 x 1440 (native), 144Hz
3. Nvidia Control Panel > Display > "Enable G-SYNC, G-SYNC Compatible" checked, "Enable for windowed and full screen mode" selected
4. Nvidia Control Panel > 3D settings > Manage 3D settings > Vertical sync "On"
5. ~141 FPS limit set either with an in-game limiter, or with an external limiter such as Nvidia Control Panel or RTSS.

The new super tearing that appeared after my OP is gone but I still notice slight tearing near the bottom of the screen with these settings.
Even in games where I don't notice tearing, I get eye strain.
Overall, my eyes feel less strained when I just do vsync and nothing else.
I'm not sure what it is but all I know is that when I have g-sync on, I get feelings of distraction and strain even if it seems like nothing is wrong.
When I just use vsync and nothing else, the strain is still there but not to the point where I have to quit gaming. I can play an hour or two before having to quit as opposed to having to quit immediately with G-sync on.
So in other words, just back to square one.

I'll reinstall a few different windows versions and reseat all my hardware over the week and report my findings.

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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 10 Jul 2022, 22:56

Easiest fix:
Use VSYNC ON in NVCP
Use VSYNC OFF in-game

Also try testing RTSS to framerate cap instead of in-game cap, if not fully fixed.
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Argus
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Re: Absurd G-sync Microstutter

Post by Argus » 07 Aug 2022, 09:11

Tried reseating all my hardware and reinstalling several different versions of windows. Nothing worked. Still get eye strain and headaches. Only things I haven't swapped out are the Monitor, G502 mouse, Fiio amp, and keyboard.

On a sidenote, I learned that Dell monitors have overdrive on by default and you cannot turn it off and only Dell monitors disallow you from turning it off...

Still wanna ask, is there anyway to turn off overdrive on Dell monitors? Maybe my monitor settings are being changed without me knowing and Dell monitors have hardly any information on them. My current monitor is an old dell sd2716dg. Thanks.

EDIT: Also wanted to note that even with G-sync turned off completely, I still get eye strain and headaches on this monitor. Not sure what changed since it clearly didn't do this several years ago.

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