Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Talk about NVIDIA G-SYNC, a variable refresh rate (VRR) technology. G-SYNC eliminates stutters, tearing, and reduces input lag. List of G-SYNC Monitors.
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jorimt
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by jorimt » 29 Oct 2019, 21:30

Darktalon wrote:Will this cost framerates to use? Like if I'm only getting 90 fps before with a 144 hz monitor, is it gonna cost some more frames to have ultra low latency running?
Like with anything involving the pre-rendered frames queue, it'll depend on your system's capabilities mixed with the given game; there's no single, fixed answer that can blanket all configurations and all games, unfortunately.

If you're worried about this, what you can do is pick a demanding scene in a game, turn Low Latency Mode off, note the average FPS, then turn Low Latency Mode to "Ultra," and note the average FPS in the same scene (or at least, a similar scene for some of those online games where it makes like-for-like comparisons more difficult to achieve), repeat. That'll give you a good idea on whether Ultra will reduce an otherwise higher average FPS.

That said, no, with a capable system, Ultra shouldn't typically reduce your average FPS to a noteable degree vs. off.
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

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1000WATT
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by 1000WATT » 29 Oct 2019, 22:03

jorimt wrote:Hmm, in my short observation, at 144Hz with G-SYNC + V-SYNC + Ultra Low Latency + uncapped FPS, I am indeed getting an auto cap to 138 FPS in all of the three games I briefly tested.

on my computer. 165Hz with G-SYNC + V-SYNC + Ultra Low Latency + uncapped FPS .auto cap to 157,7 FPS
doesn't work in league of legends.
does not work in windowed mode.

Saraneth
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by Saraneth » 30 Oct 2019, 01:01

On my 75Hz G-sync compatible monitor with G-sync and V-sync plus Ultra low latency + uncapped fps I still sit at 75fps on Modern Warfare. Doesn't seem to be lowering it for me. Guess I still need to lower the fps to 72/73 manually. Or is the reduced V-sync latency enough?

ceaton88
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by ceaton88 » 30 Oct 2019, 02:49

jorimt wrote:Hmm, in my short observation, at 144Hz with G-SYNC + V-SYNC + Ultra Low Latency + uncapped FPS, I am indeed getting an auto cap to 138 FPS in all of the three games I briefly tested.

Obviously, high-speed testing and the like will have to be done to say for certain, but if it functions like I think it does, and it is indeed auto capping below the refresh rate with G-SYNC active, then, theoretically, it could potentially have similar latency to using a -3 FPS limit with RTSS.

Again, it will be interesting to see if Battle(non)sense revisits in the near future.
Thanks for this. Obviously a lot of us have been applying the fps limiter method manually with RTSS for some time now, do you know of any other NULL benefits above and beyond the automatic driver fps limiter as you describe?

7Z7
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by 7Z7 » 30 Oct 2019, 05:52

Hello

you confirm that it is always more interesting to do G-Sync + V-Sync ON + Limit -3 FPS without activating Nvidia's Ultra Low Latency mode? (And this, in all games?)

It does not provide any advantage in short this Ultra Low Latency mode?

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jorimt
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by jorimt » 30 Oct 2019, 08:15

^ Regarding the last few posts: I casually checked this by eye with three games. There was no testing involved. All I was doing was confirming with @Vleeswolf that it indeed appeared to be causing some form of auto-capping in the games I tried it in (which may simply be a side-effect of how it reduces the pre-rendered frames queue when using G-SYNC in specific conditions, for all we know).

The rest is pure, subjective speculation at this point.

There are probably conditions that a system/game must meet for this to occur, thus why it isn't occurring in every configuration and/or game that it is tried in.

That said, Low Latency Mode primarily affects the pre-rendered frames queue, and primarily when you're GPU-limited. It typically does not reduce sync-induced input lag.

Whatever it's doing in the games that are auto-capping with G-SYNC + Ultra won't be known until it is tested, and again, I've witnessed similar behavior with G-SYNC + Fast Sync (which I already have 144Hz input lag numbers for; it had 1 more frame of lag than the in-game FPS limiter), and I haven't recommended that combo either.

Until more is known about this specific configuration (and what exactly Nvidia has done here), I still suggest a -3 FPS limit (either in-game or RTSS) when using G-SYNC to stay in its range and prevent all sync-induced input lag. Whether you use that in conjunction with Low Latency "On" or "Ultra" is up to you, the effects of which will likely depend on the game anyway.

That, and I'm pretty sure if this new G-SYNC + Ultra combo was primarily intended as a global automatic FPS limiting mechanism for G-SYNC, it would be advertised as such by Nvidia (notwithstanding the fact they've never acknowledged the benefits of G-SYNC + FPS limiters in the past for whatever reason).
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

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pox02
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by pox02 » 31 Oct 2019, 18:00

I checked and it works most of the games probably don't need rtss anymore
monitors xg258q aw2518hf 27GK750F-B pg248q xg240r lg w2363d-pf xb270hu

mitch.99
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by mitch.99 » 01 Nov 2019, 00:36

Chief Blur Buster wrote:This could reduce the latency differential between GSYNC below-Hz and equal-Hz framerates. Most people just don't bother to cap GSYNC 3fps below, so automating this by 75%+ with NULL will be a benefit to industry.
Hey chief is there a way i can contact you personally about monitors or should i just make a thread?

Also where would i put questions regarding 144hz vs 240hz?

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apexpr3d
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by apexpr3d » 01 Nov 2019, 03:21

Now let's just hope they add NULL to laptops, cause right now, laptops don't have the option to enable NULL or change the max pre-rendered frames.

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jorimt
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Re: Driver 441.08: Ultra-Low Latency Now with G-SYNC Support

Post by jorimt » 01 Nov 2019, 08:57

pox02 wrote:I checked and it works most of the games probably don't need rtss anymore
You're fully entitled to your opinion, but I'll just point out that I created this thread to avoid assumptive statements such as this. Real testing will have to be done before anything like that can be said for certain.

For instance, I'm not sure how Nvidia is getting such high latency numbers across their test games (one of them being Overwatch) in the first place (even supposedly with V-SYNC OFF):

Image

That's 81ms @60Hz with G-SYNC with Nvidia's tests vs. 39ms @60hz with G-SYNC from my tests with Overwatch (and mine were done before "Ultra" was even available):

Image

Granted, their 81ms number is averaged from Overwatch and four other games, but even then, it seems too high. The only thing I can think is they're counting middle-screen reactions only (whereas I was counting first on-screen reactions), yet that also seems too high, regardless.

I'll say it again: even with G-SYNC, "Ultra" Low Latency Mode is primarily intended to reduce input lag in GPU-bound situations by reducing the pre-rendered frames queue, which is entirely separate from sync-induced input lag due to V-SYNC back-pressure caused by sustained framrates above the refresh rate.

This auto-capping behavior, whatever it is, by eye, is already identical to what I witnessed with G-SYNC + Fast Sync in my original tests, and again, I couldn't recommend that combo, because I couldn't guarantee what it was doing was retaining full G-SYNC functionality.

Time will certainly tell, but for now, Low Latency Mode (either "On" or "Ultra") should be treated as a companion to an FPS limiter (for the direct purposes of avoiding V-SYNC input lag) when using G-SYNC until this is properly tested.
(jorimt: /jor-uhm-tee/)
Author: Blur Busters "G-SYNC 101" Series

Display: Acer Predator XB271HU OS: Windows 10 Pro MB: ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero CPU: i7-8700k GPU: EVGA GTX 1080 Ti FTW3 RAM: 32GB G.SKILL TridentZ @3200MHz

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