There is no smooth picture at 240Hz and above everything seems fast and I am very slow games work as if at 60-100 fps

[DanGamesTwitch]

Hi, for the past 3-4 years, I've been struggling with a problem of an unclear and choppy image. It feels like there’s not enough FPS in games, but the FPS is stable at 600-900 depending on the game. I also notice excessive screen shaking when shooting, and the screen blurs too much during turns, making it hard to see anything. It feels like there’s a blur effect applied, along with a sensation of increased recoil in games. I’ve tried all settings and tweaks; four people have configured my BIOS, but nothing has changed. My monitor is a Zowie BenQ XL2546. I live in new buildings with good electricity supply. I’ve changed my PC three times but haven’t changed the monitor. There are no visual problems with the monitor, but all games feel either smooth or as if they’re running at 60 Hz, plus heavy character movement feels sluggish.

CS2 (800 FPS)
Apex (300 FPS)
Warzone (250-290 FPS)

(PC)
R 77800X3D
RTX 4070 TI
DDR5 Team Group T-Create 6000
Gigabyte B650 Gaming X AX V2

(Monitor)
Zowie BenQ XL2546
Dyac Premium
AMA Premium

There is no smooth image in games at all.


Please tell me if there could be a problem with the monitor. Has anyone encountered something similar?

[InputLagger]

Hi, for the past 3-4 years, I've been struggling with a problem of an unclear and choppy image. It feels like there’s not enough FPS in games, but the FPS is stable at 600-900 depending on the game. I also notice excessive screen shaking when shooting, and the screen blurs too much during turns, making it hard to see anything. It feels like there’s a blur effect applied, along with a sensation of increased recoil in games. I’ve tried all settings and tweaks; four people have configured my BIOS, but nothing has changed. My monitor is a Zowie BenQ XL2546. I live in new buildings with good electricity supply. I’ve changed my PC three times but haven’t changed the monitor. There are no visual problems with the monitor, but all games feel either smooth or as if they’re running at 60 Hz, plus heavy character movement feels sluggish.

CS2 (800 FPS)
Apex (300 FPS)
Warzone (250-290 FPS)

(PC)
R 77800X3D
RTX 4070 TI
DDR5 Team Group T-Create 6000
Gigabyte B650 Gaming X AX V2

(Monitor)
Zowie BenQ XL2546
Dyac Premium
AMA Premium

There is no smooth image in games at all.


Please tell me if there could be a problem with the monitor. Has anyone encountered something similar?

You are media person, I suppose? You should contact any popular tech YouTuber or blogger about this, I bet you have many contacts in industry. Almost everyone here in forums are ordinary persons

[MeveSPB]

I also have the same monitor, and sometimes it seems to me that I have problems too.

I've tried many different fixes, but there are no solutions yet. It seems to me that up to a certain point he was perfect. And then abruptly out of sync, skipping frames, shaking, blurring.

[kyube]

Hi, for the past 3-4 years, I've been struggling with a problem of an unclear and choppy image.
It feels like there’s not enough FPS in games, but the FPS is stable at 600-900 depending on the game.
I also notice excessive screen shaking when shooting, and the screen blurs too much during turns, making it hard to see anything.
It feels like there’s a blur effect applied, along with a sensation of increased recoil in games.
I’ve tried all settings and tweaks; four people have configured my BIOS, but nothing has changed.
My monitor is a Zowie BenQ XL2546. I live in new buildings with good electricity supply. I’ve changed my PC three times but haven’t changed the monitor.
There are no visual problems with the monitor, but all games feel either smooth or as if they’re running at 60 Hz, plus heavy character movement feels sluggish.

CS2 (800 FPS)
Apex (300 FPS)
Warzone (250-290 FPS)

(PC)
R7 7800X3D / RTX 4070 TI
DDR5 Team Group T-Create 6000
Gigabyte B650 Gaming X AX V2

(Monitor)
Zowie BenQ XL2546
Dyac Premium
AMA Premium

There is no smooth image in games at all.
Please tell me if there could be a problem with the monitor. Has anyone encountered something similar?

Read this first:
viewtopic.php?t=3555

Afterwards, read this:
https://github.com/BoringBoredom/PC-Opt ... le#monitor
(there's a link to FPS capping calculator there)

This was to clear out display-related variables, about the rest...

Could you take a ZenTimings screenshot of your current RAM profile?
Refer to similarly titled threads which have been posted in the past few days, I assume the culprit is similar as the other situations.
What Windows version (winver command) are you using?
What mouse, keyboard, other USB devices?
What Nvidia driver are you using? Are you using MPOs? What in-game resolution are you using while playing?
Are you using any overlays and/or other app sw in the backgroud while playing?

[bleya99]

Hi, for the past 3-4 years, I've been struggling with a problem of an unclear and choppy image.
It feels like there’s not enough FPS in games, but the FPS is stable at 600-900 depending on the game.
I also notice excessive screen shaking when shooting, and the screen blurs too much during turns, making it hard to see anything.
It feels like there’s a blur effect applied, along with a sensation of increased recoil in games.
I’ve tried all settings and tweaks; four people have configured my BIOS, but nothing has changed.
My monitor is a Zowie BenQ XL2546. I live in new buildings with good electricity supply. I’ve changed my PC three times but haven’t changed the monitor.
There are no visual problems with the monitor, but all games feel either smooth or as if they’re running at 60 Hz, plus heavy character movement feels sluggish.

CS2 (800 FPS)
Apex (300 FPS)
Warzone (250-290 FPS)

(PC)
R7 7800X3D / RTX 4070 TI
DDR5 Team Group T-Create 6000
Gigabyte B650 Gaming X AX V2

(Monitor)
Zowie BenQ XL2546
Dyac Premium
AMA Premium

There is no smooth image in games at all.
Please tell me if there could be a problem with the monitor. Has anyone encountered something similar?

Read this first:
viewtopic.php?t=3555

Afterwards, read this:
https://github.com/BoringBoredom/PC-Opt ... le#monitor
(there's a link to FPS capping calculator there)

This was to clear out display-related variables, about the rest...

Could you take a ZenTimings screenshot of your current RAM profile?
Refer to similarly titled threads which have been posted in the past few days, I assume the culprit is similar as the other situations.
What Windows version (winver command) are you using?
What mouse, keyboard, other USB devices?
What Nvidia driver are you using? Are you using MPOs? What in-game resolution are you using while playing?
Are you using any overlays and/or other app sw in the backgroud while playing?

Hey Kyube, I love your recent input towards RAM optimizations and how greatly it can affect a better experience, or one that most people come here from.

I'd like to send my Zentimings, and perhaps you can help me and others with some timings, I realize this is not ideal, as my current setup can't be upgraded.

-Winver = Win 10 LTSC 21H2
-Pulsar x2 lite, forgot the brand of the keyboard, yellow switches but 125hz, Logitech G pro X wireless (already set it 2.4ghz on channel 6, after reading some threads on reddit)
-566.03, 1080ti, MPOs are currently enabled (default), disabling them makes everything too smooth, appearing as "floaty" to me. Default resolutions, 1920x1080, 144 hz.
No overlays, I do use MSI afterburner and RTSS (I cap FPS with specific apps, it's almost always different). CSGO is literally not playable for me if I dont use RTSS, the frametimes otherwise are horrendous.

And finally, my current RAM setup. The system is stable. default (2133, CL17) felt okay, but still delayed, better then CL 16 3466 (expo).

https://ibb.co/Y7Jht8S1

Also sending the part number of RAM for a checkup from CPU Z (obviously dual channel): https://ibb.co/DgYPfd1Y

Current DRAM voltage is 1.33 or 1.35.

I have a very budget motherboard, so chasing higher freq is not needed, I don't need extra fps, although I do want to eliminate of what I can control.

What suggestions do you have regarding the RAM optimizations?

[kyube]

-Winver = Win 10 LTSC 21H2
-Pulsar x2 lite,
forgot the brand of the keyboard, yellow switches but 125hz,
Logitech G pro X wireless (already set it 2.4ghz on channel 6, after reading some threads on reddit)
-566.03, 1080ti, MPOs are currently enabled (default), disabling them makes everything too smooth, appearing as "floaty" to me.
Default resolutions, 1920x1080, 144 hz.
No overlays, I do use MSI afterburner and RTSS (I cap FPS with specific apps, it's almost always different). CSGO is literally not playable for me if I dont use RTSS, the frametimes otherwise are horrendous.

And finally, my current RAM setup. The system is stable. default (2133, CL17) felt okay, but still delayed, better then CL 16 3466 (expo).

https://ibb.co/Y7Jht8S1

Also sending the part number of RAM for a checkup from CPU Z (obviously dual channel): https://ibb.co/DgYPfd1Y

Current DRAM voltage is 1.33 or 1.35.

I have a very budget motherboard, so chasing higher freq is not needed, I don't need extra fps, although I do want to eliminate of what I can control.

What suggestions do you have regarding the RAM optimizations?

I have a few questions / suggestions before I do any kind of concrete recommendations:
1.) If you are playing CS2 (I assume you've mislabeled it as CSGO), then you'll need a newer Windows such as W10 22H2 or W11 23H2 (can't tell you which one would perform better on your GPU + CPU + winver combo) to be able to play Faceit (idk if u can even play it on 21H2 LTSC).
Whether you'll notice better performance from your LTSC 21H2 install is up in the air. I personally benefited from switching to 23H2 with timer res registry edit. That, paired with the background polling rate change greatly enhanced my “smoothness”.
Reinstalling OS after running EXPO disabled is very strongly advised to fix any lingering corruption.

MPOs do not work on pre-Turing GPUs such as the 1080ti, so I don't know what exactly you're experiencing
It's interesting to me that you mention that it feels “too floaty”.
Perhaps the “too floaty” feel is how a PC is supposed to feel like objectively, but you are not used to it since you're used to a nerfed version of mouse feel?
Relying on “feel” can be quite deceiving, considering how strong the placebo effect is. Not to mention the sheer amount of misinformation online spread by (un)intended, malicious users.

2.) How exactly have you managed to pin the mouse to a specific channel on the 2.4GHz spectrum? As far as I'm aware, Logitech chose to implement channel choice automatically without allowing users to choose it themselves.

3.) The keyboard & (gerenal) display (specs) you've mentioned are a serious bottleneck in your overall total system latency. If you are able to, try upgrading those ASAP.

4.) What do you deem as “The system is stable”?
What app sw have you ran & for what duration? Some users like to claim “stable” after running very mild tests such as MemTest86 for an hour. It's very individual what someone deems “stable”.
It is difficult to assess this on the surface like this, as each IMC & mobo combination is different in this regard.
In general for AM4, I'd usually stick to 3200MHz (from AMD spec for Zen3) on B550 boards, but your A320M-K can definitely be a bottleneck for achieving your IMC's & RAM kit's full potential.
CS doesn't scale as much (~10% at best) with lower r/w RAM latency or higher RAM bandwidth =https://kingfaris.co.uk/blog/intel-ram ... go(source), whether you'll notice a increase is something you need to test yourself.

I'd like to quote @shrimps again:

No amount of memory stress testing is enough, stress testing is just an approximation of stability.
Learn patterns of your memory/imc and apply an overclock that not only passes tests, but also has headroom for when conditions change.

PresentMon + CS2 benchmark map should reveal how much performance you can gain between RAM clock rate increases.
The jump from 2400MHz to 3200MHz can be quite large in terms of bandwidth, YMMV.

In terms of importance of upgrade:
Monitor, keyboard, GPU
I assume you are heavily GPU limited in CS2 if you play on 1080p, since even 3080's struggle (<200fps) on 1080p once smokes & mollies are dropped.

I wouldn't bother trying to find a better motherboard and opt for a whole platform upgrade to DDR5 instead.
AM5 or LGA1700, whichever you prefer.
I personally prefer the former due to the capability to do G1 CR1 & large L3 cache CPUs.

[bleya99]

-Winver = Win 10 LTSC 21H2
-Pulsar x2 lite,
forgot the brand of the keyboard, yellow switches but 125hz,
Logitech G pro X wireless (already set it 2.4ghz on channel 6, after reading some threads on reddit)
-566.03, 1080ti, MPOs are currently enabled (default), disabling them makes everything too smooth, appearing as "floaty" to me.
Default resolutions, 1920x1080, 144 hz.
No overlays, I do use MSI afterburner and RTSS (I cap FPS with specific apps, it's almost always different). CSGO is literally not playable for me if I dont use RTSS, the frametimes otherwise are horrendous.

And finally, my current RAM setup. The system is stable. default (2133, CL17) felt okay, but still delayed, better then CL 16 3466 (expo).

https://ibb.co/Y7Jht8S1

Also sending the part number of RAM for a checkup from CPU Z (obviously dual channel): https://ibb.co/DgYPfd1Y

Current DRAM voltage is 1.33 or 1.35.

I have a very budget motherboard, so chasing higher freq is not needed, I don't need extra fps, although I do want to eliminate of what I can control.

What suggestions do you have regarding the RAM optimizations?

I have a few questions / suggestions before I do any kind of concrete recommendations:
1.) If you are playing CS2 (I assume you've mislabeled it as CSGO), then you'll need a newer Windows such as W10 22H2 or W11 23H2 (can't tell you which one would perform better on your GPU + CPU + winver combo) to be able to play Faceit (idk if u can even play it on 21H2 LTSC).
Whether you'll notice better performance from your LTSC 21H2 install is up in the air. I personally benefited from switching to 23H2 with timer res registry edit. That, paired with the background polling rate change greatly enhanced my “smoothness”.
Reinstalling OS after running EXPO disabled is very strongly advised to fix any lingering corruption.

MPOs do not work on pre-Turing GPUs such as the 1080ti, so I don't know what exactly you're experiencing
It's interesting to me that you mention that it feels “too floaty”.
Perhaps the “too floaty” feel is how a PC is supposed to feel like objectively, but you are not used to it since you're used to a nerfed version of mouse feel?
Relying on “feel” can be quite deceiving, considering how strong the placebo effect is. Not to mention the sheer amount of misinformation online spread by (un)intended, malicious users.

2.) How exactly have you managed to pin the mouse to a specific channel on the 2.4GHz spectrum? As far as I'm aware, Logitech chose to implement channel choice automatically without allowing users to choose it themselves.

3.) The keyboard & (gerenal) display (specs) you've mentioned are a serious bottleneck in your overall total system latency. If you are able to, try upgrading those ASAP.

4.) What do you deem as “The system is stable”?
What app sw have you ran & for what duration? Some users like to claim “stable” after running very mild tests such as MemTest86 for an hour. It's very individual what someone deems “stable”.
It is difficult to assess this on the surface like this, as each IMC & mobo combination is different in this regard.
In general for AM4, I'd usually stick to 3200MHz (from AMD spec for Zen3) on B550 boards, but your A320M-K can definitely be a bottleneck for achieving your IMC's & RAM kit's full potential.
CS doesn't scale as much (~10% at best) with lower r/w RAM latency or higher RAM bandwidth =https://kingfaris.co.uk/blog/intel-ram ... go(source), whether you'll notice a increase is something you need to test yourself.

I'd like to quote @shrimps again:

No amount of memory stress testing is enough, stress testing is just an approximation of stability.
Learn patterns of your memory/imc and apply an overclock that not only passes tests, but also has headroom for when conditions change.

PresentMon + CS2 benchmark map should reveal how much performance you can gain between RAM clock rate increases.
The jump from 2400MHz to 3200MHz can be quite large in terms of bandwidth, YMMV.

In terms of importance of upgrade:
Monitor, keyboard, GPU
I assume you are heavily GPU limited in CS2 if you play on 1080p, since even 3080's struggle (<200fps) on 1080p once smokes & mollies are dropped.

I wouldn't bother trying to find a better motherboard and opt for a whole platform upgrade to DDR5 instead.
AM5 or LGA1700, whichever you prefer.
I personally prefer the former due to the capability to do G1 CR1 & large L3 cache CPUs.

Currently running r5 5600+1080ti, which is totally fine for my needs, I gave up on FPS games long time ago due to desync, and now just play casually.

When MPO is set to 05 (disabled) the whole experience becomes smoother, desktop, games, sensitivity most of all, and feels out of place, perhaps that's how it's supposed to work. But reading this forum throughout the years, perhaps I've fallen in that trap of if too smooth=floaty.

2) when mentioning 2.4ghz channel, I forgot to mention I was talking about WiFi, so it can remove static I am constantly hearing from the Logitech G pro X headset I have) - I can't seem to find the precise post on Reddit, but you can either set 2.4ghz channel to Channel 6 or 11, that should remove the static noise.

3) I realize keyboard is the biggest bottleneck here, monitor is AOC G24g2.

4) When I said stable, I did indeed had my own version in mind, an hour or two of Memtest86, and have been rocking this setup for more then half a year, playing various games and doing different tasks, I haven't noticed a slowdown or stutters. 2400mhz feels smoother then either 3000mhz cl15 (DOCP) or 3466 cl 16 (also DOCP profile), I tried tweaking briefly some primary timings from 3000/3466 to maybe get a result towards latency/fps.

The whole point is, im not chasing frames, even having 15-20 more frames does not mean anything to me. In fact, having frames more then 144 feels like 80-90 fps. Setting it to 150 fps is perfect balance between tearing and consistency. Obviously I've tried v sync + g sync varitations (-3 max fps), and they are great in Apex for an example (talking in my case) however in CS2 it doesn't bring that big of a benefit. I've tried multiple ways to cap my frames, and for CS2, and ingame fps is subpar.

As I've stated before, I'm just looking to utilize the setup for the least latency (obviously im aware better hardware will achieve this), so I wanted to make sure I did everything I could from the software perspective.

All in all, 2400mhz cl 11 feels way better then either 3000 cl15 or 3466 cl 16. As mentioned above, smoothness is better on 2400mhz, but lower latency is noticeable (cl11), and considering my fps is capped, additional frames are useless.

I realize there is almost nothing that can be done, and I do thank you once again for your input towards RAM, as I do believe most users do struggle with incorrect profiles.

[kyube]

Currently running r5 5600+1080ti, which is totally fine for my needs, I gave up on FPS games long time ago due to desync, and now just play casually.

When MPO is set to 05 (disabled) the whole experience becomes smoother, desktop, games, sensitivity most of all, and feels out of place, perhaps that's how it's supposed to work. But reading this forum throughout the years, perhaps I've fallen in that trap of if too smooth=floaty.

Yes, I find it quite difficult to objectively quantify the term "floaty".
Everyone had different HW & SW journeys & combinations which "feel right" for them, which may be actually objectively bad or perhaps subjectively bad to someone else.
There's also the heavy psychological & physiological factor which impact any anecdotal evidence.

2) when mentioning 2.4ghz channel, I forgot to mention I was talking about WiFi, so it can remove static I am constantly hearing from the Logitech G pro X headset I have) - I can't seem to find the precise post on Reddit, but you can either set 2.4ghz channel to Channel 6 or 11, that should remove the static noise.

Ah, that makes sense.
Yes, access points (commonly wrongly referred to as "routers") & living in areas which are bombarded with RF interference on the 2.4GHz band can cause issues with any wireless device.
The channel 6 & 11 "trick" is to avoid overlapping, as shown here:

Ideally, every router/AP would have these pre-defined out of the box, but sadly most routers/AP's are set to "Auto" where the device "decides" which is the least busy channel.Usually leads to detrimental performance altogether.

4) When I said stable, I did indeed had my own version in mind, an hour or two of Memtest86, and have been rocking this setup for more then half a year, playing various games and doing different tasks, I haven't noticed a slowdown or stutters. 2400mhz feels smoother then either 3000mhz cl15 (DOCP) or 3466 cl 16 (also DOCP profile), I tried tweaking briefly some primary timings from 3000/3466 to maybe get a result towards latency/fps.

I strongly recommend that you try using RamTestPro, HCI MemTest & other stress-tests for at least +6h to hopefully have a decent foundation to work off.
MemTest86 (even when bootable) is not enough, especially not for only 1–2h.
There are users who even go as far as to run it for +24H to ensure maximum stability / least amount of potential jitter / macrostuttering / performance regression from RAM tuning.
RAM temperatures & the hefty amount of RGB some kits have can make cause instabilities.
Ultimately though, it is very IMC & mobo dependent.

The whole point is, im not chasing frames, even having 15-20 more frames does not mean anything to me. In fact, having frames more then 144 feels like 80-90 fps. Setting it to 150 fps is perfect balance between tearing and consistency. Obviously I've tried v sync + g sync varitations (-3 max fps), and they are great in Apex for an example (talking in my case) however in CS2 it doesn't bring that big of a benefit. I've tried multiple ways to cap my frames, and for CS2, and ingame fps is subpar.

As I've stated before, I'm just looking to utilize the setup for the least latency (obviously im aware better hardware will achieve this), so I wanted to make sure I did everything I could from the software perspective.

All in all, 2400mhz cl 11 feels way better then either 3000 cl15 or 3466 cl 16. As mentioned above, smoothness is better on 2400mhz, but lower latency is noticeable (cl11), and considering my fps is capped, additional frames are useless.

I realize there is almost nothing that can be done, and I do thank you once again for your input towards RAM, as I do believe most users do struggle with incorrect profiles.

It's interesting that you note that >144fps "feels worse" to you. Take a look at these articles:
https://github.com/BoringBoredom/PC-Opt ... le#monitor
https://blurbusters.com/faq/benefits-of ... resh-rate/

I think that frame rate above refresh rate is never "useless".
Latency is what governs the difference between the digital & analog realm. The lesser the latency, the more "real" & "direct" everything will feel.
This assumes the distribution is consistent w/ outliers not being large (max & min being tight)
I do believe that potential RAM sheningans can worsen what you feel as well, but there's to many variables at play to say for certain.

I do agree that CS2's fps_max is very subpar. It is mindboggling how a large company such as Valve & other game developers seem to be completely ignorant on the topic of good frame pacing.
I've yet to find a modern game which has a great frame rate limiter implementation... It's not even hard to implement, it just seems like there's lack of incentive about this topic?...

Slightly off-topic:
Very concerning world to be in where $1mil tournaments in a competitive game are at the mercy of Valve's atrocious attempt at frame pacing, heavily botched scam attempt at "fixing" networking ("sub-tick") & "twitter tweakers" who are clueless on HW & SW and destroy LAN PC's with their "tweaks", thus causing severe game crashing in a majority of tournaments.
The last part isn't even limited to CS2...
Seems like tournaments are a roulette of which PC's CPU has the best IMC to avoid jittering from unstable RAM

[DanGamesTwitch]

When minimizing and restoring the game, it suddenly becomes much smoother and more lively. This lasts for about 10 seconds, then it becomes choppy again
alt+tab

[InputLagger]

When minimizing and restoring the game, it suddenly becomes much smoother and more lively. This lasts for about 10 seconds, then it becomes choppy again
alt+tab

Any contacts? viewtopic.php?f=10&t=14642&view=unread#p116021