NVIDIA G-Sync Pulsar monitor - Asus ROG Strix XG27AQNGV

[tsarri]

The question is, does this scenario ( vsync + gsync + reflex) result in increased latency as opposed to totally uncapped frames + reflex? The answer is yes it does, very slightly. We're talking 1ms or less difference though.

And I care about microseconds added, which is why I said that it's not "increased latency".
I think you don't understand how VRR works, hence your claim of it adding any processing latency.

On the Pulsar panels, there's no 'added latency'.

You can test that yourself in a game like cs2.

Funnily enough, CS2 performs better when you do GSYNC+VSYNC+Reflex (encapsulating your general frametime).
I believe you need to distinguish the 'tearing' portion of fixed refresh rate from actual lower total system latency.

I've been using ULMB2 for over a year, there is no doubt ULMB2 adds some degree of processing latency. But that's been the case with all other backlight strobing techs as far as I'm aware of (dyac, elmb, ulmb). There are plenty of people, I would wager most people actually, that would simply not even notice a 3 or 4ms increase in total system latency. So it certainly is a "small amount" for those people at least.

As for purely ULMB2, It's heavily model-dependant.
You can take a look at ULMB2 data we have:
https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/ ... ro-pg248qp
https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/ ... hz-pg27aqn

My friend I have to say it is you who seems to not be fully aware of what you are looking at. The screenshot you posted compares manual frame limiting vs vrr. In that scenario and when comparing the two G-Sync does not add any latency. The scenario we are discussing is weather fully uncapped frames with Reflex enabled in a game that can reach 600fps plus results in lower latency compared to GSYNC+VSYNC+Reflex. I'm only talking about pure latency readings not making an argument about which is objectively "better".

ULMB2 adds processing lag regardless of the model. The reason why its less obvious on the pg248qp is because of the 540htz refresh rate. According to rtings " Backlight strobing at 500Hz has 0.5ms more input lag".

[kyube]

My friend I have to say it is you who seems to not be fully aware of what you are looking at. The screenshot you posted compares manual frame limiting vs vrr. In that scenario and when comparing the two G-Sync does not add any latency. The scenario we are discussing is weather fully uncapped frames with Reflex enabled in a game that can reach 600fps plus results in lower latency compared to GSYNC+VSYNC+Reflex. I'm only talking about pure latency readings not making an argument about which is objectively "better".

The point of the screenshot is that the technology itself does not add additional processing latency in the total system latency chain.
If your claim was true, you'd see a increase in total display latency regardless of frame rate limiter.
Get a 610Hz TN and such frametime (present-to-present time) discrepancies aren't an issue.
That's what I originally wrote in the first place a few posts back.

ULMB2 adds processing lag regardless of the model. The reason why its less obvious on the pg248qp is because of the 540htz refresh rate. According to rtings " Backlight strobing at 500Hz has 0.5ms more input lag".

You're free to ask RTINGS on why they reported 500Hz & 540Hz to have "the same amount of display latency" and set their data point to "1,8ms" instead of "2,3ms" then
You're also free to look through their database to see that it doesn't hold up across all possible models & that it's implementation dependant.
The biggest issue with display latency testing that it's not a uniform distribution & the precision of the instruments are often not enough.
It's not a singular value constantly, it's a range of values (with a min, max, percentile... Averages are misleading).
Statistical anaylsis is necessary for each particular point of the display.
Not to mention that the display is a latency gradient in itself.

Let's also remember that while esports bro's are a large initial audience for this monitor. There are plenty that like motion clarity for motion clarities sake. For us, it's more about returning to those CRT glory days than it is winning at esports (I play esports at a high level, yet I value motion clarity MORE than the sport).

We often are the type to really love smoothness, consistent frametimes, and clear temporal motion. I don't know if the gsync pulsar is the "next big thing" for that cause, but it seems like it might just be.

The ironic thing is that Pulsar is not anywhere near a CRT 'replacement' due to the too large MPRT it targets at lower refresh rates (48–200Hz)
XG2431, XL2566K & other Dyac1/Dyac+ displays are all better than Pulsar in these refresh rate ranges (48–200Hz)
They are the closest thing to a CRT on the market, if one desires the utmost possible eye-tracked motion clarity.
A proper V-SYNC or SK's Latent-Sync setup to circumvent the tearline of fixed refresh rate is all one needs.

[Alennartsson]

Does this mean that for CS2 i should have it uncapped and play at my 500+ FPS. But with PULSAR: ON, VSYNC:OFF, REFLEX: ON ?

If you are not going to use a VRR monitor for low latency v-sync, why would you want one?
As far as I'm concerned, it shouldn't induce any extra latency as long as g-sync is engaged.
Pulsar monitors are probably not what you want if throughput is your only goal.

Throughput is not my only goal, i just want to know whats the best settings to use with this display, there is little to almost non information on other sites than here. And i also get differnt answers time to time. Motion clarity is important. Im not close to "pro" level and some small latency overhead should not be a problem.

Asus brands this monitor as the fastes e-sport monitor. Even their demo of pulsar is on cs2. From the answers in this thread im not sure if i bought the right display or not. Some people even say its not for "500+ fps games".

I try to ask the questions again and maybe someone can "explain like im 12 years old".

1. If i have stable 500+ FPS. Should i still use G-sync: ON, VSYNC: ON and REFLEX: ON (320~ FPS-cap).
2. When i have vsync : OFF and getting 500+ FPS do i still take the advantage of PULSAR? ("4x effective motion clarity"). I dont see it pulsing with my phone when on 500+ FPS.
3. If its not pulsing at 500+fps i should lock my FPS to 360FPS and it will start pulsing again, aka "4x effective motion clarity". Is it better to lock it to 360Hz with vsync: OFF than using vsync: ON and get 320~ FPS?
4. If its not pulsing at 500+FPS. Then i assume i get a motion clearity of the screens 360hz. And if it is pulsing at 500+fps i get a "4x effective motion clarity" of the screens Hz. Aka 1440hz. Should it be easy to see it pulsing at 500+FPS with a phone?

[MSIfanboy]

Obviously not accurate, I couldn't tell if ulmb2 added input lag to my old pg248qp, in side by side monitor tests with high speed camera, sometimes ulmb2 was faster, even if it added input lag, it's so minimal it's unnoticeable, I think I can def feel slightly input lag on older zowie 240hz xl2546k with dyac+ though, with dyac+ and high speed camera it would lose to AUO 240hz IPS monitors I have, in fact 280hz asus and 540hz asus were almost identical input lag side by side, matching ratings input lag results

[tsarri]

My friend I have to say it is you who seems to not be fully aware of what you are looking at. The screenshot you posted compares manual frame limiting vs vrr. In that scenario and when comparing the two G-Sync does not add any latency. The scenario we are discussing is weather fully uncapped frames with Reflex enabled in a game that can reach 600fps plus results in lower latency compared to GSYNC+VSYNC+Reflex. I'm only talking about pure latency readings not making an argument about which is objectively "better".

The point of the screenshot is that the technology itself does not add additional processing latency in the total system latency chain.
If your claim was true, you'd see a increase in total display latency regardless of frame rate limiter.
Get a 610Hz TN and such frametime (present-to-present time) discrepancies aren't an issue.
That's what I originally wrote in the first place a few posts back.

ULMB2 adds processing lag regardless of the model. The reason why its less obvious on the pg248qp is because of the 540htz refresh rate. According to rtings " Backlight strobing at 500Hz has 0.5ms more input lag".

You're free to ask RTINGS on why they reported 500Hz & 540Hz to have "the same amount of display latency" and set their data point to "1,8ms" instead of "2,3ms" then
You're also free to look through their database to see that it doesn't hold up across all possible models & that it's implementation dependant.
The biggest issue with display latency testing that it's not a uniform distribution & the precision of the instruments are often not enough.
It's not a singular value constantly, it's a range of values (with a min, max, percentile... Averages are misleading).
Statistical anaylsis is necessary for each particular point of the display.
Not to mention that the display is a latency gradient in itself.

Let's also remember that while esports bro's are a large initial audience for this monitor. There are plenty that like motion clarity for motion clarities sake. For us, it's more about returning to those CRT glory days than it is winning at esports (I play esports at a high level, yet I value motion clarity MORE than the sport).

We often are the type to really love smoothness, consistent frametimes, and clear temporal motion. I don't know if the gsync pulsar is the "next big thing" for that cause, but it seems like it might just be.

The ironic thing is that Pulsar is not anywhere near a CRT 'replacement' due to the too large MPRT it targets at lower refresh rates (48–200Hz)
XG2431, XL2566K & other Dyac1/Dyac+ displays are all better than Pulsar in these refresh rate ranges (48–200Hz)
They are the closest thing to a CRT on the market, if one desires the utmost possible eye-tracked motion clarity.
A proper V-SYNC or SK's Latent-Sync setup to circumvent the tearline of fixed refresh rate is all one needs.

Uncapped frames + Reflex is still king for latency in high fps games even if the difference becomes marginal at higher refresh rates. You don't have to believe me but it's what tests like this suggest. Regardless I don't think its that important when the difference is so small. I'm really wondering how Pulsar stacks up to ULMB2 though at lower refresh rates (75–200Hz). There should be a big improvement in theory but it seems to have some issues. Getting the XG27AQNGV tomorrow to test.

[kyube]

Uncapped frames + Reflex is still king for latency in high fps games even if the difference becomes marginal at higher refresh rates. You don't have to believe me but it's what tests like this suggest. Regardless I don't think its that important when the difference is so small. I'm really wondering how Pulsar stacks up to ULMB2 though at lower refresh rates (75–200Hz). There should be a big improvement in theory but it seems to have some issues. Getting the XG27AQNGV tomorrow to test.

Perfect example of how impactful Nv Reflex is at keeping the render queue depth to ~1 & eliminating GPU congestion-related system latency increases
The test is, sadly, misleading by techless
FYI — 75–200Hz range gives you “effective 300–800Hz motion clarity“... which is a extremely underwhelming target.

[7bhsq]

When is that 60hz update coming anyway? I'm curious to know if pulsar's "rolling scan" is less stressful/noticeable than the typical strobing monitor. Although motion clarity is perfect at 60hz on an xg2431, I find the flickering distracting enough that I don't find it enjoyable to use.

[MSIfanboy]

"75–200Hz range gives you “effective 300–800Hz motion clarity... extremely underwhelming" - what exactly do you mean by this? Doesn't dyac2 use same 25% duty cycle, so wouldn't they just be the same, but look clearer due to being TN? You can make the IPS 240hz super clear at 60hz but it's so dim it's rather useless no?

[SirParcival]

Wake me when anyone starts talking about real lived experience with ANY of these monitors, instead of just arguing in circles about how 0.1ms matters.

I'm a drummer, I can feel the diff between <5ms and >5ms but that's about it. Ask any other professional musician that uses software plugins through ASIO, you'll hear the same answer.

If you're seriously arguing over less than 1 frame at 240hz then you're just 100% full of it.

Back to the COLORS of these monitors! ANYONE!? Anyone who's actually used one of them?

How do they stack against OLED?

How do they stack against TN?

These are RELEVANT things to be talking about in the #1 resource for discussing these new Pulsar monitors currently on the internet.

[bbuser]

Wake me when anyone starts talking about real lived experience with ANY of these monitors, instead of just arguing in circles about how 0.1ms matters.

I'm a drummer, I can feel the diff between <5ms and >5ms but that's about it. Ask any other professional musician that uses software plugins through ASIO, you'll hear the same answer.

If you're seriously arguing over less than 1 frame at 240hz then you're just 100% full of it.

Back to the COLORS of these monitors! ANYONE!? Anyone who's actually used one of them?

How do they stack against OLED?

How do they stack against TN?

These are RELEVANT things to be talking about in the #1 resource for discussing these new Pulsar monitors currently on the internet.

Doesn't come close to OLED in colours, and why would you buy this display over a 500Hz OLED if that's your primary purchasing reason.

This display is a good IPS monitor, and motion clarity beats 500Hz OLED and is brighter than my OLED as well in SDR, I think it's of acceptable quality and is a great "Motion Clarity 1st" VRR monitor.

I've left my monitor at 90Hz or higher pulsar so hope the 48Hz firmware works, otherwise lossless scaling is the way to go.