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My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 08 Aug 2019, 21:37

Still a very good first pursuit camera attempt -- did you hand-wave that without a rail?

If so, very impressive tracking accuracy. That attempt was subpixel accuracy.
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby HalfwayDead » 09 Aug 2019, 04:49

Hey there, the X25f recently went on a sale here for 336€ so I pulled the trigger. Just got home from vacation and I've made some pursuit pictures too because the monitor looks even better to my eye than the picture posted here. The picture looks very similar though. https://i.imgur.com/9FRFWdc.jpg

Image

I also decided to make a 960 fps video and playing that back at 240fps honestly makes the trails look a lot more like it does to the eye. https://gfycat.com/friendlymisguidedemperorshrimp The top UFO has a very small trailing green edge and overall looks sharper to my eye than in the pursuit photograph. The middle one's bright trailing edge is pretty visible to the eye. More than in the pursuit photograph. Just like it looks in the gfycat. Overall, the center also seems more sharp to my eye. The bottom one is just flawless. There is pretty much no way to improve that unless you go >240 Hz or do strobing.

And @BlurBoss, yes strobing can give better motion clarity. We know that, but lots of us don't like the side effects so we don't use it. I haven't tried it at 240 Hz, so I considered purchasing one of the monitors that can do that but their crosstalk seems pretty awful.
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby hiimdoug » 09 Aug 2019, 08:38

Chief Blur Buster wrote:Still a very good first pursuit camera attempt -- did you hand-wave that without a rail?

If so, very impressive tracking accuracy. That attempt was subpixel accuracy.


Here is my makeshift rail. I used some large lego-like blocks with a wheel base and my keyboard as an edge parallel to the monitor. :D Hopefully this gives some ideas to others who might not have a rail lying around.

Image
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pursuitcamsetup.jpg
pursuitcamsetup.jpg (192.37 KiB) Viewed 432 times
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby do0om » 09 Aug 2019, 09:00

nice engineering :D
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby 1000WATT » 09 Aug 2019, 12:08

Notty_PT
Judging by the photos, overdrive x25f is not much different from xg258q.
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby 1000WATT » 09 Aug 2019, 12:17

hiimdoug wrote: Hopefully this gives some ideas to others who might not have a rail lying around.

Yes, without a rail, focus suffers. :lol:
These are my photos from hands. pg258q Settings r96 g100 b88 contrast 30 od normal gamma 2.4.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ARH9s ... Tigy-sH4KT
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1_Ojqz ... q6Yaw7DRWt
https://drive.google.com/open?id=10kb4k ... 20Qx3MyBw3
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1sr6ag ... gb-DDp0JQ_

Contrast ratio 30 versus 10.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1z56xR ... EDFyYt1t6B
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 09 Aug 2019, 16:20

1000WATT wrote:Hopefully this gives some ideas to others who might not have a rail lying around.

Yes, without a rail, focus suffers. :lol:

If you don't mind, I've transferred your images to imgur so that they can be embedded. (We prefer image hosts that are embeddable)

Here are your pictures (Credit: 1000WATT), inlined:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image
(You said "Contrast ratio 30 versus 10")

Yes, the contrast ratio range reduction can reduce the ghosting part. Ignoring the focus differences, and focussing on the coronas/trailing artifact, that is an expected behavior. That depends on how the monitor processes contrast (digitally decreasing white level, increasing black level, to provide overdrive headroom below black, and overdrive headroom above white. Doing this produces fewer coronas and reduced strobe crosstalk).

It is a sort of a pick-your-poison: Do you prefer contrasty colors, or do you prefer eliminating coronas? (But at least that's a user choice)

That's pretty decent midair handwave accuracy. Sometimes that can be improved with a rotating office chair: Hold your camera outstretched, and keep your arms stiff. Rotate office chair to do the pursuit. Subpixel camera tracking accuracy is possible raillessly after a few attempts.

It's very hard, not everyone can do subpixel handwave accuracy. The great thing is that you can repeat an unlimited times until you succeed. The wonders of the tracking-verification test pattern. :)

For users with SLR or mirrorless: If you're doing rail-less handwave with an SLR or mirrorless, then to make focus easier if you have a bigger camera: If you have an SLR or mirrorless (I use a Sony Alpha A6000): I like those large-lens mirrorless cameras that provides high speed continuous live-preview burst-shoot capability, makes it easy because burst-shooting is almost like video at low frame rate (but full resolution). Try maxing out your monitor brightness and shrinking your camera aperture (bigger F-stop), then adjust focus to your baseline distance. Focus errors will become smaller with bigger F-stops. Hold the burst shoot as you sweep your pursuit. Video is an option but often limited to 1080p or 4K which is often good enough, depending on the quality of your camera's video capture and avoidance of excessively high compression.
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby Chief Blur Buster » 09 Aug 2019, 16:24

hiimdoug wrote:
Chief Blur Buster wrote:Still a very good first pursuit camera attempt -- did you hand-wave that without a rail?

If so, very impressive tracking accuracy. That attempt was subpixel accuracy.


Here is my makeshift rail. I used some large lego-like blocks with a wheel base and my keyboard as an edge parallel to the monitor. :D Hopefully this gives some ideas to others who might not have a rail lying around.

Great engineering creativity. The limiting factor will probably be how smooth the wheels are (camera vibrations) but it looks like that remained extremely low in your resulting photos!

If you don't mind, I've added that photo as an example of a homemade rail-substitute to the pursuit camera thread in the Area 51 Display Science Research & Engineering forum!

hiimdoug wrote:I also decided to make a 960 fps video and playing that back at 240fps honestly makes the trails look a lot more like it does to the eye.

As for the trails becoming less visible in pursuit photos, sometimes camera dynamic range limitations reduce the intensity of trails from appearing. Color clipping issue sometimes. Turning off camera anti-shake helps to an extent, as well as adjusting the camera saturation, to make sure that pursuit images are not distorted by camera processing or dynamic range clipping in photography.

That is a problem I've noticed -- camera processing can amplify/diminish coronas sometimes. It can make it hard to compare between cameras. That said, as long as you are using the same camera -- relative comparisons can be pretty accurate.

Nontheless, very good reader creativity in coming up with new pursuit camera solutions (ever since the LinusTechTips video).
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby masneb » 09 Aug 2019, 18:15

Are these slightly out of focus or does the monitor have problems with ghosting? The lines aren't very clearly defined compared to normal 240hz monitors. The boxes and edges for instance.
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Re: My HP OMEN X 25f UFO Ghosting Pursuit Camera Results

Postby JimmyJimmyBTM » 12 Aug 2019, 15:32

How is the motion/image quality of the 25f when gaming at around 140fps compared to a 144hz panel?
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