Recommendation for Retro PC / Console / Arcade focused monitor

[alamone]

Hi everyone,

I am looking to upgrade my retro PC / console / arcade focused monitor. A lot of gaming monitors only perform well when connected to a PC.
While I do have a PVM CRT, it takes up a lot of space and I would like a monitor that can do both low res (240P) and high res (1080P or 4K).
I am currently using a Dell U2211H, which is a really old monitor, but it has several features that make it a good retro gaming monitor:

- Very low input lag @ 1080p 60hz (around 3ms for first Leo Bodnar bar)
- Wide scan range (scans down to 15KHz and 24KHz on VGA input, high OSSC compatibility, can sync to various non-standard frequencies)
- eIPS panel with decent colors / viewing angles
- 22 inch flat panel, easy to rotate to portrait for vertical games
- Plenty of inputs (DVI, DP, VGA)

While it still works fine, I'm looking for a slightly more modern monitor with better response time, high refresh rate, and slim bezels.
Criteria in order of importance:

- IPS preferable, VA considered, no TN panels
- Flat, non-curved panel (need to be able to rotate to portrait)
- 24, 27, or 32 inch size with VESA mount capability (prefer smaller size for ease of rotation)
- Lowest possible input lag @ 1080p / 60hz
- 1080p native resolution or 4K with integer upscaling, prefer to avoid 1440p due to scaling mismatch with 1080p
- High compatibility with non-standard scan timings for consoles and arcade PCBs (e.g. 50hz-72hz, 15, 24, 31KHz)
- Fast pixel response time, high refresh rate support
- Wide viewing angles
- Low latency BFI @ 60hz? (Seems no monitor supports this, while it seems to be standard fare on HDTVs)
- VGA input with 4:3 aspect ratio mode

Things I do not care about:
- Stand ergonomics (will be using a VESA arm)
- Built-in speakers (will not be using)
- Wide gamut or HDR (retro games do not need more than sRGB)
- BFI > 60hz (useless for retro games using actual hardware, I do not care about emulators)

Monitors I've considered and disqualified:
- Samsung Odyssey G7 (1440p / 240hz VA) - curved, 1440P, high input lag @ 60hz (30ms top bar using leo bodnar)
- AOC 24G2 (1080p / 144hz Panda) - issues with pixel walk artifacting at lower refresh rates? seems like a candidate otherwise
- ASUS VG279QM (1080p / 240hz IPS) - "SS tier" monitor in tier list, but high input lag @ 60hz (35 ms according to rtings)
- MSI MAG251RX (1080p / 240hz IPS) - "SS tier" monitor in tier list, but high input lag @ 60hz (18 ms according to reddit post)
- ViewSonic Elite XG270 (1080p / 240hz IPS) - "S tier" monitor in tier list, but high input lag @ 60hz (14 ms according to rtings)

Potential candidates:
- LG 27GN750 (1080p / 240hz IPS) - $350, relatively low input lag of 9.3 ms @ 60hz according to rtings, "Z tier" monitor in tier list but that seems to be PC focused
- Eve Spectrum (4K / 144hz IPS) - $689, 4K w/ integer scaling & HDMI 2.1, delayed till Feb of next year, hesistant to preorder without any independent reviews & lag measurements
- Alienware AW2521h (1080p / 360hz IPS) - $900, looking for reviews with input lag testing @ 60hz
- Other recommendations?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

[alamone]

Just to update, I decided to go with the Alienware AW2521H since the price dropped today from $899 to $669.
I'm also thinking of returning my Odyssey G9 because I'm rather annoyed by the black stabilizer flickering bug and I also prefer flat to curved. I guess I'll wait till end of January (end of return period) to see if Samsung finally has a firmware update that fixes it.

[Chief Blur Buster]

Sorry nobody answered your first post earlier — it was a huge post.

Some tips regarding your new monitor:

RetroArch 360Hz-compatible BFI
Try out the new RetroArch 360Hz-compatible software-based BFI. You can also do 300Hz too. 360Hz BFI can eliminate 83% of motion blur without a hardware-based strobe backlight (5/6th motion blur reduction, due to 1 visible refresh : 5 black frame)

Low-lag PC 60 Hz
If you don’t need external 60Hz devices, there are ways to lower 60Hz input lag via two tricks (A) 60fps capped 360Hz VRR, as well as (B) Quick Frame Transport, where 83% (5/6ths) of your signal is pure blanking interval (aka a VBI about 5x as tall as the visible vertical resolution). This eliminates 60Hz input lag, and creates a 60Hz mode with less lag than the world’s lowest lag 60Hz monitor. You can do this with the PG259QN if you get familiar with Custom Resolution Utility.

NVIDIA ULMB
ULMB only goes up to 240Hz, but if you use ULMB, try 120Hz plus 1:1 software BFI, or 240Hz plus 3:1 software BFI (in RetroArch or another recent emulator that supports the new 360Hz BFI feature). You’re combining software-based strobing with hardware-based strobing, as a method to create a 60Hz strobe mode by using software BFI to black-out excess strobed refresh cycles. This can create a CRT motion clarity mode for some emulators with software BFI support.

Now one comment about HDR:

HDR is important for future emulation: CRT electron beam emulator
Also, HDR is not useless for emulation. HDR will enable future CRT electron gun emulation in future rolling-scan CRT emulators. When 960 Hz monitors arrive, a single emulator refresh cycle can translate into 16 hardware refresh cycles with beam-raced low-persistence software-based rolling-scan. Since strobing causes lots of lumen loss, HDR can regain brightness headroom when being used for upcoming future CRT-tube emulation algorithms, that probably will arrive in a few years from now.
https://github.com/libretro/RetroArch/issues/10757
https://github.com/mamedev/mame/issues/6762
This is far more advanced than black frame insertion in that you have a rolling-scan emulation on a CRT tube.
Keep an eye for future full array local dimming scanning HDR backlights; this will help a LCD get closer to a PVM in look-and-feel.

[alamone]

Further update.

The AW2521H may be less than ideal for this use case. I tested using a HDMI splitter to my LG OLED C9, which is very tolerant of OSSC.

1. Only seems to sync to "Passthru" and "Line2x" on OSSC. Further, only "Generic 4:3" timing appears to work. The OLED C9 works in Line2x, 3x, 4x, and 5x, and most of the advanced timing modes besides Generic 4:3.
2. No aspect ratio controls. Everything is forced 16:9 and stretched horizontally. The OLED C9 lets you manually set to 4:3, and auto also works correctly to select 4:3 aspect from OSSC.

I will be testing the LG 27GN750 next. If that doesn't work out either, I might just go back to my trusty old U2211H monitor...

[alamone]

I think the LG 27GN750 is a keeper.

1. Syncs to all OSSC modes (Passthru, Line2x, Line3x, Line4x, Line5x) and all advanced timings except 512x240 (My LG OLED C9 cannot sync to this either).
2. Includes aspect ratio controls of "Original" (4:3), "Full Wide" (16:9) and Just Scan.
3. Low input lag of around 2.6ms @ 60hz.

Still deciding what to do with the Alienware and the Samsung G9.

[diakou]

(B) Quick Frame Transport, where 83% (5/6ths) of your signal is pure blanking interval (aka a VBI about 5x as tall as the visible vertical resolution). This eliminates 60Hz input lag, and creates a 60Hz mode with less lag than the world’s lowest lag 60Hz monitor. You can do this with the PG259QN if you get familiar with Custom Resolution Utility.

Regarding this - can you utilize VRR & a 60Hz QFT with a 360Hz monitor or is this redundant due to VRR relying on blanking/scanout speed and this to an extent modifies that (if I understand correctly)

Just curious as I am a 60fps competitive gamer and VRR is beyond magic for most 60fps locked games @ very high refresh rates (well even lower, but it's suboptimal like 120/144) The jump from 240 to 360 - albeit considered a small difference by a lot of people including reputable members of this forum, it is genuinely a very, very noticeable difference in gameplay for my fighting game. Then again, we live and die by 1 frame, so maybe that's not so surprising.

Anyways - due to some silly reasons, to have the lowest lag, VRR is a must currently, but QFT sounds so interesting to me as a concept and I've read the few posts you've had about it - unsure if this was ever stated (sorry if it was) but VRR + QFT seems like best of both worlds for my game. Whenever the game fixes its problems requiring VRR - I'd assume just QFT'ing the 60fps game with my 360Hz is better than running it at native 360Hz?

[Chief Blur Buster]

(B) Quick Frame Transport, where 83% (5/6ths) of your signal is pure blanking interval (aka a VBI about 5x as tall as the visible vertical resolution). This eliminates 60Hz input lag, and creates a 60Hz mode with less lag than the world’s lowest lag 60Hz monitor. You can do this with the PG259QN if you get familiar with Custom Resolution Utility.

VRR ON = QFT = redundant.

So if you play a capped frame rate during VRR, you are already QFT-ing that "refresh rate" (framerate = refreshrate whenever your instantaneous frame rate is within VRR range).

Capped VRR is already the world's easiest, most automatic QFT mode available, and is the lowest possible input lag you can get without using VSYNC OFF. The only thing lower (average) absolute lag than VRR is VSYNC OFF.

QFT is only necessary if you want to get a low-lag fixed-Hz mode, especially on a non-VRR panel, or on a VRR-incompatible mode (such as strobing - motion blur reduction).

If you want one of the lowest possible 60 Hz "VSYNC ON" lag, it's certainly a 360Hz monitor, 360Hz set, VRR ON, with a 60fps VRR cap to emulate a "60Hz" mode that transmits those "60fps" frames in 2.8 milliseconds (1/360sec)