[Monitor Electronics Hack] World first zowie XL2540 240hz 60hz singlestrobe Experiment with VRR-DyAc!

[elexor]

Hey mark does this effect pixel response times with gsync enabled It sure seems like it does for me with it off it's much better for 60hz.

[Chief Blur Buster]

Hey mark does this effect pixel response times with gsync enabled It sure seems like it does for me with it off it's much better for 60hz.

Yes, different overdrive algorithms are used for GSYNC ON versus OFF. That certainly affects pixel response times and their attendant artifacts (ghosting, coronas)

[Chief Blur Buster]

less crosstalk then a oculus quest oled. I tried some nes games with virtualdesktop at 60hz.

Yes, a crosstalk like effect -- though it's actually more of a GtG shelf effect (on the oscilloscope) on the original OLEDs that only gets cleaned up on the 2nd refresh cycle pass especially for black objects on white backgrounds -- as well as iPhone X OLEDs.

It's also visible in www.testufo.com/eyetracking as a ghostly square behind the black squares.

[AddictFPS]

https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewtopi ... 265#p62277

elexor, you have measured brightness during this experiment ? If not, aproximately how many nits you think there are ?

To compare brightness loss betwhen native 240Hz single strobe DyAc, and your mod single strobe 60Hz. In teory if both use the same strobe lenght, the mod should have 4x less brightness. But in captures not seems excesively dimm, which is a good sign

[elexor]

https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewtopi ... 265#p62277

elexor, you have measured brightness during this experiment ? If not, aproximately how many nits you thing there are ?

To compare brightness loss betwhen native 240Hz single strobe DyAc, and your mod single strobe 60Hz. In teory if both use the same strobe lenght, the mod should have 4x less brightness. But in captures not seems excesively dimm, which is a good sign

not sure how to measure brightness

It depends on what strobelength I use i get good brightness with about 2ms persistence @60hz
few things I have noticed about low hz strobing.

* you don't want excessive brightness it will make flicker worse
* 60hz will lose alot of brightness compared to the same mprt at higher refreshrates
* low mrpt at 60hz the screen is cold to the touch I'm sure you could crank up the led current and voltage to achieve a much better brightness.
* ultra low mrpt at 60hz does not seem to bother me. I played games with 0.250ms in the dark very dim but your eyes eventually adjust to the low light.
* I cannot wait to see backlights become more powerful and do ultra low persistence's. btw my zowie is pre dyac I have heard it's much more powerful

[AddictFPS]

Thanks ! I read the same about Viewsonic XG270 PureXP+ Ultra 75Hz, is needed a very dimm room to enjoy Ultra MPRT mode.

Chief say in another post than currently can be designed LED backlight above 10,000 nits ! Seems, worth it do it ? enought sales ? If one manufacturer want make a beast high end strobe monitor, seems can do it. Of course brightness under user control during strobing, than more MPRT not enforce more brightness than user want.

XL2546K (DyAc+ Premium = 0.5ms MPRT taked from marketing specs) at 240Hz, users claim not loss to much brightness respect non strobed. So let's say its 271 nits non strobed 100% window from Rtings review, drop to 200 nits with DyAc+ Premium 240Hz. Theoricaly seems is doing 4.16ms / 0.5 = 8.32 x 200nits = 1664 nits shots ! Is a beast, but even this excellent last gen backlight only theoricaly 50nits with 60Hz. But if you say the cold backlight at 60Hz can be boosted, surprise ! This smell very good.

If i not remenber bad, ApertureGrille guy in the last review "amazing cheap Dell strobe mod", say its two decades old CRT 21" Dell P1130, still can show max. 100 nits at 60Hz. Sadly BenQ Zowie is not interested in emulate CRT 60Hz to allow motion blur free 60FPS locked games. But are very good overall features gaming monitors ! Lets hope incoming Eve monitors come with good tuned 60Hz single strobe, and maybe BenQ reconsider it later after see than this optional feature cause sales.

[elexor]

Chief say in another post than currently can be designed LED backlight above 10,000 nits ! Seems, worth it do it ? enough sales ? If one manufacturer want make a beast high end strobe monitor, seems can do it. Of course brightness under user control during strobing, than more MPRT not enforce more brightness than user want.

All the edge lit monitors I have seen only use 1 ledstrip on 1 side theirs 3 more locations they could put more strips and double or triple the output. combined with more powerful backlight driving electronics that increase the pulse current and voltage lcd's could strobe extremely bright. But they won't do it because of costs I doubt panel makers are willing to put more led's in their panels without some other kind of incentive maybe brighter hdr could be an excuse. a lot can be gained just by driving them better. low hz strobing has never been a priority until recently.

incoming Eve monitors come with good tuned 60Hz single strobe, and maybe BenQ reconsider it later after see than this optional feature cause sales.

Only problem is I heard they will have the bad KSF phosper that will add that red crosstalk all over the screen.

[AddictFPS]

Yes, LG Nano-IPS include KSF to reach higher DCI-P3 color coverage, but is a step back in strobe mode. Hopefuly LG release a variation of this panel without KSF layer, and monitor manufacturers can choose. For gaming, i think vast majority of players agree motion handling is priority Vs color gamut. If one panel can pass the exigent certification BlurBusters Approved, would be a win for LG.

Seems than pure White LED does not exist, and this is the cause of include phosphor layers. Current WLED seems are realy light blue LED, and need yellow phosphor layer to convert light to white. But i never heard than this yellow phosphor cause trail issues during strobing, so is deduced its decay time is extremely short. Not the case with KSF

RGB-LED backlight is a expensive solution to enjoy both features at same time. For instance allow Samsung XL30 reach NTSC 123% color gamut, with straight RGB LED without phosphor layer. But a serious implementation to avoid color imbalances over time, due to different led color degradation speed, need a internal "calibration system" linked to external calibration tool and software to guide it. So still more expensive, and very probably never see something like that focused for Gaming.

But can appear in Photograpy Pro market, but with 240+Hz and strobe mode ? only if these users finaly claim panning photo without motion blur, like move one printed photo in a table. Currently with 60Hz non strobed is a disaster Vsync On panning inside Photoshop, all screen is a blurry mess, is strange they accept it without claim a solution. They should be sick of seeing blur every time they move the mouse, even mouse pointer itself is converted in comet halley. Work with this constant distraction sucks.

[Chief Blur Buster]

Seems than pure White LED does not exist, and this is the cause of include phosphor layers. Current WLED seems are realy light blue LED, and need yellow phosphor layer to convert light to white. But i never heard than this yellow phosphor cause trail issues during strobing, so is deduced its decay time is extremely short. Not the case with KSF

Yes, tests with white phosphor shows that decay of this phosphor is quite quick (e.g. the magnitude of ~0.1ms timescales to a 90%+ LED phosphor decay). RGB LED backlights would be even better, but at the moment, white backlights are currently good enough to get MPRTs all the way down to significantly sub-millisecond levels. By the time we're ready for cheap RGB backlights again, we'll probably already be ready for direct-view MicroLED. We shall see...

But can appear in Photograpy Pro market, but with 240+Hz and strobe mode ? only if these users finaly claim panning photo without motion blur, like move one printed photo in a table. Currently with 60Hz non strobed is a disaster Vsync On panning inside Photoshop, all screen is a blurry mess, is strange they accept it without claim a solution. They should be sick of seeing blur every time they move the mouse, even mouse pointer itself is converted in comet halley. Work with this constant distraction sucks.

Many people have not grown up with CRTs -- there are now 30-somethings today now with relatively little computer CRT experience. So a lot haven't seen how low the motion blur can get. Also, not everyone is sensitive to motion blur as others. Yet they go wow on the improvements of 120Hz and 240Hz.

[Chief Blur Buster]

Related software: nvLFCreset an experimental nvapi trayapp to prevent LFC sticking for gsync compatible monitors -- this fixes duplicate strobing caused by LFC. Adding context because someone just recently talked about LFC+strobing.