Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Ask about motion blur reduction in gaming monitors. Includes ULMB (Ultra Low Motion Blur), NVIDIA LightBoost, ASUS ELMB, BenQ/Zowie DyAc, Turbo240, ToastyX Strobelight, etc.
niros
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by niros » 23 Dec 2020, 18:28

donnie wrote:
22 Dec 2020, 04:23
Ansive wrote:
18 Dec 2020, 14:24
I don't know why, but "ultra fast" seems to be better than "fastest" (which has inversion artifacts)
https://www.aperturegrille.com/reviews/ ... uit-OD-240
Don't use full color control together when you're in fastest mode, it's a known long time bug with this monitor. Just use Native or sRGB color profiles and it won't give you those artefacts. We also figured this is due to how the VTT is setup in the resolution, if you make a custom resolution with CRU, it's possible to fix this by lowering the VTT to get some headroom and then you can use full color control and fastest as well, however I forgot how to do it exactly, you can search the thread.

I just use G-Sync 240hz for most of the games where I don't hit max fps, and it's been working great. Otherwise, G-Sync on, NVCP low latency on, and RTSS limit to 236fps works great in shooters, OD Fastest.
why you use fastest if ultra fast is better?

infusedAI
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by infusedAI » 25 Dec 2020, 19:41

Now I am using overclocked 241+frames with RT faster or ultrafast with firmware 520.
(there is no overclock option through the app only via menu)

The first thing I noticed if you keep moving the mouse left to right, the pointer's shadows(tracers) appear all the way.
The PureXP mode is a lock-compatible settings mode with unknown settings such as Response Time same as HDR.
For each increased level, you are getting a darker image.Ιf you have a less bright object, it will project fewer shadows on the edges.
it's a fact that you will have an improved image as far the darkness cover the ugliness of the jagged edges.

My opinion is that XG270 isn't a truly 240Hz monitor which is "PERFECT FOR GAMING. ENGINEERED FOR MORE."
Seems it's struggling to maintain a good Overall Response Time and the PureXP looks like a sunk experiment.
XG270 is a false advertised monitor like many, I am not surprised why the XG270Q, XG270QC, ELITE XG270QG went down to 165Hz and there is no place to find the PureXP technology.

I spent over € 500 and much time to find out how this might work with the best performance settings.
Αs a consumer who pays a lot for a product, he expects to work as it should. Not to force themselves to try out different tweaks.
I read several replies such as " lower your refresh rate, full RGB doesn't work as intended bugs..bugs.
You know what I DONT WANT TO TRY ANYTHING ELSE because I paid for this advertised monitor:
-240Hz REFRESH RATE
-1MS (GtG) RESPONSE TIME
-PureXP™ MOTION BLUR REDUCTION
Fully certified and tuned by Blur Busters, PureXP blur reduction utilizes backlight strobing, drastically improving left to right motion image clarity for clear visuals in fast-moving objects.

-27” FHD 3-SIDE BORDERLESS
-HDR10
-99% sRGB COVERAGE and the rest of them..

ELK
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by ELK » 26 Dec 2020, 21:44

Chief Blur Buster wrote:
19 Jun 2020, 19:59
ELK wrote:
19 Jun 2020, 18:07
I'm having an issue with my xg270. I have not checked if there is a newer firmware so the issue may be my laziness. There are horizontal lines across the screen in PureXP mode only. I have restarted my computer and the issue only occurs in pureXP mode. I will attempt to take some photos with my cell phone

The file is too large to upload the photos. They are resized to 50% 50% and saved as jpeg but they're still too large. Anyways it looks like every other row of pixels is brighter. Similar to a crt look. The effect is not faint as everything looks heavily striped, for example folders in windows file explorer in "details" mode

edit: similar to the screen door effect but they're not black/invisible lines but rather just brighter every other row.
You can email me the pics to mark [at] blurbusters.com and Blur Busters will imagehost them for you. Alternatively, upload them to IMGUR and link to them.

Abnormal horizontal-line issue (beyond acceptable thresholds) is an RMA-able defect (excessively visible LCD inversion artifact). But would like to see the pictures to confirm. I haven't seen blatant cases of this defect specific to XG270 so I am very interested in the pics.
I'm on a new HDD I might have the photos. not sure if I ever took them. If you want I suppose I could search.,

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 27 Dec 2020, 13:19

infusedAI wrote:
25 Dec 2020, 19:41
For each increased level, you are getting a darker image.Ιf you have a less bright object, it will projectfout fewer shadows on the edges.
This is a brightness-vs-clarity tradeoff behavior with all strobe backlights — NVIDIA’s “ULMB Pulse Width” as well as BenQ’s “Pulse Width” feature.

The brightness-vs-clarity behavior is not exclusive to ViewSonic, but a law-of-physics issue with strobe backlights where increased darkness results from flashing briefer (since motion blur is directly proportional to pixel visibility per refresh cycle).
infusedAI wrote:
25 Dec 2020, 19:41
You know what I DONT WANT TO TRY ANYTHING ELSE because I paid for this advertised monitor:
-240Hz REFRESH RATE
-1MS (GtG) RESPONSE TIME
-PureXP™ MOTION BLUR REDUCTION
Unlike a lot of models that restrict the strobe range (e.g. NVIDIA limits to 144Hz on the 240Hz monitors), PureXP unlocks the strobe range.

The user has a choice between very high quality strobing at 75Hz-144Hz, and less quality strobing at full 240Hz. It was a decision to uncap the strobe rate even though no 240Hz IPS monitor can successfully strobe crosstalk at 240Hz; it’s a problem with all of them. If you want good strobe quality, you generally have to use refresh rate headroom on any model.

According to some reviewers (including a5hun), we managed to out-tune NVIDIA ULMB at some refresh rates for example — 119-120Hz PureXP on XG270 looks better than 120Hz NVIDIA ULMB on a different IPS 240Hz monitor. And ViewSonic was nice enough to uncap the 144Hz limit, and let you strobe all the way to 240Hz (Even if the quality is much lower for strobing).

We are strong believers in user choice — instead of being limited to only 100Hz,120Hz,144Hz strobe like NVIDIA ULMB on a 240Hz monitor (ULMB never supports strobe at max-Hz), the XG270 lets you strobe all the way to 240Hz, even though the high-quality strobe is at the similar refresh rates ULMB uses.

Nontheless.

There is a conundrum about “refresh rate uncapping” decisions that some manufacturers do. E.g. NVIDIA 144Hz limit versus uncapped 240Hz strobe (despite poorer quality above 144Hz).

Whether users are more dissappointed at the restricted 144Hz limIt of blur reduction, OR if it was uncapped, dissapointed at the lower quality of 240Hz blur reduction. So it’s sometimes a pick-your-poison decision because no 240Hz strobe on any 240Hz IPS panels are fully crosstalk-free on any of them. Currently, framerate-refreshrate matched strobe on any display — not ViewSonic specific — [email protected] strobe (MPRT <1ms) has less motion blur than perfect 240fps non-strobed OLED (MPRT 4.2ms theoretical), as motion clarity of strobed refresh rate is more determined by how low-persistence the individual frames are, rather than refresh rate (as it is for nonstrobed, where doubling the Hz halves motion blur).

In the future, we’ll publish an article about the decision to cap the strobe Hz (e.g. good 120Hz ULMB) to prevent quality complaints —versus— letting users decide to choose strobe Hz all the way to max (e.g. any strobe Hz in 1Hz increments, including great 120Hz and lesser 240Hz). We decided uncapping the strobe Hz was the better move, even at the risk of user complaints of max-Hz 240Hz strobe.

It seems that your expectations were let down, and I apologize. I suggest that if you are unhappy, you consider bringing the monitor back for a refund from where you got it from. I wish we could have better news for max-Hz strobing. Currently, if you’re hell-bent on max-Hz strobing, then only TN panels can do a better job at 240Hz strobe. Right now, the king of 240Hz strobe is BenQ’s TN DyAc+

I am very sorry that you are disappointed.
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter

       To support Blur Busters:
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       • List of FreeSync Monitors
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 27 Dec 2020, 19:24

Eternis wrote:
16 Dec 2020, 22:35
So I got this after returning a different monitor, and right out the gate I'm glad I did.
Glad you like the monitor!
Eternis wrote:
16 Dec 2020, 22:35
Edit: Wait a sec, is this due to the Ultra Low Latency setting in the "Low Latency Mode" in NVCP? I don't know if that was there before or not...
The cap is cause by your NVIDIA settings, yes.
2nd question: What exactly is Response Time OD? There is a laughable explanation but I couldn't nail down what it is and when it's appropriate to putz around with it
It’s their branding for their Overdrive feature. Adjust this setting while viewing www.testufo.com/ghosting though it has more effect on this particular model at certain lower refresh rates than 240Hz.
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter

       To support Blur Busters:
       • Official List of Best Gaming Monitors
       • List of G-SYNC Monitors
       • List of FreeSync Monitors
       • List of Ultrawide Monitors

spysmily1
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by spysmily1 » 29 Dec 2020, 10:45

Why does Chief always avoid the screen blackout question? I've seen it brought up many times by different users. Basically when using Gsync the monitor has a 2-3 second blackout. The only way to fix this is to change the monitor specs in windows from 48Hz-240Hz to 55Hz-240Hz.

I am having to do registry edits to make my monitor work and also outside of specs at that. I sent my monitor in for warranty repair which made my already expensive monitor cost almost $100 more since I had to pay for shipping. They said they never experienced the issue. They returned it to me. They were also very inconsistent in replying. Support is terrible from them.

As soon as it returned and I use it, I get blackouts immediately unless I change the refresh range with the CRU tool. Even then I still have problems with some games. Far Cry 1 I had blackouts with the supposed fix. I am working with a 57Hz lower range now to see if I experience anymore issues.

Does no one care about this issue that has been brought up multiple times on these forums? I can even find some reddit and other sites where people bring it up.

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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Chief Blur Buster » 29 Dec 2020, 14:42

spysmily1 wrote:
29 Dec 2020, 10:45
Why does Chief always avoid the screen blackout question? I've seen it brought up many times by different users. Basically when using Gsync the monitor has a 2-3 second blackout. The only way to fix this is to change the monitor specs in windows from 48Hz-240Hz to 55Hz-240Hz.
It's an NVIDIA issue.

I wrote about this in previous pages. I haven't been avoiding this. But Blur Busters is limited on what they can do quickly.

Did you try to upgrade to latest NVIDIA drivers?

The min-Hz blackout problem is widespread with NVIDIA hardware on FreeSync (non-G-SYNC-native) monitors -- it happens on monitors such as DELL AlienWare AW3420DW, the ASUS VG249Q, etc ... the problem is unfortunately more widespread than ViewSonic.

This NVIDIA/AMD certification issue needs to be brought to better light on multiple monitor models as this "55Hz bug" shows up on so many models, not just ViewSonic. Some of this is beyond my/ViewSonic control as a multiparty thing. I have relayed this issue to ViewSonic multiple times already -- and several pages ago in this thread. The best way to get ViewSonic to fix this is to have multiple tickets by multiple users created on the ViewSonic support system. If you could do that, please PM me the ticket number. If I can collect maybe a dozen ticket numbers at both NVIDIA's and ViewSonic's system -- I can probably push some dominoes on some certification issues on the NVIDIA side.

Unfortunately this is not just a ViewSonic-specific thing as this ~55Hz bug often happens with NVIDIA running on FreeSync monitors (much more often than AMD running on FreeSync monitors). This is kind of semi offtopic because it is not a ViewSonic-specific issue, alas.

One thing I've noticed is that FreeSync monitors with a hidden lower-Hz capability (e.g. 35Hz) despite having 48-240Hz range, are more likely to not black out. This leads me to suspect that the below-Hz frametime detection in NVIDIA's drivers is the culprit, e.g. anything with a frametime longer than 20.8 milliseconds, may black out. Frametime management at bottom-of-VRR range is very critical in graphics drivers, and when frametime jitters (e.g. 19ms to 23ms) in an imperfect LFC implementation, it can create some refresh cycles that are longer than the minimum frametime allows (e.g. a 47Hz refresh cycle), and when monitor scalers don't have tolerance or safety margin below 48Hz, the FreeSync LFC fails more often via NVIDIA connections than via AMD connections.

Since with FreeSync, repeat-refreshes are software responsibility: It is the driver's responsibility to begin initiating/retransmitting a refresh cycle before the scaler times out (i.e. frametime longer than min Hz) and goes blank. That kinda stuff needs to keep running on precise timers at realtime priority, but when a game is running at full blast, it can really jitter that LFC stuff around.

Nontheless, it's affecting a lot of non-ViewSonic monitors here and it's been a large annoyance beyond my/ViewSonic control. A workaround is to have the scaler vendor create hidden min-Hz refreshrate room below 48Hz (e.g. workable down to approximately ~35Hz-ish), to allow imperfect LFC/drivers to have a safety margin (e.g. 47Hz refresh cycles not going blank). However, not all panels are able to have a large safety margin below LFC range, but AMD cards didn't need much LFC safety margin (they having invented FreeSync in the first place, after all).

There is a driver hotfix (not sure if yet in WHQL drivers), what driver version are you using?

Not all people are having the problem as it is often system specific problem (e.g. situation that causes the NVIDIA drivers to be unable to send a repeat-refresh on time) -- I will try to shake up some things on NVIDIA's end but it may take at least multiple tickets submitted by
multiple people, to convince various parties behind the scenes that there is a problem.
Head of Blur Busters - BlurBusters.com | TestUFO.com | Follow @BlurBusters on Twitter

       To support Blur Busters:
       • Official List of Best Gaming Monitors
       • List of G-SYNC Monitors
       • List of FreeSync Monitors
       • List of Ultrawide Monitors

spysmily1
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by spysmily1 » 30 Dec 2020, 00:47

"I wrote about this in previous pages. I haven't been avoiding this. But Blur Busters is limited on what they can do quickly."
I'm sorry if I came off the way I did. It just seemed like there was about 3 post around page 50 something with no reply.

"Did you try to upgrade to latest NVIDIA drivers?"
I'm currently running 460.89 which seems to be the latest game ready driver.

There is a driver hotfix (not sure if yet in WHQL drivers), what driver version are you using?
The 456.71 hotfix I don't have but would the 460.89 have everything that was in that build?

"If you could do that, please PM me the ticket number."
I'll try to submit another ticket. I have already sent my monitor in once and no resolution was found because they saw no problem. I guess I'm kind of annoyed that they weren't aware of this issue and had me send in the monitor when they could have just said this is a known Nvidia driver issue. It cost me almost $100 which is a 1/5 of the cost of the monitor.

"55Hz bug"
With Far Cry 1, I needed to raise it to 56 then 57. Even then, I still had some blackouts. Luckily I stream so when it did happen I watched OBS studio on my second PC.

Overall thanks for the response. It's just the monitor is Gsync compatible in it's specs but should not be able to display this spec if it doesn't work correctly with the Gsync functionality in the Nvidia driver. I believe this problem is more widespread but many use the MBR and turn off the Adaptive Sync feature so they never encounter it.

Otzl
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Otzl » 30 Dec 2020, 17:53

Hi Chief,

I would like to setup a similar QFT custom resolution at 119Hz to yours at 120Hz, but I can't wrap my head around why CRU won't accept the timings when trying to create a resolution for 120Hz (for practice). How would I calculate the timings for 119Hz? What do I do with Blanking and Back Porch? When trying to create the resolution, "1080" in Front Porch is red. It works if I create the resolution under DisplayID, but the resolution doesn't show up and cannot be used. One last thing - why do my large vertical total resolutions (e.g.; 2269 at 119Hz or 1205 at 224Hz) stop me from using 10-bit colour? Is it even noticeable for games?

Thank you so much in advance. I apologise for ramming all this into one message, it's just I'm fascinated with this site but I'm put off by how complicated it is. I cannot seem to get my head around half of this information, but I want the best experience in my games. I'd really appreciate some help.

Copied and pasted from PM to Chief, who kindly asked me to share the question here instead of messaging directly.
Viewsonic XG270 @ 119Hz (VT 2268) with PureXP "Ultra" | AMD Ryzen 5 5600X | AMD Radeon RX 5700XT | Patriot Viper Steel Series 4400Mhz @ 3800Mhz 1:1 FCLK

Otzl
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Re: Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

Post by Otzl » 30 Dec 2020, 18:00

I will add that RTSS Scanline Sync is very hard to configure. Even if the game runs smooth without stutter, I worry that it isn't properly configured. It's not very easy to set up with TF2, although that and most games feel pretty responsive with the low lag VSync trick.
Viewsonic XG270 @ 119Hz (VT 2268) with PureXP "Ultra" | AMD Ryzen 5 5600X | AMD Radeon RX 5700XT | Patriot Viper Steel Series 4400Mhz @ 3800Mhz 1:1 FCLK

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