Blur Busters Forums

Posted: **23 Sep 2024, 08:01**

kyube wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 06:11

neuvil wrote: ↑
22 Sep 2024, 07:27
Thank you very much for your input! Out of all I looked up, watched reviews etc. this one is kinda the one I can buy at my location for 310€. For example, I was looking also at the AOC Q27G3XMN, but it costs 400€+.
But comming from an old 24” Benq GL2460, and finaly deciding to indulge myself into upgrading my whole setup, I doubt the LG wouldnt be a satisfying purchase.
Avoid any 27" QHD >200hz IPS that isn't the PG27AQNR.
AVOID THAT AOC LIKE THE PLAGUE.
Sub-240hz in 2024 is not worth it, considering how cheap QHD 240hz is right now.
Go for the TItan Army P2510S (PPI makes it worth it, 24" QHD 240hz) or INNOCN 27G1S (VA), if you can find the latter.
With the arrival of OLED and higher refresh rates, LCD is falling behind in terms of G2G.
One of the few things which LCD still has an upper hand on is PPI, which people forget very often.

My mind is completely boggling reading this post.

I'm just going to say: neuvil, keep doing what you're doing, researching things for yourself and not just looking at the specs on paper. Coming from a basic entry level 1080p 60hz TN monitor you'll probably be very happy with whatever you find in your price range that suits your needs.

The PG27AQNR is an unreleased monitor that is likely going to be 3-4x your budget (and obviously has no reviews yet),. The 27G1S made waves a year or so ago because a couple of reviewers said it was some kind of miracle VA panel with no black smearing, yet it was taken off the market very quickly and for some mysterious reason was sold for barely over $100 US refurbished/open box on the Innocn website for quite a while before it disappeared. Many comments about it since then say that the reviews were not entirely accurate and it has black smearing like any other VA panel. Also, VRR is totally broken on this monitor. Still, I'd like to see one in person but they are no longer available.

As for the Titan Army... I don't know. Maybe it's fine, but it is brand new. Like the Innocn above, be wary of products like this that might be "big news today, gone tomorrow" with a limited number of reviews. And if you decide to try them out make sure you've got a good return policy at least.

Posted: **23 Sep 2024, 08:37**

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
I'm just going to say: neuvil, keep doing what you're doing, researching things for yourself and not just looking at the specs on paper. Coming from a basic entry level 1080p 60hz TN monitor you'll probably be very happy with whatever you find in your price range that suits your needs.

I don't understand why you're telling him to "not look for specs" after my comment.
I've looked into a ton of reviews and I'm laying out conclusions I've come to, so that people avoid wasting time on research & money on subpar purchases.

Happiness is relative, objectively good and bad purchases are another thing.
It is not worth it to go for sub-240hz panels in 2024 with the current market pricing of panels.
Each resolution & size has a refresh counter-part, making it a objectively good purchase, for example:
24" 1080p ≥200hz, 1440p ≥144hz (ideally 240hz), 4k ≥120hz

A bit more specific, in 1440p high refresh rate sphere:
150-200eur => Q24G2A [WLED]
200-350eur => P2510S (~123PPI is wonderful), 27G1S (great VA), 27G1S Plus (uses same panel as XG27AQM but much cheaper) [ALL KSF]
350-500eur => QD backlight Acer 270hz models (I hate KSF, that's why I'd ever consider this to someone, otherwise I'd skip this price bracket, save and go in bracket below)
≥600eur => (W/QD-)OLED's or PG27AQNR (if one dislikes scanout flicker or subpixel layout of OLED)

I find ≤200hz 27" QHD to be a bad purchase in 2024, due to the existence of both the Q24G2A (& it's derivatives) and the P2510S
Only notable exception is the QD-backlight ones (but they're close to Acer QD LCD's, hence DoA)

The 27" 240hz QHD is filled with products which are more or less identical in performance and only differ in outer appearance, OSD and electronics used (scaler / pcb, EM traits, temperature)

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
The PG27AQNR is an unreleased monitor that is likely going to be 3-4x your budget (and obviously has no reviews yet),

I've emphasized the PG27AQNR in particular due to it's (very-likely) identical performance to the PG27AQN, as I'm very sure they'll reuse the panel (just removal of gsync module and new scaler with HDMI2.1 for the new release)
It's unique in the sense that it's one of the few panels on the market which is substantially better than the rest in terms of G2G (@240hz at least)

Should've rephrased my original intent, seems to have been misinterpreted.

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
The 27G1S made waves a year or so ago because a couple of reviewers said it was some kind of miracle VA panel with no black smearing, yet it was taken off the market very quickly and for some mysterious reason was sold for barely over $100 US refurbished/open box on the Innocn website for quite a while before it disappeared.

I don't see how "taken of the market quickly" makes it, from the way you question it, a scam / false impression of it's real-life performance?
It sold like hot cakes, because it was cheap and better than the entire section of 27" QHD 240Hz IPS monitors (3x better contrast, substantially better G2G, making it one of the few properly compliant 240hz monitors, even FHD 240hz IPS struggle with this)

I've mentioned it for the same reason as the ASUS, it's uniqueness on the market.

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
Many comments about it since then say that the reviews were not entirely accurate and it has black smearing like any other VA panel. Also, VRR is totally broken on this monitor. Still, I'd like to see one in person but they are no longer available.

"many comments"
I haven't seen a single comment that didn't reiterate the great G2G performance of the 27G1S.
VRR isn't something most people default to, let alone know about.
Most "Free-sync certified "are improperly implemented anyways and most reviewers don't test VRR extensively with different GPU vendors, so it's a blind purchase decision.
Only way one can get proper VRR (no flicker, variable OD, low input lag) is by using a Nvidia GPU + G-sync module display.

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
As for the Titan Army... I don't know. Maybe it's fine, but it is brand new. Like the Innocn above, be wary of products like this that might be "big news today, gone tomorrow" with a limited number of reviews. And if you decide to try them out make sure you've got a good return policy at least.

I don't see how INNOCN and Titan Army are "big news today, gone tomorrow"
They just don't have price mockup of brands in the western hemisphere.
Of course, return policy is always good to have.

The Titan Army, to me at least, display's true strength lies in the PPI.
Otherwise, it performs identical to other 27" QHD 240Hz IPS screens.
So, why would one get a objectively worse panel (lower PPI)?
Higher PPI and higher refresh rates (with better G2G if possible) are the way forward for everyone, you just adjust your price budget accordingly

Q24G2A, P2510S are great for most people (mixed use) in the pre-DP2.0 GPU's era.

Posted: **24 Sep 2024, 06:13**

Unfortunately I have no access to off brands like Innocn or Titan army or e.g., iiyama that one of my friends from Germany has. I could import them, but the shipping cost would get them to Asus/LG/Dell or other more premuim brands territory (price-wise). Also I can't really do any real life testing of the monitors cause the stores here never have any higher end monitors on display so Im pretty much blindly buying them.

Regarding the LG 27GR83Q, I wanted some last minute real use input before I swipe the card cause my eyes are bleeding already from all the researching, watching reviews, reading up on forums etc, plus looking at the availabilty in my country, and the LG panel ticked pretty much all the boxes. It's a 240Hz monitor 1440p with good refresh times, good colors, backlight bleed is more or less standard on IPS and is in my budget range. I would idealy go for something like LG 27GR95QE Oled panel or some other top end Asus Oled but that is way out of my budget.

Posted: **24 Sep 2024, 06:17**

neuvil wrote: ↑
24 Sep 2024, 06:13
off brands like Innocn or Titan army or e.g., iiyama that one of my friends from Germany has.

Iiyama is a high-end brand, very far from "off brand"

Kind of like Eizo.

Posted: **24 Sep 2024, 07:34**

Oh boy, haven't heard of Eizo aswell. Well, now I know

Posted: **24 Sep 2024, 10:55**

neuvil wrote: ↑
24 Sep 2024, 06:13
Unfortunately I have no access to off brands like Innocn or Titan army or e.g., iiyama that one of my friends from Germany has. I could import them, but the shipping cost would get them to Asus/LG/Dell or other more premuim brands territory (price-wise). Also I can't really do any real life testing of the monitors cause the stores here never have any higher end monitors on display so Im pretty much blindly buying them.

Regarding the LG 27GR83Q, I wanted some last minute real use input before I swipe the card cause my eyes are bleeding already from all the researching, watching reviews, reading up on forums etc, plus looking at the availabilty in my country, and the LG panel ticked pretty much all the boxes. It's a 240Hz monitor 1440p with good refresh times, good colors, backlight bleed is more or less standard on IPS and is in my budget range. I would idealy go for something like LG 27GR95QE Oled panel or some other top end Asus Oled but that is way out of my budget.

If you want something really budget: Q24G2A (sub 200hz)
Otherwise, the 27" QHD IPS 240hz panels perform nearly identical, whatever you get will perform the same. Go for the cheapest option possible or that LG in particular and you won't have major issues.
Iiyama is a good brand as well, just not popular anymore. They make a 1440p 240hz model too.

Posted: **26 Sep 2024, 01:49**

kyube wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:37

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
I'm just going to say: neuvil, keep doing what you're doing, researching things for yourself and not just looking at the specs on paper. Coming from a basic entry level 1080p 60hz TN monitor you'll probably be very happy with whatever you find in your price range that suits your needs.
I don't understand why you're telling him to "not look for specs" after my comment.
I've looked into a ton of reviews and I'm laying out conclusions I've come to, so that people avoid wasting time on research & money on subpar purchases.

Happiness is relative, objectively good and bad purchases are another thing.
It is not worth it to go for sub-240hz panels in 2024 with the current market pricing of panels.
Each resolution & size has a refresh counter-part, making it a objectively good purchase, for example:
24" 1080p ≥200hz, 1440p ≥144hz (ideally 240hz), 4k ≥120hz

A bit more specific, in 1440p high refresh rate sphere:
150-200eur => Q24G2A [WLED]
200-350eur => P2510S (~123PPI is wonderful), 27G1S (great VA), 27G1S Plus (uses same panel as XG27AQM but much cheaper) [ALL KSF]
350-500eur => QD backlight Acer 270hz models (I hate KSF, that's why I'd ever consider this to someone, otherwise I'd skip this price bracket, save and go in bracket below)
≥600eur => (W/QD-)OLED's or PG27AQNR (if one dislikes scanout flicker or subpixel layout of OLED)

I find ≤200hz 27" QHD to be a bad purchase in 2024, due to the existence of both the Q24G2A (& it's derivatives) and the P2510S
Only notable exception is the QD-backlight ones (but they're close to Acer QD LCD's, hence DoA)

The 27" 240hz QHD is filled with products which are more or less identical in performance and only differ in outer appearance, OSD and electronics used (scaler / pcb, EM traits, temperature)

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
The PG27AQNR is an unreleased monitor that is likely going to be 3-4x your budget (and obviously has no reviews yet),
I've emphasized the PG27AQNR in particular due to it's (very-likely) identical performance to the PG27AQN, as I'm very sure they'll reuse the panel (just removal of gsync module and new scaler with HDMI2.1 for the new release)
It's unique in the sense that it's one of the few panels on the market which is substantially better than the rest in terms of G2G (@240hz at least)

Should've rephrased my original intent, seems to have been misinterpreted.

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
The 27G1S made waves a year or so ago because a couple of reviewers said it was some kind of miracle VA panel with no black smearing, yet it was taken off the market very quickly and for some mysterious reason was sold for barely over $100 US refurbished/open box on the Innocn website for quite a while before it disappeared.
I don't see how "taken of the market quickly" makes it, from the way you question it, a scam / false impression of it's real-life performance?
It sold like hot cakes, because it was cheap and better than the entire section of 27" QHD 240Hz IPS monitors (3x better contrast, substantially better G2G, making it one of the few properly compliant 240hz monitors, even FHD 240hz IPS struggle with this)

I've mentioned it for the same reason as the ASUS, it's uniqueness on the market.

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
Many comments about it since then say that the reviews were not entirely accurate and it has black smearing like any other VA panel. Also, VRR is totally broken on this monitor. Still, I'd like to see one in person but they are no longer available.
"many comments"
I haven't seen a single comment that didn't reiterate the great G2G performance of the 27G1S.
VRR isn't something most people default to, let alone know about.
Most "Free-sync certified "are improperly implemented anyways and most reviewers don't test VRR extensively with different GPU vendors, so it's a blind purchase decision.
Only way one can get proper VRR (no flicker, variable OD, low input lag) is by using a Nvidia GPU + G-sync module display.

Ozzuneoj wrote: ↑
23 Sep 2024, 08:01
As for the Titan Army... I don't know. Maybe it's fine, but it is brand new. Like the Innocn above, be wary of products like this that might be "big news today, gone tomorrow" with a limited number of reviews. And if you decide to try them out make sure you've got a good return policy at least.
I don't see how INNOCN and Titan Army are "big news today, gone tomorrow"
They just don't have price mockup of brands in the western hemisphere.
Of course, return policy is always good to have.

The Titan Army, to me at least, display's true strength lies in the PPI.
Otherwise, it performs identical to other 27" QHD 240Hz IPS screens.
So, why would one get a objectively worse panel (lower PPI)?
Higher PPI and higher refresh rates (with better G2G if possible) are the way forward for everyone, you just adjust your price budget accordingly

Q24G2A, P2510S are great for most people (mixed use) in the pre-DP2.0 GPU's era.

Thanks for the detailed response. I don't have time to address everything you've said but you make some good points.

I guess I should clarify what I said before. The reason my mind was boggled was that you literally (as in, the words you wrote) said that he should not consider any 27" QHD IPS monitor with greater than 200Hz refresh rate other than one that is currently unreleased and is likely going to be $800-$900 (thanks to Gsync Pulsar), when he has clearly stated his price range is less than half that. I'm sure you can understand how that sounds in this context.

Regarding the Titan Army (Innocn) P2510S , it is interesting to have such a high PPI 240Hz IPS 24.5" display, and it may be a nice quality panel for the money (who knows about the rest of it), but it has existed for maybe a month or two with very few reviews available so reliability and panel consistency are almost entirely unknown at this point. Judging from what he has said, I doubt he has the money to throw around to risk getting a monitor that turns out to have reliability issues from a company that almost surely will not have good warranty support. If he expressed a desire for a smaller, higher-PPI display, then I can see this being a standout option worth some possible risk, but he didn't. Where one user may value PPI above other aspects of a monitor, another may not.

He said he has done research and due to being in a (nearly) third-world country, his options are limited and he specifically found the LG 27GR83Q to be a good option for him for the price (which many reviews agree with). Also, the LG is one of very few displays in this range with HDMI 2.1 for 1440P 240Hz over HDMI, should the need for that ever arise. The Titan Army does not have this either, and it seems that most cheaper monitors are still cutting this corner without making it super obvious, despite HDMI 2.1 GPUs being around for almost 4 years now.

I will admit, the Innocn 27G1S has been interesting to me since it was released, and I'd love to get my hands on one to see if it lives up to the hype, but one can't ignore the fact that a massive number of them were sold as open-box with a short warranty via their website for like $100. I know there are a lot of positive comments about the response time and lack of black-smearing (which I have seen in person on other VA displays and found nearly vomit-inducing), so it certainly could be that good, but these days one has to be wary of paid shills on social media (reddit, youtube) and product review sites, so you have to take all of the compliments with a grain of salt, even from reviewers. Again, it may really live up to the hype in the response time aspect, I have just read some comments saying it didn't. Of course, since I conveniently can't locate them in a quick google search, I will concede that it probably does live up to the hype in that way... which is why I still want to see one in person. Since they are gone from the market, however, it isn't really a viable option anymore.

Picking one up used or even sealed from a third party, sadly, seems quite risky. There are lots of reviews with complaints about broken features (VRR flickering) and panels that crap out after a few months or can't handle higher refresh rates (possibly even "overclocked" from the factory).

Anyway, sorry for the poor wording of my first response, I shouldn't have made it sound so combative. Thanks again for the detailed reply. All of this info will help others who are looking for monitors to make a better decision.

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