Blur Busters Forums

Chief Blur Buster said this is where to start General interest threads. Pretty sure there needs to be a Misc. Thread.

Hello, my name is obviously as you can see is Neo because that's the name I used to join this forum, but my real name is Mark. I prefer the name Neo simply because it's used less often on the internet for some reason.

A few several multiple years back I decided to start saving money - a specific amount of money - on a per monthly yearly basis for things I would want but didn't need. $250 per month added up to $3000 a year. Then I got bored. I really didn't want stuff. I just needed stuff. I now know I deserve better now. After all this is just luxury. Life that is. Life is just a luxury and we should all just be happy we have it. I'm about to spend $1,000s on toys so I'm just thinking out loud. Like a rebel. No not really. But anyway my luxury account bounces around $7200 year to year. I reach that level but then spend on some stuff like 5 tons of concrete or a new carb on my Mad Max Homemobile (NOT! a luxury). Then I spend on some fishy goofy idea like healthcare I need to buy now or whatever. Nah just kidding, never pay for that carp.

I need help. I need help spending. I need help not paying for, but planning for, an awesome man-nook. A 5 ft UI. Not a Man-cave 10 ft UI. But a media center, a display (or 2) and a simulated sound virtual reality system called a surround sound system. They have those now.


What do I spend it on??? <-- 3 question marks. serious.
I have awesome ideas for a man-nook. But I'm waiting for you to help me make it. serious.
But you don't win anything. Statistically you gamers are obsessive personalities so you do work for free when wound up.
Don't ask: project.

p.s. I also need mecha-furniture so I really only have $4000 or so to spend on technology. Maybe $5000. I don't know! My point!

p.p.s. Remember, this isn't about designing a system to set up merely a gaming system, merely a home theater bridezilla retreat, merely a generic 10 ft UI up against the closest available wall, but rather a 5 ft UI I could use to maximize the technology to experience awesome near-real-experience.

Also want to buy an AIrsoft MP7 but NSA profile signature? eh.

(Chief Blur Buster you should set up an Amazon Shop page!)

Hints, where I'm starting from:

ST60 60" or VT60 55" when they either hit $1,500 next month before they go out of stock.

What HTPC system? Windows? SteamOS ready? Don't need to generate reality, merely run reality-based 120 Hz video with QuickTime quality.

Needs to also feed a second screen. 120Hz display QHD or 120 Hz input 4K? These are the times. These are the times.

Why isn't there a sexy Linux Tablet? OK, Google gets my data. But should I go iOS? ewww.

Why do I need to ask people about this stuff? There's no choice!*


EDIT: On further consideration this statement reminds me of Cleveland Brown from The Cleveland Show. Heh.

The miniature mancave concept! I used to be the moderator of the AVSCIENCE Home Theater Computers Forum, when it first started up in 1999, back in the days of the Creative Labs DxR2 DVD upgrade, and the Mpact2 3DFusion, as well as Happauge WinTV's running dScaler deinterlacing software (with software-based 3:2 pulldown capable of running on a Pentium MMX 233Mhz). The good old days. I am a former author of dScaler, and the creator of the world's first open source 3:2 pulldown deinterlacing algorithm.

Back to your situation:

Furniture
-- I've found good information on the non-display aspects on a forum such as AVSCIENCE. There are a lot of mecha-furniture ideas in some of those topics over there, whether they are flip-top coffeetables, themed furniture, or motorized enhancements. And they are still the premier place of Home Theater Computers discussion -- but not on the motion-blur-reducing aspect (like here at Blur Busters!).

Display
-- Seriously consider front projector options, and see if they're workable. 5 foot produces a severe limitation, though. That said, I've seen users use projectors that fit into a 5 foot viewing distance.
-- The Panasonic VT60 is a pretty good model for motion clarity. Most people recommend plasma, and motion clarity is cheaper to achieve on a plasma than a LCD. Plus LCD is better for close-viewing computer use. You have to decide which pros you want, and which cons you don't mind. That said if you have the budget, and want to achieve good motion clarity on an LCD (often well regarded as more suitable for close-viewing computer use) a Blur Busters old favourite is currently the Sony Motionflow Impulse displays because they have a low-latency Game Mode (some of them with slightly less than 1 frame of latency), combined with LightBoost-like strobing called "Impulse". Albiet at a very flickery 60Hz, and somewhat dark unless you disable the ambient sensor. If you require a display that can overclock to 120Hz, these might not be ideal.

Second Screen
-- Today, you can only do 4K or 120Hz, not both at the same time. A popular inexpensive 4K display (SEIKI 50" model) can display 4K graphics (at 30Hz), or 1080p (at 120Hz), as an example. But the VT60 plasma will have better movie picture quality than a SEIKI, while you can cram more computer text/development/etc on a SEIKI 4K
-- If this is a desktop computer monitor, one of the 120Hz strobed or 1440p overclockable displays, is good.

Tablet
-- This is a matter of personal preference and needs. There are kick-ass apps available on one but not the other. The different ecosystems have their clear pros/cons, with impressive software available for Android and iOS. It's a matter of which cons you are okay living with, and which pros you want. Although I try to avoid the Apple vs Google wars, I understand the different allure factors on both sides.

Asking other people
Yeah, when you're shopping for such a complex system, with thousands of products on the market, there's not much option but to research, check many sources, compare, check user experiences, etc. The wide varying different goals make it impossible to give one-size-fits-all advice.

This is a huge topic to cover, so I know my reply will not be able to come close to answering all your questions -- but that's OK. Hopefully we got one tiny bit closer to that goal, at least! I will reply in manageable moresels, time permitting of course --

P.S. To Other Readers -- feel welcome to pitch in! Reply if you've got a small idea -- even if it's just one paragraph about one display experience, or choosing between favourite home theater remotes. Side factor such as WAF issues (Wife Acceptance Factor). Chime-in's such as a uninterruptible power supply. Etc. The more discussion like this occurs, the more likely we can expand to separate new forum subtopics to fit all of these emerging new clusters of topics in -- e.g. "Everything Else" subforum, "Home Theater" subforum, etc.

Well, as for the tablet, that's a complicated situation.

I'm always quick to recommend anything in the Nexus series - both the Nexus 7 and Nexus 10 are great choices - except the 10 should be getting a refresh soon, so I'd hold off in that case. Also, if you get a Nexus, your chances of putting Ubuntu on it down the road are a lot higher than getting, say, the latest Samsung Galaxy whatever since Ubuntu mobile does exist, though only for phones at the moment.

Another plus for the Nexus line is that development is a lot stronger since Google publishes each device's factory images online and is generally pretty open about Nexus development. What this means is that messing around with the OS is a lot simpler and more successful than most other devices. So you could put Cyanogenmod on a Nexus more easily, while getting an experience as close to stock Android as possible.

Believe me, this matters. I've played around with Android ROMs enough to know that some devices, like any Samsung phone or tablet with an Exynos processor, just can't offer that great of an experience on a custom ROM because Sammy tends to withhold sources and documentation for their processors. You could reasonably expect an OK experience with custom ROMs as long as you make sure your tablet has a Qualcomm processor, then, but since the Nexus line tends to be the development standard, and is cheaper than the competition, I'd still suggest going that route.

Anyway, with a custom ROM, you generally have greater control over how Android behaves, including in terms of what it shares with Google, this way. I'm really into this kind of tinkering, though. If the above made your eyes glaze over, maybe consider some alternatives.

Yes, alternatives. Obviously, there's the iPad which, whether you're an Apple fan or not, does offer a great tablet experience. It's not my cup of tea because of my tendency to tinker as well as the fact that I'm not looking to put a foot into the Apple ecosystem any time soon, but you can always be sure the latest iPad is going to offer a killer experience.

Finally, consider the Microsoft Surface RT 2. I know people like to crap on it, but it really is a nice tablet. Sure the app ecosystem isn't as good as Google Play or the Apple App Store, but you're still going to be able to find more or less anything you're looking for in the Windows Store. At least, when I took a gander recently, it seemed decently stocked for my purposes. Other than that, you're getting excellent build quality, a top-notch display and some of the best battery life out there. That said, my main attraction to the RT 2 is its capability as a potential on-the-go work device - I'm a tech writer - since it comes with Office and its Touch Cover is supposed to be pretty good.

I hope that helps.

Hopefully you can post some pictures when you have it setup. I'm planning on setting a man cave up in a year or so and I'm looking for ideas too.

Thanks guys for jumping in. Feel free to post your own "practical fantasy" set-ups. I'm thinking that what I'm calling a "5 ft UI" (as opposed to the so-called 10 ft UI) converges well with Steam's Big Picture as well as with the emerging Home Imax-type immersive UHDTV systems. It's not so cramped as a desktop interface is and offers a more immersive experience than sitting even 10 ft away from a modest sized screen. Playing games from 10 ft is like reading a novel on a 100 inch projection screen. Just doesn't work. A 5 ft UI also allows the use of practical-sized (and priced!) displays for large fields of view. "Normal" perspective for cinema ranges between 30°-60° (4:3-2.35:1) and anything less is a thumbnail image. Most people probably have the space (and money!) constraints I do. I have a 13 ft room depth to work with. A sofa chair ne captain's chair in the center and my personal command bridge viewscreen up against the wall with a good 6 ft behind so I can have a respectable back surround sound field.


@Chief Blur Buster

A projection system would be too much of a luxury as it would only get used for the occasional blu-ray where I focus on actually watching a movie, and only under the conditions suitable for a projector and cinema in general ie dark room. Even the Panny plasma is a bit too much of a luxury because my TV is on literally all day as I work (it's my radio and occasional visual distraction) so I would risk some serious burn-in if I used it more than the few hours for TV watching. Hence the second UHDTV display for constant viewing. I can't wait for the 6 hour sunday night Walking Dead viewing sessions where I can finally get to see the black levels in that show. My current Sammy LCD crushes them like a putrefied zombie skull.

I'm aware the 120 Hz input is limited to 1080 and I'm ok with that. While I'd love full QFHD rez, the physical oversampling of a 1080 picture is also nice. I'm very sensitive to the "screen" in the screen door effect. I can see dot and line structure even from 5 ft away which looks like an off-white crystalline shimmering. Up close it constantly competes for my eye focus. Even 1080 content will be low-pass filtered and anti-aliased so it shouldn't create the jaggies like the actual subpixel structure does. For 24/30 native frame rate (ie HQ 4K cinema and web video) and immersive viewing of huge MEGA-pixel still images, it's 30 Hz input limitations are enough. And heck, we don't even REALLY have much 60 FPS progressive content for HDTV do we? Plus, I'm thinking HDMI 2 or DisplayPort sub-$1K 60" display announcements are going to hit CES in the new year.

And a 3rd display for 1-2 ft viewing and constant working. My eyes need a no-nonsense 27" display.

@SisterBob

I'm aware of the Cyanogenmod project. Because Google is indeed Evil I like the idea of a Community coming together a providing solutions without the trojan rent-seeking corporations are naturally prone to. Mostly I'm just going to use a 7" tablet as an advance TV Guide / Remote so I'm just going to sell out and use the Android Plex app LOL. A Surface or Win8 detachable notebook looks like a good laptop replacement.

@sharknice

Sure thing. I'd like to find some resources online to create 3D interior design graphics to give a preview.

Neo wrote:Thanks guys for jumping in. Feel free to post your own "practical fantasy" set-ups. I'm thinking that what I'm calling a "5 ft UI"

If you hate the screendoor effect, the plasma displays are a bigger problem for this than LCD's. But if you're watching movies, that's not as big a problem as for seeing computer text.

Neo wrote:Sure thing. I'd like to find some resources online to create 3D interior design graphics to give a preview.

There's so many found online by googling (or binging or yahooing, take your pick) "online home layout". Such as www.homestyler.com/designer and planner.roomsketcher.com ... If you do use one of them, I'd love to see your ideas.

Right now, it's hard to give general suggestions, but definitely consider these additional "sidetrack" factors:

-- A good, old-fashioned button remote is often less frustrating for changing channels and volume adjustment. There are many universal solutions well within your budget, such as the Logitech Harmony remotes. Tablets (especially cheaper ones) die pretty quickly in battery life and are forgotten in other rooms, so while tablets are tons of fun, I suggest a good backup universal at least.
-- Do you need to display the same sources on two or three displays? A high end matrix switch can cost several hundred. (ability to mix multiple inputs with multiple outputs, e.g. send source "A" to output "X", and send "source "B" to output "Y", or vice versa) If you only need to worry about one display output (mirrored), you can also consider sound receiver that has two HDMI outputs, one of which can be active at a time.
-- Are you planning to automate other things, such as your lighting? Zigbee, Insteon, etc? Considering Philips Hue, or one of the other "ambient lighting" solutions? I am a fan of nice ambient lighting.

1) Plasma would be pushed as far back as possible and viewed under dim conditions, so it shouldn't be a problem. Can't see ever using it like I would a large monitor.
2) I'll check out some design sites.
3) No way would I use a tablet for more than basic selection and tv guide / osd duties. I'd like an app that turns it into a video wall that grabs multi-tuner feeds from favorite channels / dvr recordings. A tablet would mostly sit in a powered dock waiting to be used. My primary remote would be a shuttle remote with gamer quality control over playback. QuickTime-smooth, frame-step is important for me when watching special effects shots and grabbing screens. Still haven't found one that even promises the responsiveness of a 1990s S-VHS editing deck. LOL progress.
4) I don't think I'll need exotic switches. Other than simple multi-monitor display solutions I think I'd look into virtual machines administered centrally. Content would just be streamed from where ever. Almighty Cloud and such. Still haven't mentioned all the boxes I'm looking to build (proxy, htpc, workstation, RAIN array datastores etc. YOLO!)
5) Definitely doing ambient lighting. I should delve down into some cinematic lighting theory and see what that can do for my room. Also like the Lightpack solution. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/woo ... r-displays

Neo wrote:I'm aware of the Cyanogenmod project. Because Google is indeed Evil I like the idea of a Community coming together a providing solutions without the trojan rent-seeking corporations are naturally prone to. Mostly I'm just going to use a 7" tablet as an advance TV Guide / Remote so I'm just going to sell out and use the Android Plex app LOL. A Surface or Win8 detachable notebook looks like a good laptop replacement.

Then yeah Nexus 7 is definitely the way to go. It's the best tablet you can get at that price point by far.