Blur Busters Forums

Hi,

as you know recommendations for certain settings can differ depending on the source. Same goes for Nvidia Control Panel V-SYNC vs. In-game V-SYNC settings (edit: in combination with G-Sync ON)

While on Blurbusters it says: "While NVCP V-SYNC has no input lag reduction over in-game V-SYNC, and when used with G-SYNC + FPS limit, it will never engage, some in-game V-SYNC solutions may introduce their own frame buffer or frame pacing behaviors, enable triple buffer V-SYNC automatically (not optimal for the native double buffer of G-SYNC), or simply not function at all, and, thus, NVCP V-SYNC is the safest bet.
There are rare occasions, however, where V-SYNC will only function with the in-game option enabled, so if tearing or other anomalous behavior is observed with NVCP V-SYNC (or visa-versa), each solution should be tried until said behavior is resolved."

Source: https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101- ... ttings/14/

Chris from Battle(non)sense states in his videos that: "The V-SYNC options inside a game might also trigger other optimizations inside the game engine." Which is why he recommends to use in-game V-SYNC (edit: in combination with G-Sync ON).

Source: https://youtu.be/OAFuiBTFo5E?t=734; https://youtu.be/YR0vNs0ZdWI?t=289

My questions:

• Are there any other methods beside looking for tearing or other anomalous behavior to know if in-game V-SYNC introduced its own frame buffer, frame pacing, triple buffer or if it's not working at all? Meaning any methods, which don't rely on eyesight solely.

• Can anyone here backup Chris's claim about the optimizations inside game engines or link any other sources proving his claim?

Koven wrote: ↑

27 Sep 2020, 11:05

This has been previously covered elsewhere, but short of testing every single G-SYNC-capable game in existence, the bottom-line is 99% of the time, it's safe to use either with G-SYNC.

I have only recommended NVCP V-SYNC over in-game V-SYNC, as it tends to always function, and there's a (1%) chance some in-game V-SYNC options won't (which will be easily evident by tearing, even within the G-SYNC range).

There's also the occasional unexpected quirks, such as in Apex Legends (don't know if it has been patched out since):
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5903&p=45157&hilit=apex#p45157

As for in-game V-SYNC solutions including optimizations, I personally haven't experienced this, but it isn't out of the question. My guess is such optimizations would be of the pre-rendered frame queue variety (primarily beneficial in GPU-bound scenarios), but even then, I'm betting the input lag benefits with properly configured G-SYNC would be minimal to none in most cases.

Koven wrote: ↑

27 Sep 2020, 11:05

hris from Battle(non)sense states in his videos that: "The V-SYNC options inside a game might also trigger other optimizations inside the game engine." Which is why he recommends to use in-game V-SYNC.

Without g-sync, sure, the in-game vsync option might do something that improves things. With g-sync, I have a hard time imagining any vsync optimization that would be of benefit to g-sync. It's more likely to be detrimental rather than beneficial, unless you run uncapped g-sync.

When using capped g-sync, the game is NOT being v-synced. That pretty much by definition means that any possible v-sync "optimizations" the game has should not be used, simply because capped g-sync = v-sync OFF. The NVCP vsync option then simply toggles the tearing prevention mechanism of g-sync for the cases where some frames sometimes come too early or too late. It does NOT run the game with vsync, and thus it doesn't make sense to use any kind of vsync optimizations.

RealNC wrote: ↑

28 Sep 2020, 07:19

Koven wrote: ↑

27 Sep 2020, 11:05

hris from Battle(non)sense states in his videos that: "The V-SYNC options inside a game might also trigger other optimizations inside the game engine." Which is why he recommends to use in-game V-SYNC.

When using capped g-sync, the game is NOT being v-synced.

This is indeed an important point, and is something still misunderstood by many. With G-SYNC:

• The V-SYNC option within the refresh rate = G-SYNC
• The V-SYNC option outside the refresh rate = V-SYNC

Koven wrote: ↑

27 Sep 2020, 11:05

Chris from Battle(non)sense states in his videos that: "The V-SYNC options inside a game might also trigger other optimizations inside the game engine." Which is why he recommends to use in-game V-SYNC.

This is what I recommend too.

gametime-to-photontime can sometimes be more relative-time-accurate if game engine does some optimizations for VSYNC, which may for example use a fixed update frequency sync'd to Hz (for VSYNC ON technology), rather than a floating frametime (perfect for asynchronous sync tech like VSYNC OFF or G-SYNC)

It probably varies on the engine -- no effect with some, but significant effect with others.

Now, if instead of using pure VSYNC ON, you are instaed using G-SYNC + VSYNC ON, you still should usually use VSYNC OFF in-game. (VSYNC ON via Control Panel, VSYNC OFF via in-game). When you're using a framerate cap, G-SYNC + VSYNC ON (CP setting) and G-SYNC + VSYNC OFF (CP setting) usually has little to no difference (look-wise or latency-wise) except for those too-quick frametimes which will occur rarely if you are using a framerate cap.

Be careful not to conflate/confuse "VSYNC ON" (primary) versus "G-SYNC + VSYNC ON", since that's G-SYNC primary (in NV CP), VSYNC ON fallback (in NV CP), and the game is still VSYNC OFF (in-game menu). There can be a lot of confusion resulting from that, since the terminology used by Blur Busters and Battle(non)sense is different, but generally the settings recommended by Blur Busters usually agree with the settings recommended in Battle(non)Sense, though some games do really weird things and need a case-by-case setting (some older games aren't easy to coax into VRR, and other times, you may be smoothness-priority instead of latency-priority). In other words, the Right Tool For The Right Job.

RealNC wrote: ↑

28 Sep 2020, 07:19

Without g-sync, sure, the in-game vsync option might do something that improves things. With g-sync, I have a hard time imagining any vsync optimization that would be of benefit to g-sync. It's more likely to be detrimental rather than beneficial, unless you run uncapped g-sync.

When using capped g-sync, the game is NOT being v-synced. That pretty much by definition means that any possible v-sync "optimizations" the game has should not be used, simply because capped g-sync = v-sync OFF. The NVCP vsync option then simply toggles the tearing prevention mechanism of g-sync for the cases where some frames sometimes come too early or too late. It does NOT run the game with vsync, and thus it doesn't make sense to use any kind of vsync optimizations.

Makes sense when you look at it from this perspective and therefore it would make sense to use Nvidia Control Panel's V-Sync ON option.

jorimt wrote: ↑

28 Sep 2020, 07:56

RealNC wrote: ↑

28 Sep 2020, 07:19

Koven wrote: ↑

27 Sep 2020, 11:05

Chris from Battle(non)sense states in his videos that: "The V-SYNC options inside a game might also trigger other optimizations inside the game engine." Which is why he recommends to use in-game V-SYNC.

When using capped g-sync, the game is NOT being v-synced.

This is indeed an important point, and is something still misunderstood by many. With G-SYNC:

• The V-SYNC option within the refresh rate = G-SYNC
• The V-SYNC option outside the refresh rate = V-SYNC

Yeah I totally forgot to make that clear in my first post. I meant V-Sync in combination with G-Sync (within the refresh rate).