Blur Busters Forums

Hello to all!
Its my first time posting something here.
I have a problem with my last 3 monitors I got. In the past year, I switched from an office monitor, to 3 different Freesync monitors. 2 were 144hz monitors, and my last one has 75HZ. Names: Dell S2421HGF, AOC 24G2 and the ASUS VG245H. All those had pretty good specs (at least on reviews and on RTINGS.com) and they were stated to have very low input lag.
To be exact, they had like 9ms input lag on 60HZ native res, and for 144hz about 3,5-5ms. The office monitor which I had before, was a 60HZ IPS, 5ms GTG and unkown input lag. Its the "Philips V-line 243v7qdab".
Now, I will talk about the problem!

When I got those monitors, I tested every single one on 60HZ, and optimized settings to get the "apple to apple" comparison to my old office monitor!
And I instantly reconized higher input lag on the new monitors! I would go so far and say I got at least 1-2 more frames of input lag (16.6ms-33.33).
This is realy strange, because they all had the best ratings you would see for 150-200 Euro budget. They even had better ratings then some monitors for 300-400 Euros. And they still felt worse in input lag then my 100 Euro Office monitor...
At first, I thaught it were some NV Control panel settings. So checked them, and they were the same I had before.
Then I tried out different monitor settings. Turning off Freesync and other options. I Increased the overdrive settings to get the least amount of motion blur. I changed from "display scaling" to "GPU Scaling". I tried out different HDMI and DP ports etc.
I wondered if this is maybe a placebo effect, but no... I tested out all games I played and my skill got worse then ever. Im missing alot of shots, which are easy to hit. I cant track enemys anymore like before, especially in close range engagements. I instantly felt a difference in any type of game, as soon as I move my mouse.
Im breaking my head around what could cause this issue. Those are my last assumptions:
(some are highly speculatated assumptions)

1. I used DVI-D on my office monitor, which has lower input lag?
2. Freesync monitors and non compatible freesync cards (GTX 900 series) cause more latency? (Btw, I have a gtx 980Ti)
3. The DVI-D ports on older cards has less lag then HDMI/DP ports?

Personally my main guess is that the Freesync Chip in the monitor causes this issue.

Thats it from me. I hope somebody can clarify me, what "could" be the issue here.
Thank you for reading!

Links to the ratings of the monitors:
AOC IPS 144hz Monitor: https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/aoc/24g2
Dell TN 144hz Monitor: https://www.displayninja.com/dell-s2421hgf-review/
Asus TN 75hz Monitor: https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/asus/vg245h

Are you trying them all connected at same time or separately?

dervu wrote: ↑

07 Sep 2021, 10:21

Are you trying them all connected at same time or separately?

Of course I tested each monitor seperately! I know when having a dual or triple monitor setup, you will get slightly more input lag on all monitors.

FPSMaster wrote: ↑

07 Sep 2021, 08:24

Personally my main guess is that the Freesync Chip in the monitor causes this issue.

There's no dedicated "chip" in FreeSync monitors, they have normal scalers like any other non-VRR monitor. VRR operation on FreeSync (and G-SYNC Compatible) displays is instead handled software/driver-side, primarily.

Only native G-SYNC monitors have modules (which replace the monitor's standard scaler) for VRR.

As for FreeSync vs. non-FreeSync monitor display lag, VRR monitors actually typically have lower display processing due to the need for instantaneous scanout support for VRR to work properly.

Regarding your "issue," don't set your FreeSync monitors to 60Hz, keep them at their max native refresh rate for the lowest possible display lag. They weren't primarily intended to be used at lower-than-native physical refresh rates, and may or may not have more display lag at 60Hz when compared to a standard 60Hz monitor, depending on the model.

Running your new high refresh rate monitors at 60Hz also completely negates any benefits of having a higher refresh rate monitor, which deliver frames faster at their max Hz due to an increase in the scanout cycles per second, as well as the completion speed of each, regardless of achievable framerates (assuming you're running with no sync; I see you can't enable G-SYNC Compatible with your current GPU). That, and if you play no sync, the higher the refresh rate, the less visible tearing becomes.

In other words, assuming your using G-SYNC/FreeSync off + V-SYNC off or G-SYNC/FreeSync on + V-SYNC on/off, 60 FPS 144Hz is lower lag than 60 FPS 60Hz, and there is zero reason to force your 144Hz and 75Hz monitors to 60Hz.

However, If you're mainly playing games with G-SYNC/FreeSync off + V-SYNC on (aka standalone V-SYNC), that's another story, but you didn't specify.

2 of the monitors were tested on the website "rtings.com". It's the best monitor review/test website you can find.
They test the colors, motion blur, response time, display lag of monitors. Including the display lag on 144hz and on 60hz!
Those 2 monitors didn't have more then 9ms display lag on 60hz, as stated on rtings.com!
But my problem is, it feels like I'm getting at least like 16-30ms of display lag on top of my system lag.
I even recorded a video on 240fps in slow motion with an iphone, and I could see those monitors had longer input lag then my office monitor.
It almost feels like Vsync type of input lag. But of course vsync is off.
I tested alot of things. And my last guess is that it has something to do with the TCON, Cable.

Btw, are you sure monitors don't have some type of Freesync Chip in them? Its hard to believe for me, that freesync is 100% software based...
If there is some type of freesync chip, maybe the signal of a incompatible freesync GPU goes from the PC to the monitor, then the Chip says "Nope, wrong way", and the signal goes back to the PC, and then trough a different scaler in the monitor? Obviously I'm speculating, but you understand my thoughts, right?

FPSMaster wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2021, 12:17

2 of the monitors were tested on the website "rtings.com". It's the best monitor review/test website you can find.

I'm aware of rtings, yes.

FPSMaster wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2021, 12:17

Btw, are you sure monitors don't have some type of Freesync Chip in them? Its hard to believe for me, that freesync is 100% software based...
If there is some type of freesync chip, maybe the signal of a incompatible freesync GPU goes from the PC to the monitor, then the Chip says "Nope, wrong way", and the signal goes back to the PC, and then trough a different scaler in the monitor? Obviously I'm speculating, but you understand my thoughts, right?

Yes, I'm sure; FreeSync monitors do not have dedicated "chips" for VRR. It's done through software. It's part of the reason they're more affordable (and more plentiful) than native G-SYNC monitors containing modules.

Everything goes through the same scaler on a FreeSync monitor whether it is activated or deactivated. And again, VRR monitors have lower display processing than the majority of non-VRR monitors, not the other way around.

The fact that you're running a 980 Ti on a FreeSync display shouldn't matter either, especially if you're using no sync.

So, taking into consideration what you've explained and have already tried, I'm simply not sure why you feel you're experiencing more display lag on your new 144Hz monitors vs your old 60Hz non-gaming monitors. It's difficult to say at this point without investigating such a thing in person.

A why can't I use freesync on a monitor that has no Freesync written in the informations?

FPSMaster wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2021, 12:55

A why can't I use freesync on a monitor that has no Freesync written in the informations?

You mean why can't you use FreeSync on a non-FreeSync monitor?

Well, part of it is the firmware on the monitor, part of it is the EDID and resolution timings available to the monitor, part of it is sometimes the cable type used, part of it is the GPU support, and part of it is driver support.

That said, you can get some non-FreeSync monitors to support FreeSync (even CRTs can be manipulated to use a form of VRR), it's usually just not worth the trouble, and even then, most can only support it partially:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/5 ... vi_on_non/

Okay thanks for clarifying me. I know my problem is a complex one. Maybe it's the cable, firmware or something else in the monitor. We don't know for sure. It's just strange, because I could feel it so easily and I tested the input lag on a slow motion cam.
Anyways, I gonna buy the "Asus VG248QE". It's a TN panel. It has true 3ms response time and almost no blur. It has 5ms input lag on 144hz and 10ms on 60hz. No VRR. I wouldn't use VRR Anyways even if I would have a AMD GPU.
I'm gonna let you know if it feels better on that one.

FPSMaster wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2021, 16:22

Anyways, I gonna buy the "Asus VG248QE". It's a TN panel. It has true 3ms response time and almost no blur. It has 5ms input lag on 144hz and 10ms on 60hz. No VRR. I wouldn't use VRR Anyways even if I would have a AMD GPU.
I'm gonna let you know if it feels better on that one.

Sure thing, good luck.