The Input Lag I've had for years just got worse...

[M0NST3R]

Hi all. I've been looking at these forums on here for years but never really decided to sign up until now as I think I've found some sort of information that might be useful to know when it comes to input lag. No this is not a fix, but more like evidence to backup and defend those who may have had similar situations which made their input lag worse.

To start it all off, I've been having input lag for 4-5 years now. It's not the kind of input lag the happens only during gaming (this would usually mean there are some in-game / GPU control panel settings OR just someone who has a low FPS which increases the milliseconds before they see their mouse/keyboard movement on the screen). My input lag has always effected my WHOLE PC experience. The desktop AND whilst playing games.

I am here also to maybe lessen the frustration that you and myself have faced when trying to solve these issues. There are many people out there who love to deny that this input lag problem is real, or they'll TELL YOU that you haven't done everything possible and it's probably just V-SYNC or a crappy mouse...

Things I have tried since I first had my input lag:

- Getting a new GPU
- Getting a new PSU
- Change power cables for the monitor and PSU
- Changing display cables for the monitor. I've tried 2 HDMI and 2 Displayport Cables
- Reinstalling Windows probably over 50 times. This includes difference versions (10 and 11). I've also tried installing them with and without UEFI mode, and testing out MBR and GPT when installing.

- BCDEDIT commands such as disabledynamictick, useplatformclock, useplatformtick. I've switched these around in every way possible and it made no difference to me

- Reinstalling GPU drivers, installing older GPU drivers, letting windows install the GPU driver, installing newest chipset drivers, installing older chipset drivers and letting windows install the chipset drivers.

- Enhance pointer precision mouse option ON and OFF. It obviously feels different but there is still input lag with both options due to the input lag being an UNDERLYING issue with the PC.

- Used 5 difference mice. Changed the polling rates, DPI. Still no difference in feeling. What's laughable is people telling us to use 500hz polling rate when we already have an underlying input lag issue, it just makes it feel even worse.

- Used a different monitor (both were 144hz, different brands and different types of screens (TN, LED)
- MarkC's Mouse Fix
- Bios tweaks (HPET OFF, VCore changes, Ram speed changes, XMP ON/OFF, SMT ON/OFF, AMD Cool and Quiet ON/OFF, HD Audio Controller ON/OFF, Global C-States ON/OFF, Spread Spectrum and much more...)

-Tin Foil around my cables (My father looked at me weirdly as I did this one)

-Using different outlets in same house, moving to a different house and using different outlets at that house, using power extension cords.

- Plugging the USB peripherals into different USB ports.
- Using a different ethernet cable
- Unplugging everything except the mouse
- Windows debloater tool
- Taking components out of the PC and putting them back in
- Disabling other automatic driver stuff windows installs (even though I told windows not to automatically install stuff...) such as audio drivers that I don't need
- Updating the BIOS to every version possible, new and old.
- Resetting CMOS using on-board pins and by removing the battery
- Setting windows visuals to performance instead of beautiful
- Setting the monitor to 60HZ through windows but 144HZ through game settings
- Trying a lower monitor HZ overall
- Unplugging display cable whilst PC is on, and plugging it back in
- Resetting monitor settings (through monitor buttons/menu) whilst playing

Sorry for the long read but I thought I'd list MOST of the stuff I've done to give some background, there are probably a few things I've missed off of there, and if anyone suggests them, I'll be happy to let you know whether I've done it or not!

With all of that stuff I've done, I've come to the conclusion that it's not a firmware issue, not a software issue, not an OS issue, but that it could be something interfering with my PC. Whether there's a weakness in my hardware that can't handle ANY amount of electrical interference OR wherever I move there's just too much EMI or electrical issues that NO PC could ever handle, no matter how strong the hardware.

I recently moved to a student acommodation. Before this, I was living back at home. Something I picked up on was that my input lag would be nearly non-existent most nights, in the evenings, but terrible during the day. I lived on a main road with shops around me. I figured the input lag was worse because of the interference from people driving past the house, the electronics in the shops, just more people being around on their devices. At night time, there were less people driving around, less electronics being used/ON around me, and overall just less stuff going on in the area.

Something else to note, I had more space to separate wiring cables where I used to live.

Since I moved to uni, everything just got 100x worse and I didn't think that was possible.

Due to the lack of space at my current desk in my student accomodation, my cables (mouse, keyboard, camera, headphones, monitor, PSU) are all close together and I'm not able to separate them.

I also have a train station/railway station directly below me and some other industrial buildings across the way.

I feel like this info helps (I hope it does) because it seems like, my original issues were caused by busy times of the day on the main road, but they improved in the evening and I had more space to separate all my plugs, wires/cables.

Now I am somewhere, where there is lots of industrial buildings and BIG electrical structures directly outside from where I am, with a desk that offers no space to separate my plugs, wires/cables and my input lag is now not only worse, but constant.

I feel like this allows me to dismiss the idea that the issue is caused by software, firmware, OS and points more towards interference that is effecting my computer and depending on the area and it's surroundings, and the space I have to separate all my plugs and wires, it's making it worse.

I'm lost. I'm sad, I dare to say it but this input lag issue is making me really really down in the dumps lads.

The first time the input lag really hurt me, is when I was back at home in the evening, quiet outside, and my mouse felt completely normal for the first time in a long time, I was able to actually play my games, know that I was making these movements precisely. Not only this, but I played extremely well and after that game, the next day my input lag was back and I went back to not being able to perform as I KNOW I could. That's the real downer here, knowing that you are being limited by some annoying issue that is currently impossible to fix. Knowing you are good at your favourite game when your mouse decides to work properly, but you can only perform well 1% of the time when your input lag suddenly isn't as bad.

Something else to mention. A lot of people who deny this EMI cause, like to blame it on settings on the OS or game settings. I would like to ask them, if it was a setting that caused this issue, why is it that I don't ALWAYS have input lag then? Why is it that it's an issue that fluctuates in not only the frequency of when it happens, but also the severity. I can't think of a single setting that would do that.

VSYNC? Would always give you input lag, only in the game and it would be the same amount of delay in milliseconds
Monitor HZ? Would give you the same amount of input lag, and it would be the same amount of delay in milliseconds

I hope you enjoyed reading everything I've tried and I hope some people feel a bit better knowing that there are others like me who've put up with this annoying stuff for years.

If anyone has any suggestions or sees that I've missed a possible solution, I would be happy and appreciative to hear it.

Many thanks,
M0NST3R

[M0NST3R]

Just a slight update. I ordered some Ferrite Cores whilst I was writing my post. I've put them on all of my cables on BOTH ends... Kettle leads, mouse, keyboard, headset, displayport, ethernet. It doesn't really feel like it's done anything, however on the monitor power cable and my extension plug cable, I ran out of the correct size of ferrite cores, so once I've ordered more and make sure those cables have a tight fitted core, then I can really see if it improves. It's looking unlikely though.

Let's say the ferrite core doesn't solve my issue and hasn't solved other peoples input lag issue, this doesn't mean the problem isn't caused by interference. I guess it just means that the interference isn't OR isn't only directly effecting the external wires/components, but possible the main components inside of the PC. This is where it could get tricky because I don't think Ferrite Beads are going to be an option for the motherboard, GPU, CPU or Ram

I was reading about this thing called a Faraday Cage. Not really sure how I would get my hands on one to fit my PC, or if I could build one around my PC?

Any info on that would be great.

[loccomacco]

Hi all. I've been looking at these forums on here for years but never really decided to sign up until now as I think I've found some sort of information that might be useful to know when it comes to input lag. No this is not a fix, but more like evidence to backup and defend those who may have had similar situations which made their input lag worse.

To start it all off, I've been having input lag for 4-5 years now. It's not the kind of input lag the happens only during gaming (this would usually mean there are some in-game / GPU control panel settings OR just someone who has a low FPS which increases the milliseconds before they see their mouse/keyboard movement on the screen). My input lag has always effected my WHOLE PC experience. The desktop AND whilst playing games.

I am here also to maybe lessen the frustration that you and myself have faced when trying to solve these issues. There are many people out there who love to deny that this input lag problem is real, or they'll TELL YOU that you haven't done everything possible and it's probably just V-SYNC or a crappy mouse...

Things I have tried since I first had my input lag:

- Getting a new GPU
- Getting a new PSU
- Change power cables for the monitor and PSU
- Changing display cables for the monitor. I've tried 2 HDMI and 2 Displayport Cables
- Reinstalling Windows probably over 50 times. This includes difference versions (10 and 11). I've also tried installing them with and without UEFI mode, and testing out MBR and GPT when installing.

- BCDEDIT commands such as disabledynamictick, useplatformclock, useplatformtick. I've switched these around in every way possible and it made no difference to me

- Reinstalling GPU drivers, installing older GPU drivers, letting windows install the GPU driver, installing newest chipset drivers, installing older chipset drivers and letting windows install the chipset drivers.

- Enhance pointer precision mouse option ON and OFF. It obviously feels different but there is still input lag with both options due to the input lag being an UNDERLYING issue with the PC.

- Used 5 difference mice. Changed the polling rates, DPI. Still no difference in feeling. What's laughable is people telling us to use 500hz polling rate when we already have an underlying input lag issue, it just makes it feel even worse.

- Used a different monitor (both were 144hz, different brands and different types of screens (TN, LED)
- MarkC's Mouse Fix
- Bios tweaks (HPET OFF, VCore changes, Ram speed changes, XMP ON/OFF, SMT ON/OFF, AMD Cool and Quiet ON/OFF, HD Audio Controller ON/OFF, Global C-States ON/OFF, Spread Spectrum and much more...)

-Tin Foil around my cables (My father looked at me weirdly as I did this one)

-Using different outlets in same house, moving to a different house and using different outlets at that house, using power extension cords.

- Plugging the USB peripherals into different USB ports.
- Using a different ethernet cable
- Unplugging everything except the mouse
- Windows debloater tool
- Taking components out of the PC and putting them back in
- Disabling other automatic driver stuff windows installs (even though I told windows not to automatically install stuff...) such as audio drivers that I don't need
- Updating the BIOS to every version possible, new and old.
- Resetting CMOS using on-board pins and by removing the battery
- Setting windows visuals to performance instead of beautiful
- Setting the monitor to 60HZ through windows but 144HZ through game settings
- Trying a lower monitor HZ overall
- Unplugging display cable whilst PC is on, and plugging it back in
- Resetting monitor settings (through monitor buttons/menu) whilst playing

Sorry for the long read but I thought I'd list MOST of the stuff I've done to give some background, there are probably a few things I've missed off of there, and if anyone suggests them, I'll be happy to let you know whether I've done it or not!

With all of that stuff I've done, I've come to the conclusion that it's not a firmware issue, not a software issue, not an OS issue, but that it could be something interfering with my PC. Whether there's a weakness in my hardware that can't handle ANY amount of electrical interference OR wherever I move there's just too much EMI or electrical issues that NO PC could ever handle, no matter how strong the hardware.

I recently moved to a student acommodation. Before this, I was living back at home. Something I picked up on was that my input lag would be nearly non-existent most nights, in the evenings, but terrible during the day. I lived on a main road with shops around me. I figured the input lag was worse because of the interference from people driving past the house, the electronics in the shops, just more people being around on their devices. At night time, there were less people driving around, less electronics being used/ON around me, and overall just less stuff going on in the area.

Something else to note, I had more space to separate wiring cables where I used to live.

Since I moved to uni, everything just got 100x worse and I didn't think that was possible.

Due to the lack of space at my current desk in my student accomodation, my cables (mouse, keyboard, camera, headphones, monitor, PSU) are all close together and I'm not able to separate them.

I also have a train station/railway station directly below me and some other industrial buildings across the way.

I feel like this info helps (I hope it does) because it seems like, my original issues were caused by busy times of the day on the main road, but they improved in the evening and I had more space to separate all my plugs, wires/cables.

Now I am somewhere, where there is lots of industrial buildings and BIG electrical structures directly outside from where I am, with a desk that offers no space to separate my plugs, wires/cables and my input lag is now not only worse, but constant.

I feel like this allows me to dismiss the idea that the issue is caused by software, firmware, OS and points more towards interference that is effecting my computer and depending on the area and it's surroundings, and the space I have to separate all my plugs and wires, it's making it worse.

I'm lost. I'm sad, I dare to say it but this input lag issue is making me really really down in the dumps lads.

The first time the input lag really hurt me, is when I was back at home in the evening, quiet outside, and my mouse felt completely normal for the first time in a long time, I was able to actually play my games, know that I was making these movements precisely. Not only this, but I played extremely well and after that game, the next day my input lag was back and I went back to not being able to perform as I KNOW I could. That's the real downer here, knowing that you are being limited by some annoying issue that is currently impossible to fix. Knowing you are good at your favourite game when your mouse decides to work properly, but you can only perform well 1% of the time when your input lag suddenly isn't as bad.

Something else to mention. A lot of people who deny this EMI cause, like to blame it on settings on the OS or game settings. I would like to ask them, if it was a setting that caused this issue, why is it that I don't ALWAYS have input lag then? Why is it that it's an issue that fluctuates in not only the frequency of when it happens, but also the severity. I can't think of a single setting that would do that.

VSYNC? Would always give you input lag, only in the game and it would be the same amount of delay in milliseconds
Monitor HZ? Would give you the same amount of input lag, and it would be the same amount of delay in milliseconds

I hope you enjoyed reading everything I've tried and I hope some people feel a bit better knowing that there are others like me who've put up with this annoying stuff for years.

If anyone has any suggestions or sees that I've missed a possible solution, I would be happy and appreciative to hear it.

Many thanks,
M0NST3R

Nice reports, actually I'm glad to know that I'm not alone in the list of --- It's 100 percent EMI ---. You can review my posts.
It's not a hard thing to conclude this actually, but I don't know why people can't.
Now after telling that, you'll see people start to attack you to say it's not EMI, and trying to say it's because of this and that, but you know they know nothing, because those suggestions can not answer your questions, what questions? I have mentioned some of them like you on my posts too.
Now that you know the cause, start to find how you can mitigate them, go to EMI section and read almost every posts there until you find the source of the cause, and you will, because you've found what's the cause and you're 100% sure about that.
But like I said, it's not a hard thing to find the cause, now I should tell it's not a hard thing to find the source of the cause too, the actual hard one is to find the solution, this is the actual thing that people in that list can not find that, unfortunately it takes a lot of time, money, and effort altogether to find that.
Good luck brother, keep up the work, you can because you have a logical brain.

[imprecise]

To start it all off, I've been having input lag for 4-5 years now. It's not the kind of input lag the happens only during gaming (this would usually mean there are some in-game / GPU control panel settings OR just someone who has a low FPS which increases the milliseconds before they see their mouse/keyboard movement on the screen). My input lag has always effected my WHOLE PC experience. The desktop AND whilst playing games.

I feel like this info helps (I hope it does) because it seems like, my original issues were caused by busy times of the day on the main road, but they improved in the evening and I had more space to separate all my plugs, wires/cables.

Now I am somewhere, where there is lots of industrial buildings and BIG electrical structures directly outside from where I am, with a desk that offers no space to separate my plugs, wires/cables and my input lag is now not only worse, but constant.

I'm lost. I'm sad, I dare to say it but this input lag issue is making me really really down in the dumps lads.

The first time the input lag really hurt me, is when I was back at home in the evening, quiet outside, and my mouse felt completely normal for the first time in a long time, I was able to actually play my games, know that I was making these movements precisely. Not only this, but I played extremely well and after that game, the next day my input lag was back and I went back to not being able to perform as I KNOW I could. That's the real downer here, knowing that you are being limited by some annoying issue that is currently impossible to fix. Knowing you are good at your favourite game when your mouse decides to work properly, but you can only perform well 1% of the time when your input lag suddenly isn't as bad.

Something else to mention. A lot of people who deny this EMI cause, like to blame it on settings on the OS or game settings. I would like to ask them, if it was a setting that caused this issue, why is it that I don't ALWAYS have input lag then? Why is it that it's an issue that fluctuates in not only the frequency of when it happens, but also the severity. I can't think of a single setting that would do that.

If anyone has any suggestions or sees that I've missed a possible solution, I would be happy and appreciative to hear it.

Many thanks,
M0NST3R

Hey, I can totally relate to your situation. I went from carrying friends to global to not being able to win 1v1s vs silvers. I've been able to find fixes for everything EXCEPT when I go online, so I'm guessing there could be some improvement to your situation.

I tried moving a handful of times to different types of residences... house, small apartment, a different house over 100 miles away with coax internet instead of fiber, a large apartment building...

I tried 4 different computers... 6th gen, 10th gen intel... AM3, AM4... 1080, 2070s, 3070, 3090 GPUs... all different keyboard, mouse, monitor, display cables, headphones and nvidia/onboard audio, cat5-cat8 ethernet, expensive gaming switch, small enterprise switch, and 3-4 others... added a sine wave UPS...

At this point I'm almost certain it's an internet issue. There are some recent trends we can consider, like 5G towers being pretty new, electrical grid switching to "smart meters," but most importantly, 2019 happened....

The internet went from being used by some power users and most people doing light stuff like social media and some video streaming. At that point, the internet was already congested and oversubscribed... then people started working from home, everyone is upgrading to 1gig internet and streaming videos all the time and completely replacing their cable TV with internet. People are using video chat throughout the day, causing huge amounts of prioritized traffic... I've tried using QoS and that causes lag by itself, and that's what all this additional prioritized traffic does to the ISP switches.

On top of the internet congestion, Windows updates have been completely ruining real-time responsiveness. There is additional audio overhead, additional network overhead, DWM, MPO, forced FSO, and this new trend of apps using above normal priorities.

I've been doing some early morning gaming lately 3-5AM and things seem to be almost lag-free.. then 6AM rolls around and people are on the internet and I'm seeing tons of desync errors after getting destroyed by 500ms of interpolation with 10 ping vs 10 ping. This lasts from 6AM until like 2AM... making competitive gaming impossible except for a few hours in the middle of the night. And even then, that's the favorite time for the nightcrawling cheaters to come out, only allowing wins when they get bored of instagibbing everyone.

I recommend looking at my 2023 guide and that should be able to fix any issues with Windows that you may have overlooked. From what you've said, I would lean towards looking at core parking and power saving settings.

Something else you can try is setting the RAM to low frequency and low timings... this should put a hardware limit on FPS and allow fully responsive inputs. This is just for testing though, as this would decrease performance overall.

Another thing you can try is using mobile internet since voice data has less tolerance for high latency and likely uses newer ISP switches. I've worked on some ISP-level switches before and they are extremely expensive ($upgrades only when budget permits$) and have all kinds of problems like ports erroring out and failing, and the tools to diagnose these issues either aren't available or aren't used by the engineers who maintain them.

[imprecise]

Many thanks,
M0NST3R

Can you try testing bufferbloat?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=12493

I quoted you so you could have a link to find this post since it was moved.

[triplese]

Nothing to test. Bufferbloat exists when you utilizing FULL channel bandwidth and packets stucking in queue. If you have at least 10mbit/s and no other consumers connected to router and no other software beside game client - you dont have any bufferbloat on your side.

[imprecise]

Nothing to test. Bufferbloat exists when you utilizing FULL channel bandwidth and packets stucking in queue. If you have at least 10mbit/s and no other consumers connected to router and no other software beside game client - you dont have any bufferbloat on your side.

This is not accurate information. Please read the linked post.

[Anonymous271863]

Nothing to test. Bufferbloat exists when you utilizing FULL channel bandwidth and packets stucking in queue. If you have at least 10mbit/s and no other consumers connected to router and no other software beside game client - you dont have any bufferbloat on your side.

^ me when i purposefully spread misinformation over the internet

[triplese]

This is not accurate information. Please read the linked post.

Its absolutely accurate information.
Get CCNA for start, then measure what you want. Now you are measuring nonsense digits with tests which you cannot understand.
For bufferbloat test you can speedtest on any site.
If your ping without downloading/uploading < ping with download/upload - its "bufferbloat". Or to be correct - shaper with queue. On screenshot I shaping my PC's DL speed to 150mbit/s on my router to show artificial bufferbloat.
But in games you dont have any buffershit because games dont uploading/downloading more than few mbit/s, so your packets will not reaching queue at all.
Bufferbloat can be a problem in ISP environment if they massively overselling bandwidth, but then you will see consistently floating ping in peak hours.

[triplese]

^ me when i purposefully spread misinformation over the internet

Better reinstall windows, at least twice. And dont forget BIOS tweaks