OLED size correlation to brightness / OLED uniformity variances

[jorimt]

I've heard that OLEDs need to "break in". Is that really a thing?

General color performance will settle/stabilize over a 100-300 hour period as the panel more evenly ages, but that's about it to the "break-in" as far as I'm aware.

I've been considering taking some action against my G4. I am quite unhappy with full white and grey scale uniformity... I don't know if that's something that could improve overtime or not. There were some lines visible on grey, but they went away after a pixel refresh cycle (it was the same with my C2).

Discoloration on full grey persists. It's like it's brighter and lighter grey from the bottom left corner to upper left corner, and on the other side it's darker and reddish.

Discoloration on full white field is slightly reddish on the sides, and slightly bluish in the centre.

Discoloration will typically not change or reduce with use, while near-black vertical banding can to a degree (due to compensation cycles), but there's limits to that as well.

Did I get a bad panel? I mean, G4 is expensive and the top model, I'd expect perfection from a high-end LG display.

Doubtful; WOLEDs have always had varying degrees of tinting and vertical banding that differ a bit in nature depending on the panel generation.

There's no "perfect" display technology, unfortunately, especially where uniformity is concerned; just trade-offs.

[speancer]

Did I get a bad panel? I mean, G4 is expensive and the top model, I'd expect perfection from a high-end LG display.

Doubtful; WOLEDs have always had varying degrees of tinting and vertical banding that differ a bit in nature depending on the panel generation.

There's no "perfect" display technology, unfortunately, especially where uniformity is concerned; just trade-offs.

Out of curiosity, how is your white and gray uniformity on your LG 48C4 OLED?

[jorimt]

Out of curiosity, how is your white and gray uniformity on your LG 48C4 OLED?

Reddish in the middle with a slight blue/teal-ish on the sides. My previous 48CX was similar. My 77C2 has better white uniformity than either, whereas vertical banding is similar on all three.

It really just depends on the OLED gen + size + the particular unit itself within that size and model range; there will be variance, with some slightly to much better than others, but I've never seen one with perfect uniformity.

[speancer]

Out of curiosity, how is your white and gray uniformity on your LG 48C4 OLED?

Reddish in the middle with a slight blue/teal-ish on the sides. My previous 48CX was similar. My 77C2 has better white uniformity than either, whereas vertical banding is similar on all three.

It really just depends on the OLED gen + size + the particular unit itself within that size and model range; there will be variance, with some slightly to much better than others, but I've never seen one with perfect uniformity.

My 55G4 has like green-ish tint on the sides, faint on the right, but much more visible on the left. It actually is visible on some normal content, if I move the window with a playback from middle to the left... It's the 3rd unit, to be honest. First one had really annoying blue-ish tint in the middle, which was distracting on desktop use, second one had much worse gray uniformity and reddish tint on both sides. Is that also normal, if under certain circumstances the tint can be visible on normal content too? I mean, those variances seem to be pretty significant from unit to unit, with none of the panels being anywhere close to uniform experience. Considering the price, this really pisses me off.

[jorimt]

Is that also normal, if under certain circumstances the tint can be visible on normal content too?

It is if you're viewing brighter, more uniform content, such as non-dark mode browser windows, etc. Tinting can also appear worse the closer you are to the display in some cases, especially if it's larger.

I mean, those variances seem to be pretty significant from unit to unit, with none of the panels being anywhere close to uniform experience. Considering the price, this really pisses me off.

There's a reason a whole ongoing thread is dedicated to OLED uniformity on the AVS forums...

I find OLED TVs great as TVs for mixed media, but not as monitors (yet). I still use a 27" LCD for productivity purposes and web browsing myself. I hear OLED monitors are decent for such purposes as well (more so than OLED TVs, at least).

In my view, using a larger OLED TV as a monitor is like using a consumer CRT TV as a monitor back in the day; it can be done, but it's not ideal.

[speancer]

Is that also normal, if under certain circumstances the tint can be visible on normal content too?

It is if you're viewing brighter, more uniform content, such as non-dark mode browser windows, etc. Tinting can also appear worse the closer you are to the display in some cases, especially if it's larger.

I see. Well, I guess I need to live with it then. Other than that issue, I find my G4 an absolute blast for PC gaming and watching movies/TV series. Actually, I was about to keep the previous (2nd) unit of the G4, but there was a sudden significant price drop (over $350) for a G4 version with a stand included (which suits my use case better), so that was the only reason I got a 3rd unit (from the same retailer).

I mean, those variances seem to be pretty significant from unit to unit, with none of the panels being anywhere close to uniform experience. Considering the price, this really pisses me off.

There's a reason a whole ongoing thread is dedicated to OLED uniformity on the AVS forums...

I find OLED TVs great as TVs for mixed media, but not as monitors (yet). I still use a 27" LCD for productivity purposes and web browsing myself. I hear OLED monitors are decent for such purposes as well (more so than OLED TVs, at least).

In my view, using a larger OLED TV as a monitor is like using a consumer CRT TV as a monitor back in the day; it can be done, but it's not ideal.

I'd been using the LG 42C2 as a monitor for about 1,5 year when I decided to switch to G4, it was really cool for that purpose, it also had some tinting issues on desktop use but that's to be expected. I love the screen estate that larger 4K OLED TV offers, helps with my line of work, as I mostly work from home with many documents and windows displayed at the same time (and never had any issue with burn-in, with TPC and GSR disabled, I basically used 10% brightness most of the time for SDR content / desktop work).

I'm guessing the OLED uniformity thread on AVS forums consists of the same issues I presented in this thread? I do not follow AVS forums. Would you kindly care to elaborate?

I know nothing about CRT, so I don't know what you mean. I was a kid when they were popular

Do you know how is the tinting issue on QD-OLED TVs? Does it have any advantage in that regard over WOLED? I've never seen a QD-OLED display. The lack of polarization layer makes them unfit for me, as I would not stand black level rise that QD-OLED suffers from light sources.

I am not really interested in OLED monitors, simply because of the size. I became so attracted to the bigger size and excitation in consuming content with this size and quality (especially super good HDR on G4), that I see no way of coming back to smaller displays at this point. Anyway, seems like no OLED display is free of the tinting issue, monitors included, is it not?

[jorimt]

I'm guessing the OLED uniformity thread on AVS forums consists of the same issues I presented in this thread? I do not follow AVS forums. Would you kindly care to elaborate?

I'd suggest you avoid that thread then if you want to retain your sanity

It's just a bunch of users going through multiple units trying to re-roll for something that can't be won.

I know nothing about CRT, so I don't know what you mean. I was a kid when they were popular

CRT TVs were very different from CRT monitors; they were much lower resolution and had more geometric uniformity issues (lines weren't always straight, etc), and thus were more suited to distant media viewing than close-up productivity work and web browsing. But that didn't stop some of us from trying.

Do you know how is the tinting issue on QD-OLED TVs? Does it have any advantage in that regard over WOLED?

First-gen QD-OLED had superior near-black uniformity, and I think less tinting (don't quote me though; I've only ever owned WOLED), but the most recent panels have somewhat equalized to WOLED in that respect.

Anyway, seems like no OLED display is free of the tinting issue, monitors included, is it not?

I've not seen an OLED monitor in person, so can't say for certain, but all OLEDs I've owned have had some degree of visible tinting, minor or no.

[speancer]

I'd suggest you avoid that thread then if you want to retain your sanity

It's just a bunch of users going through multiple units trying to re-roll for something that can't be won.

Oh, I've done it myself with some LCD monitors, especially IPS... And as I mentioned, this is not my first unit of the G4 either, and all units had some kind of tinting, but the variances of the tinting are pretty wide (place of tinting, colour of tinting, etc) and some kinds of tinting are less distracting / visible than others.

CRT TVs were very different from CRT monitors; they were much lower resolution and had more geometric uniformity issues (lines weren't always straight, etc), and thus were more suited to distant media viewing than close-up productivity work and web browsing. But that didn't stop some of us from trying.

Why would they try, it if it was objectively worse?

First-gen QD-OLED had superior near-black uniformity, and I think less tinting (don't quote me though; I've only ever owned WOLED), but the most recent panels have somewhat equalized to WOLED in that respect.

I see. Do you know why, technically speaking, QD-OLEDs lack the polarizing layer which makes them vulnerable to light sources (black raise)? Would that be a necessity for this tech to work properly?

I've not seen an OLED monitor in person, so can't say for certain, but all OLEDs I've owned have had some degree of visible tinting, minor or no.

About that... My current unit of 55G4 looks very much like shown in this picture, the green-ish tint... Unfortunately, the tint is clearly visible on normal content, for example, I can easily see it while moving the camera in game, I notice that the side, especially left, gets affected by the tint and changes the shade of colour accordingly to the tint's colour... It's hard to accept this.

To be perfectly clear - do you notice the tinting on normal content on your OLED displays?

[jorimt]

Why would they try, it if it was objectively worse?

I can't speak to anyone else, but I tried back in the day for the heck of it, though I'd assume there were others that wanted to because CRT TVs were typically larger than CRT monitors at the time, and/or for budgetary reasons.

I see. Do you know why, technically speaking, QD-OLEDs lack the polarizing layer which makes them vulnerable to light sources (black raise)? Would that be a necessity for this tech to work properly?

QD-OLED has a Quantum Dot layer (hence the "QD" in its name), which isn't compatible with a polarizer, so the panel ultimately reflects more ambient light, thus the "raised" blacks compared to most WOLEDs.

Ironically, WOLEDs with an MLA layer (like the G4) have slightly raised blacks in the same scenario compared to WOLEDs without MLA due to a similar cause; the MLA layer (which is essentially a sheet of tiny translucent bubble-shaped lenses that act as light magnification to contribute to the G4's peak brightness boost over the C4) reflects more ambient light as well.

To be perfectly clear - do you notice the tinting on normal content on your OLED displays?

If I look for it really hard, yes, but only on the more uniform or brighter content such as snow fields, deserts, white browser windows, etc.

[speancer]

QD-OLED has a Quantum Dot layer (hence the "QD" in its name), which isn't compatible with a polarizer, so the panel ultimately reflects more ambient light, thus the "raised" blacks compared to most WOLEDs.

Ironically, WOLEDs with an MLA layer (like the G4) have slightly raised blacks in the same scenario compared to WOLEDs without MLA due to a similar cause; the MLA layer (which is essentially a sheet of tiny translucent bubble-shaped lenses that act as light magnification to contribute to the G4's peak brightness boost over the C4) reflects more ambient light as well.

Interesting what you say, cuz I haven't noticed a raise in black level on my G4 in brighter room conditions (when my window is open or blinds not shut).

To be perfectly clear - do you notice the tinting on normal content on your OLED displays?

If I look for it really hard, yes, but only on the more uniform or brighter content such as snow fields, deserts, white browser windows, etc.

Since I hated the last unit of the G4 I had due to excessively visible green tint like I showed you on the picture, I rolled a dice once more and finally scored. The current unit has acceptable level of tinting, it's on a warmer side, much less distracting. This one's a keeper.

In the meantime I ordered Samsung S95D just out of curiosity, but I completely hated it. From the design and ridiculous amount of left and right border difference (the pixel shift option makes the boarders uneven as fuck) down to unintuitive (comparing to LG) menu and terrible operation with PC (buggy and slow). I instantly returned it. LG is so much better in almost every way, in my opinion. I did notice a boost in colour brightness on the S95D over the G4, but overall picture wasn't any night and day difference.

I came through single units of G3 and S95D, and three units of G4... The current one is the 4th one, and it stays. My DHL carrier was baffled about the amount of TVs he was picking up from my place

I'm guessing the OLED uniformity thread on AVS forums consists of the same issues I presented in this thread? I do not follow AVS forums. Would you kindly care to elaborate?

I'd suggest you avoid that thread then if you want to retain your sanity

It's just a bunch of users going through multiple units trying to re-roll for something that can't be won.

Well, after my experiences with numerous units of high-end WOLED TVs, these words of yours are true indeed!

Anyway, since you read the AVS forums, did you ever see anyone claiming that they actually won the panel lottery? How many units were they willing to go through? I am already exhausted with the exchanges and happy with my new unit!