Viewsonic XG270 with 'PureXP" MBR [pre-tuned by Blur Busters!]

[Chief Blur Buster]

Just wondering how was the 224hz sweet spot discovered? And is it noticeably better than 225 or 230hz? (All of mine are on 10 bit mode) Will definitely try 224hz this evening to see if I can tell a difference using 224hz over the other two.

Via watching www.testufo.com/ghosting
-- I noticed that overdrive becomes much better at 230Hz and below.
-- Forum members noticed that going a bit lower, 224Hz, maintains 10 bits per color channel on the GPU output

(Panel is 8bit, but there will be less banding during color processing, e.g. calibration & gamma correction adjustments built into monitor, etc)

[Ansive]

Disclaimer - I'm not an expert on this

The way I understand strobbing is that if you were to photograph a single frame, the picture should be (nearly) perfect.
You should not be able to tell if the player was strafing, running, panning or looking around.
Any observable blur would be due to how we perceive movement just like in real life.
If you look at the screen and move a finger in front of it, the finger will be blurry.
If you track the finger the screen behind will appear blurry.

Strobbing allows you to look/focus at whatever you want in the 3d plane during movement/looking. Be that your cursor, the ground, a target, your periphery. Of course there is a limit, if you move the camera too fast or not smoothly it will still appear unclear.

Usefulness:
Side scrollers/Top down - high
1st person/3rd person - medium
Racing - low

[Chief Blur Buster]

Usefulness:
Side scrollers/Top down - high
1st person/3rd person - medium
Racing - low

Good ranking attempt.
However, I'd slightly re-rank (on average)

Usefulness:
Side scrollers/Top down - high
3rd person - medium-high (due to spinny turns)
1st person - medium
Racing - low

The venn diagrams of each can overlap -- but this is because turning in 3rd person creates more spinny-feel effects than in 1st person -- especially since many 3rd person games have no crosshairs, and 1st person games have crosshairs. Creating more frequent eye-tracking.

Also, depending on game, 3rd person often switches to 1st person when you're in aim-mode (crosshairs temporarily appears).

On the other hand, sometimes it inverts. For example, if you're on those skyhook cables in Bioshock Infinite, the blur reduction really helps there. Whereas, many 3rd person view games are slow-moving adventures where blur reduction doesn't help nearly as much.

An example of 3rd person behaviours is Skyrim -- spinning turns in 3rd person for some reason, benefit more from blur reduction than first person. Though Skyrim had both 1st person and 3rd person modes.

YMMV -- gaming tactics and gaming habits are different.

[Chief Blur Buster]

Any observable blur would be due to how we perceive movement just like in real life.

That's not possible to perfectly achieve on any display yet. Requires 1000Hz+ to do that (10,000Hz in some cases). That requires unobtainium Hz at unobtainium frame rates, to capture all possible situations (eyetracking on moving objects AND eyetracking across stationary)

There's the stroboscopic effect to consider too, which is hard to eliminate simultaneously with motion blur.

See Stroboscopic Effect Of Finite Frame Rate Displays
--> Trying to fix stroboscopics by adding GPU motion blur adds more blur beyond real life.
--> Trying to fix motion blur via strobing, can add stroboscopic effects back.
Trying to solve both? That requires continued doublings of refresh rates.

Whac-a-mole will take a long time due to the vicious cycle effect (higher resolutions, bigger displays, more HDR, fast smoother motion, wider FOVs, all amplifying to make refresh rate limitations even more visible). In an extreme case, quad-digit is not enough, and requires quintuple-digit Hz to finish whacking the moles to successfully pass a Holodeck Turing Test, as explained in Blur Busters Law: The Amazing Journey To Future 1000 Hz Displays.

Strobing is a great humankind workaround to fix display motion blur, with pros/cons. For now, today's technology needs motion blur reduction technologies for now. This will continue to exist for the next few decades. Real life doesn't strobe (flicker). To emulate real life (no added blur, no stroboscopics) requires analog framerateless motion. To emulate analog motion with a refresh rate is to use ultra-high refresh rates as a strobeless blur reduction. Then there's no motion blur added by the display above-and-beyond human vision. We will witness a long progress of refresh rate increases in this refresh rate race. 4K used to cost 5-figures. Now it's a $499 Walmart special. In 50 years from now, 1000Hz may even be a cheap addition to all displays. But the journey towards there will be fun (and more expensive). The refresh rate race to retina refresh rates is why Blur Busters exists.

[Kosti]

Thank you very much for your detailed answer Chief!

Of course i was reading through the whole thread as i mentioned before but using motion blur reduction in practice makes me realize how complex the topic can get.
First i thought that you meant that i wouldn't benefit from motion blur reduction because i'm primarily a first person shooter player. Now, 90 minutes later after just playing with motion blur reduction some call of duty i went back and turned PureXP off again. The difference was then very clear to me and the motion blur without PureXP annoyed me. It's definitely something to get used to, at least for me.

A question regarding my mouse:
I have a Finalmouse Ultralight 2 which runs at 500 Hz. I could overclock it to 1000 Hz but then i'm afraid of damaging the mouse (which you can't buy anymore) in the long run. Do you or others have any experience with this?
I always set my mice to 1600 dpi which is enough i think?
Mouse feet are clean.
Is my mouse pad high resolution? Never thought about that but i'm using a SteelSeries QcK which i think is fine (?).
I have difficulty answering the fifth question. I never thought about that and i tried ingame to look directly at my crosshair which made me blind to the rest of the image. I don't believe you meant it that way. When i'm running around in a shooter i obviously scan the screen for enemies and then moving the crosshair above the target but i do that instinctively. It's more like getting the enemy in the middle of the screen (where obviously the crosshair is) instead of looking directly at my crosshair alone.

Thanks again for all the suggestions and tips!

[Chief Blur Buster]

A question regarding my mouse:
I have a Finalmouse Ultralight 2 which runs at 500 Hz. I could overclock it to 1000 Hz but then i'm afraid of damaging the mouse (which you can't buy anymore) in the long run. Do you or others have any experience with this?
I always set my mice to 1600 dpi which is enough i think?

1000 Hz poll rate won't damage your mouse. Not sure how well Finalmouse will work with 1000 Hz though.

One problem is that monitor refresh rates are starting to approach display refresh rates. This amplifies harmonic / beat-frequency microstuttering effects between poll Hz / internal sensor Hz versus the refresh rate. This is normally not a problem in most cases, but sometimes it becomes human visible, especially for VSYNC ON motion situations:

From the Blur Busters Mouse Guide...



The Vicious Cycle Effect will eventually force mouse manufacturers to seriously consider 2000 Hz and 4000 Hz mice officially, especially if future 360 Hz and 480 Hz monitors start creating beat frequencies not seen before (e.g. 480Hz MOD 500Hz = 20 microstutters per second).

Now, the internal sensor readout rate may be much higher -- e.g. 6000 Hz internally -- which will allow a bit of more flexibility in 500 Hz polls. However, as seen in these photos -- it is quite blatantly clear that mouse Hz can be a microstuttering limiting factor, especially during fps=Hz motion (Windows, VSYNC ON, RTSS Scanline Sync, RTSS microsecond-accurate framerate cap, etc) where beat frequencies can emerge between mouse Hz and display Hz. This is not always visible -- especially for non-strobed motion -- but again, lack of motion blur amplifies the visibility of microstuttering.

Now, people have a favourite mouse that they are used to, and they are used to their DPI. If you're already using 1600dpi then it should look OK with strobing. Not sure how accurate your sensor is at 1600dpi, though.

Mouse feet are clean.
Is my mouse pad high resolution? Never thought about that but i'm using a SteelSeries QcK which i think is fine (?).

Should be fine. Methinks. Many surfaces are not very good high-resolution surfaces, like a glossy desk or a regular-patterned pad that can create mouse jittering errors (inaccurate tracking).

I have difficulty answering the fifth question. I never thought about that and i tried ingame to look directly at my crosshair which made me blind to the rest of the image. I don't believe you meant it that way. When i'm running around in a shooter i obviously scan the screen for enemies and then moving the crosshair above the target but i do that instinctively.

The reason I ask is some professional esports players use peripheral vision to pay attention to enemies (part of reason why they prefer smaller monitors + lower resolutions) and "turn into view" to aim at the enemies. Spending most of their time staring at stationary gaze at crosshairs, and using turning/strafing to scroll enemies to the center.

Not every champion player does this, but there are players who does it. It's human-dependent on how they train their FPS gaming tactics.

Sometimes quick glances away from the crosshairs, but usually fixed-gaze majority of the time.

It would be neat to have eye-tracking surveys of different professionals playing different games. NVIDIA should probably commission something like that!

Thanks again for all the suggestions and tips!

You are welcome!

[h4lli]

Hey Chief

really appreciate all your work and love my xg270 the more the longer i have it.. but.. there is one thing that really annoys me.. the menu joystick.. that think is driving me crazy

at least there is elite display controller (EDC) to calm down my nerves ..however, i miss 2 settings in EDC: "Overclocking" and "Color Saturation".. at least for the latter it would be awesome if it could be included in any future update.

Any chance that you could give Viewsonic a hint?

[Chief Blur Buster]

really appreciate all your work and love my xg270 the more the longer i have it.. but.. there is one thing that really annoys me.. the menu joystick.. that think is driving me crazy

What's the most annoying thing about it?

One thing that I do is Setup Menu -> OSD Background -> On because the menu is somewhat too translucent for my liking. Everyone's preference is different.

It makes it easier for me to see the current joystick selection, too, and I always remember that the leftmost button is the BACK (exit) button. The joysticks on earlier ViewSonic monitors were more fiddly.

[h4lli]

it is just one thing that me me nuts.. navigation through the menu is fine with the joystick.. but clicking/selecting is awful with that thing.. the button is quite press and most of the time i end up accidentally going up/down/left or right before i get that button pressed down.. or up

[Chief Blur Buster]

it is just one thing that me me nuts.. navigation through the menu is fine with the joystick.. but clicking/selecting is awful with that thing.. the button is quite press and most of the time i end up accidentally going up/down/left or right before i get that button pressed down.. or up

Noted, I will relay that along to ViewSonic for future models -- to suggest that push-inward selection be made less fiddly.

One trick is to put two fingers on the joystick since it's a very light-touch joystick. It really helps stabilize selection presses.