G-Sync - Laggy at <55fps, same for you ???

[flood]

hm yea that's definitely an issue

i know that if the framebuffer is not updated at all, the mouse position is still refreshed at 30fps. actually i'm not sure how gsync handles things when fps drops below 30, but perhaps they should change the number 30 to 60.

[Hel1011]

How does a mouse polling rate effect this? I thought if mouse had a 1000hz polling rate it was being updated 1000 times a second but it seems here its only being updated at the monitors refresh rate

[RealNC]

How does a mouse polling rate effect this? I thought if mouse had a 1000hz polling rate it was being updated 1000 times a second but it seems here its only being updated at the monitors refresh rate

1000Hz polling rate means that the USB driver is refreshing the mouse data 1000 times per second, so that when the game actually asks for that data, the data will be as fresh as possible (at most 1ms in the past.)

Has nothing to do with displaying a mouse cursor. We obviously don't have 1000Hz monitors. If the mouse cursor is rendered at 30FPS on screen, it's going to stutter, regardless of polling rate, since 30FPS is just a stuttery framerate. There's nothing that can be done about it.

[Hel1011]

So I guess there is no solution possible for mouse stuttering with low frame rates and gsync unless somehow they could figure out how to still update the mouse at 144hz even when the refresh rate of the monitor falls below 60 when using gsync

[flood]

well the cursor can only be drawn when the screen is refreshed... so idk how that'd be possible.

imo ultimately it's the game dev's fault for not designing with a higher fps target in mind.

[MrBrown]

So I guess there is no solution possible for mouse stuttering with low frame rates and gsync unless somehow they could figure out how to still update the mouse at 144hz even when the refresh rate of the monitor falls below 60 when using gsync

yep theres no solution for this, because if the game runs at 60 fps with g-sync you will only see 60 frames per second- even if your mouse polling is 2000 Hz. Which visibly makes your mouse cursor stutter, given that you see a new frame every 16ms. Its basically how it is right now on native 60fps monitors- the mouse cursor feels and looks stuttery just because of the long refresh rate with 60 hz monitors.

V-Sync and Nosync at 144 hz are technically showing 144 frames per second even if the game runs at lower framerates, thats why tearing and object stuttering was visible. The only positive thing about it really was that the mouse cursor was drawn at 144fps no matter what the game fps was. This is not possible with gsync due to its nature to only show as many fps as the game can handle.

So much to all the ppl who have no clue and like to jump into discussions with their "but 30 fps looks fluid to the human eye, why would we need more in games..."

[RealNC]

There is a solution for this, but it's up to nvidia to implement it. When the maximum G-Sync frequency is equal of less than the monitor's maximum frequency, then g-sync should display the same frame twice every time, doubling the frequency.

For example, in a 144Hz monitor, if you set "72Hz doubled" as the G-Sync mode (obviously it doesn't exist right now), then games that render at 30FPS will have a 60Hz mouse cursor.

It could also be possible to do this every time without having to manually configure anything. For example, if the framerate falls below 60FPS, then g-sync could use frame doubling anyway. But there's problems because of quick framerate fluctuations, which means that this approach would increase input lag if g-sync is currently displaying a the second duplicate frame but the GPU has a new frame ready which now needs to wait (so you're in a v-sync situation.) So this can only work reliably when using a g-sync max freq that's below the max monitor freq.

[MrBrown]

doubling the frames would introduce input lag that could be higher than having vsync on so it wouldnt really make much sense. PLus it wouldnt help with overall stuttery look of the game even if the 30fps are all doubled to make it a fake 60fps. And then at fake 60fps, the mouse cursor will still be stuttery, cause its 60fps... sure it would be less stuttery than at 30fps but 60fps is still pretty bad for the mouse cursor..

The thing is very simple- noone should aim for 60fps in games or even lower. It renders the whole purpose of 144 hz monitors useless.

Having fps over 70-80 fps should be enough to not have problems with stuttery mouse pointer any more.

[Haste]

The thing is very simple- noone should aim for 60fps in games or even lower. It renders the whole purpose of 144 hz monitors useless.

I wish more people would understand that!

[RealNC]

doubling the frames would introduce input lag that could be higher than having vsync on so it wouldnt really make much sense. PLus it wouldnt help with overall stuttery look of the game even if the 30fps are all doubled to make it a fake 60fps. And then at fake 60fps, the mouse cursor will still be stuttery, cause its 60fps... sure it would be less stuttery than at 30fps but 60fps is still pretty bad for the mouse cursor..

Absolutely not. 60FPS is very smooth for the cursor. I have a 60Hz monitor. It is perfectly smooth.

Also, input lag is NOT increased at all. If the game runs at 30FPS, you get exactly the same input lag when running at 30Hz or 60Hz. There is zero difference. And I mean literally zero, as in 0.0ms.

There is also no double-image effect, since with g-sync you cannot have backlight strobing.

The end effect of running 30FPS doubled to 60Hz is *exactly* the same as running 30FPS on a 60Hz non-gsync monitor with vsync enabled, minus the vsync input lag, and you still get the benefit of variable refresh rate, since the game can fluctuate anywhere between 30 and 70FPS, which is translated to 60-140Hz hardware mouse cursor motion.

It would be the perfect solution for games that run with extremely low frame rates all the time and use a mouse cursor.