Which currently eliminates blur better? CRT Beam Simulator or the updated Pulsar 60hz Strobe?

[sodaboy581]

For anyone who has tried both, especially for retro gaming, which of the two between a CRT Beam Simulator running at 240hz+ and NVIDIA Pulsar with 60hz strobe looks better to you with motion?

I understand the CRT Beam Simulator probably also needs an OLED monitor to look its best, but how does it fare with a rapid or fast IPS monitor?

Thanks for any input!

[Discorz]

I tried neither, but can confirm 60Hz ULMB 2 wins the clarity battle.

[RealNC]

I don't have a Pulsar, but I can't see how it could be better than Pulsar at 240Hz. It's not fast enough. Maybe 480Hz gets closer since there's 8 faster subframes on the screen compared to 4 slower ones.

[edgintheledge]

Pulsar for sure. I think once you get to very high hz LCD starts to become the bottleneck for CRT sim, but even top of the line OLEDs wouldn't get you <1ms persistence. iirc the lowest persistence settings on the 60hz mode are targeting ~0.5ms which would need 2000hz to do in software, and that's assuming you had a screen that could get bright enough to give you a usable image at that low persistence.

Also don't know if it's changed, but I lag tested the very first version of shader beam with an LDAT style lag tester and found it was adding ~50ms of lag. Pulsar 60hz mode adds ~10ms under the same test. (Both of those figures are in comparison to a theoretical perfect 60hz or 8.33 ms lag measured at the middle of the screen.) If you are very picky about latency and used to high hz vrr, stepping down to 60hz and then adding 10ms on top of that could be noticeably laggy (~20ms increase from 360hz vrr with no strobing on a 60hz signal compared to pulsar's 60hz strobe)

[kyube]

For anyone who has tried both, especially for retro gaming, which of the two between a CRT Beam Simulator running at 240hz+ and NVIDIA Pulsar with 60hz strobe looks better to you with motion?

I understand the CRT Beam Simulator probably also needs an OLED monitor to look its best, but how does it fare with a rapid or fast IPS monitor?

Thanks for any input!

The CRT beam simulator is limited to the refreshtime, which is a inverse of the refresh rate, at best.
This implies that you can only achieve a MPRT (misnomer) / strobe 'on' period of 4,1667 – 2,083333 ms at best.

To put that into perspective, a CRT can do 0,1 – 0,5 ms in comparison.

The 60Hz ULMB2 mode on the Pulsar models would slot between them. (I don't know the exact values)

This means the following:
On this test: https://testufo.com/ghosting
Only the CRT would be perfectly clear @ 3840 px/s
Pulsar @ 60Hz ULMB2 is supposedly clear @ 2880 px/s (on PWM=10 or PWM=20, but I'm not sure)
"CRT beam simulator" is only clear at 240 px/s – 480 px/s

However, I strongly suggest that you completely avoid 60Hz backlight strobing due to the severe eye strain it causes, regardless of rolling scan, discrete rolling scan or global scan.

Get a KTC M27P6 (~0,7ms strobe 'on' period) for the much higher pixel density experience at a relatively bearable refresh rate target (120-160Hz)
Use LSFG or some form of frame interpolation to alleviate the aliasing-like effect of the game's FPS & Refresh rate mismatch.

[brownvim]

I have tried both, Pulsar looks better.

No eye strain in my experience of using it for mutiple hours a day.

[purplemelon1]

For anyone who has tried both, especially for retro gaming, which of the two between a CRT Beam Simulator running at 240hz+ and NVIDIA Pulsar with 60hz strobe looks better to you with motion?

I understand the CRT Beam Simulator probably also needs an OLED monitor to look its best, but how does it fare with a rapid or fast IPS monitor?

Thanks for any input!

The CRT beam simulator is limited to the refreshtime, which is a inverse of the refresh rate, at best.
This implies that you can only achieve a MPRT (misnomer) / strobe 'on' period of 4,1667 – 2,083333 ms at best.

To put that into perspective, a CRT can do 0,1 – 0,5 ms in comparison.

The 60Hz ULMB2 mode on the Pulsar models would slot between them. (I don't know the exact values)

This means the following:
On this test: https://testufo.com/ghosting
Only the CRT would be perfectly clear @ 3840 px/s
Pulsar @ 60Hz ULMB2 is supposedly clear @ 2880 px/s (on PWM=10 or PWM=20, but I'm not sure)
"CRT beam simulator" is only clear at 240 px/s – 480 px/s

However, I strongly suggest that you completely avoid 60Hz backlight strobing due to the severe eye strain it causes, regardless of rolling scan, discrete rolling scan or global scan.

Get a KTC M27P6 (~0,7ms strobe 'on' period) for the much higher pixel density experience at a relatively bearable refresh rate target (120-160Hz)
Use LSFG or some form of frame interpolation to alleviate the aliasing-like effect of the game's FPS & Refresh rate mismatch.

Kyube whats the source on KTC M27P6. Tim at nmonitors unboxed review said theirs wasn't adjustable. Is it a hidden setting again where you have to manually lowe the brightness. Although i believe he said he couldn't adjust brightness in his review.

To brownim. That really puts it into perspective. The beam sim is almost invisible aside the artifacts when issues happen.

[kyube]

Kyube whats the source on KTC M27P6. Tim at nmonitors unboxed review said theirs wasn't adjustable. Is it a hidden setting again where you have to manually lowe the brightness. Although i believe he said he couldn't adjust brightness in his review.

It is adjustable, according to TFTcentral.
I'm basing the data on their review, along with chimolog's review

Be mindful that Tim from MUB has (seemingly) on-purposely mislead users with the testUFO pursuit he has done comparing the 144-160Hz MiniLED panels.


My assumption is that this above is 960 px/s, but I don't know.
The EX3210 is from totallydubbedHD
HUB used the 1080p 320Hz UFO for the 4k160Hz photograph of the 274UPDF E16M in his video... I don't know why.
This image above is one I've cobbled together myself, which should be a correct representation of each panel's capabilities.

I haven't seen a strobing implementation as good as on the KTC M27P6 in the 27–32" 4K segment (no KSF; either QD or YAG) thus far.

[brownvim]

To brownim. That really puts it into perspective. The beam sim is almost invisible aside the artifacts when issues happen.

If NVIDIA ever implemented this in a 4K monitor, I would buy it straight away. I genuinely think it’s currently the best way to play 60hz games if you care about motion clarity. There’s virtually no crosstalk, great brightness, and the image quality is as good as anything available right now — in some ways even better than my old FW900 CRT I used strictly for console use.

That said, there are still a couple of areas that could be improved. The input lag in the 60 Hz ULMB2 mode is a bit higher than I’d like, and HDR performance is quite limited due to the IPS panel’s contrast and lack of local dimming. I hope in a future iteration they can address both of these, even if HDR is complex to do well on this type of panel.

[purplemelon1]

Kyube whats the source on KTC M27P6. Tim at nmonitors unboxed review said theirs wasn't adjustable. Is it a hidden setting again where you have to manually lowe the brightness. Although i believe he said he couldn't adjust brightness in his review.

It is adjustable, according to TFTcentral.
I'm basing the data on their review, along with chimolog's review

Be mindful that Tim from MUB has (seemingly) on-purposely mislead users with the testUFO pursuit he has done comparing the 144-160Hz MiniLED panels.


My assumption is that this above is 960 px/s, but I don't know.
The EX3210 is from totallydubbedHD
HUB used the 1080p 320Hz UFO for the 4k160Hz photograph of the 274UPDF E16M in his video... I don't know why.
This image above is one I've cobbled together myself, which should be a correct representation of each panel's capabilities.

I haven't seen a strobing implementation as good as on the KTC M27P6 in the 27–32" 4K segment (no KSF; either QD or YAG) thus far.

Thanks for this.

Regarding the serious accusation. It seems more like an honest mistake. Their video editor only started pc gaming 2 years ago or so. He may not understand that aspect of monitors. I'd imagine Tim would check every video. He probably doesn't deeply check it. Each video is probably only making like 80 usd. So realistically how much time can he really spend on each video. I don't know if you've seen the comments on his videos. His viewership isn't going to have the skills to spot that either.

To brownim. Acer Predator XB323QX. 5k 144hz pulsar. display